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Old Jan 11, 2026 | 08:47 PM
  #8461  
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Originally Posted by SW17LS
I don't think it was that the lost $6B, it was that stepping back from EVs was going to cost them $6B...
how has gm stepped back? not saying they haven't, i just don't know. i know ford though, dropped the lightning (ouch).
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Old Jan 12, 2026 | 05:47 AM
  #8462  
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Originally Posted by bitkahuna
how has gm stepped back? not saying they haven't, i just don't know. i know ford though, dropped the lightning (ouch).
Its a writedown, basically an accounting adjustment that shows the value of those assets or programs is no longer what they previously reported.

https://www.reuters.com/business/aut...ck-2026-01-08/

DETROIT, Jan 8 (Reuters) - General Motors (GM.N), opens new tab said on Thursday it would take a $6 billion charge to unwind some electric-vehicle investments, the latest car company to pull back from EVs in response to the Trump administration's policies and fading demand.
The charge stems from reducing its planned EV production and the fallout on the supply chain, GM said in a regulatory filing, and comes weeks after rival Ford Motor (F.N), opens new tab announced a similar but much bigger charge.

Most of GM's writedown - a $4.2 billion cash charge - is related to contract cancellations and settlements with suppliers, who had planned for much higher production volumes before the market turned.
GM said the writedown would not affect its U.S. lineup of roughly a dozen EV models, which is the industry’s broadest offering of battery-powered vehicles. “We plan to continue to make these models available to consumers,” it said in its filing.
The company will record the charge as a special item in its fourth-quarter earnings report. It expects to incur additional charges in 2026 as a result of negotiations with its supply base, but expects them to be less than its 2025 EV charges.

Shares fell 2% in after-hours trading. They ended the regular session on Thursday up 3.9% at $85.13.

GM PLACED A BIG BET ON EVs
Many automakers, including GM’s crosstown rival, Ford, have been dialing back factory work on EVs since last summer, when U.S. President Donald Trump’s massive tax and spending package darkened the outlook for the EV market. Sales of battery-powered vehicles have cratered following the elimination on September 30 of a $7,500 federal tax credit for EV buyers.

Ford in December said it would take a $19.5 billion writedown over several quarters as it canceled several EV programs, including the fully electric version of its F-150 Lightning truck and an additional electric truck and van.
GM, the largest U.S. automaker by sales, made one of the biggest bets on EVs among global automakers, at one point vowing to essentially phase out internal-combustion cars and trucks by 2035.

While the company has not publicly walked back the 2035 goal, analysts have sharply cut the industry’s EV sales forecast into the next decade for the U.S., GM’s largest and most profitable market. GM CEO Mary Barra has said the company will respond to customer demand.

GM’s EV sales had started gaining traction in late 2024 after years of manufacturing setbacks. The company rolled out more lower-cost offerings, helping it reach No. 2 in sales behind Tesla (TSLA.O), opens new tab.
The company also said on Thursday that it would record a $1.1 billion charge in the fourth quarter related to its ongoing restructuring of its China joint venture.
The automaker began writing down some EV-related investments last year, including a $1.6 billion third-quarter charge. This month, GM halted production of EV batteries at two joint-venture plants for six months and cut production to one shift at an EV-only factory in Detroit.
The company also pivoted away from plans for another Michigan factory that was slated to build EVs, and instead will build the Cadillac Escalade and full-size pickups, it has said.
GM gained U.S. market share in 2025 on the strength of its gas-powered large pickups and SUVs, and its EVs, but some analysts have questioned the automaker's decision to focus on fully electric vehicles instead of hybrids.
"GM’s lack of hybrid exposure could partially reverse recent market share gains," CFRA equity analyst Garrett Nelson said in a research note on Thursday, citing the surging popularity of hybrid vehicles.

GM’s EV sales had started gaining traction in late 2024 after years of manufacturing setbacks. The company rolled out more lower-cost offerings, helping it reach No. 2 in sales behind Tesla (TSLA.O), opens new tab.
The company also said on Thursday that it would record a $1.1 billion charge in the fourth quarter related to its ongoing restructuring of its China joint venture.
The automaker began writing down some EV-related investments last year, including a $1.6 billion third-quarter charge. This month, GM halted production of EV batteries at two joint-venture plants for six months and cut production to one shift at an EV-only factory in Detroit.
The company also pivoted away from plans for another Michigan factory that was slated to build EVs, and instead will build the Cadillac Escalade and full-size pickups, it has said.
GM gained U.S. market share in 2025 on the strength of its gas-powered large pickups and SUVs, and its EVs, but some analysts have questioned the automaker's decision to focus on fully electric vehicles instead of hybrids.
"GM’s lack of hybrid exposure could partially reverse recent market share gains," CFRA equity analyst Garrett Nelson said in a research note on Thursday, citing the surging popularity of hybrid vehicles.
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Old Jan 13, 2026 | 02:55 AM
  #8463  
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Had to get a recall service done, so I got some seat time in a few newer models. Seen/Ridden In/Driven them before, but I was able to take them out and really test them in several different conditions for myself. Fun way to blow time while waiting. Got a few random thoughts about them.

First was a dual motor Y. It was as good as I remembered. Very smooth and responsive, and it offers a lot of room considering the size. Didn't drive the standard, but I did sit in one on the showroom floor. The basic seats are very good. I was surprised how comfortable they were. The only issue is that there are no seat controls, so I had to cram myself into it and use the screen to adjust the seats. Manually would have been better for me, but I see how electric screen-only makes it better if you have multiple drivers that can use profiles and get their seat settings back every time. Really liked the headliner instead of the exposed glass room. Would prefer that on my S or just about any automobile.

Next was the new Model S non-plaid. Frost blue metallic with white interior. That color looks better than expected it person. Liked it but probably wouldn't buy it. I was surprised how quick the base model is. My plaid is definitely a lot quicker, but the base S is still very quick. I didn't drive it too hard because I know they are watching, but I was impressed. It had the wheel instead of the yoke, and it was ok. Does block the center screen more, but I could live with it. Still prefer the yoke. If I bought a new one, I would pay to get the yoke. It did ride a little better than mine, but not so much that I would have thought there was a suspension redesign. Probably would have chalked it up to just being a lot newer car. I just got new tires on mine, and the difference wasn't as much as I expected. Overall, felt like a same car I have, just fewer miles. Not sure it is a $100k in non-Plaid config, but still very good.

Last was the Cybertruck. For a truck, I liked it, but it's not for me. It was a dual motor and felt slow, although my perspective is a little skewed due to daily driving the plaid. Cyberbeast would likely fix that. Not as much room on the inside as expected. Steering is crazy. Had to pay extra attention to prevent turning in too sharp. Still feels big, but definitely not as big as it is. The steering wheel/yoke felt too small. Almost like a video game controller. And the dash looks like it extends for 6 feet. Just feels like there is a lot of wasted space. Seats were comfortable and it would be on my list if I want a commuter than would occasionally do truck things, but it's not really for me now.

Anyway, those are my thoughts. Overall, I like the lineup. A little something for almost everyone.
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Old Jan 13, 2026 | 07:52 AM
  #8464  
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Originally Posted by Bob04
Had to get a recall service done, so I got some seat time in a few newer models. Seen/Ridden In/Driven them before, but I was able to take them out and really test them in several different conditions for myself. Fun way to blow time while waiting. Got a few random thoughts about them.

First was a dual motor Y. It was as good as I remembered. Very smooth and responsive, and it offers a lot of room considering the size. Didn't drive the standard, but I did sit in one on the showroom floor. The basic seats are very good. I was surprised how comfortable they were. The only issue is that there are no seat controls, so I had to cram myself into it and use the screen to adjust the seats. Manually would have been better for me, but I see how electric screen-only makes it better if you have multiple drivers that can use profiles and get their seat settings back every time. Really liked the headliner instead of the exposed glass room. Would prefer that on my S or just about any automobile.

Next was the new Model S non-plaid. Frost blue metallic with white interior. That color looks better than expected it person. Liked it but probably wouldn't buy it. I was surprised how quick the base model is. My plaid is definitely a lot quicker, but the base S is still very quick. I didn't drive it too hard because I know they are watching, but I was impressed. It had the wheel instead of the yoke, and it was ok. Does block the center screen more, but I could live with it. Still prefer the yoke. If I bought a new one, I would pay to get the yoke. It did ride a little better than mine, but not so much that I would have thought there was a suspension redesign. Probably would have chalked it up to just being a lot newer car. I just got new tires on mine, and the difference wasn't as much as I expected. Overall, felt like a same car I have, just fewer miles. Not sure it is a $100k in non-Plaid config, but still very good.

Last was the Cybertruck. For a truck, I liked it, but it's not for me. It was a dual motor and felt slow, although my perspective is a little skewed due to daily driving the plaid. Cyberbeast would likely fix that. Not as much room on the inside as expected. Steering is crazy. Had to pay extra attention to prevent turning in too sharp. Still feels big, but definitely not as big as it is. The steering wheel/yoke felt too small. Almost like a video game controller. And the dash looks like it extends for 6 feet. Just feels like there is a lot of wasted space. Seats were comfortable and it would be on my list if I want a commuter than would occasionally do truck things, but it's not really for me now.

Anyway, those are my thoughts. Overall, I like the lineup. A little something for almost everyone.
Great review, pretty much my experience. Great appliances 👍
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Old Jan 13, 2026 | 07:15 PM
  #8465  
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Originally Posted by AMIRZA786
Great review, pretty much my experience. Great appliances 👍
I have to disagree. Appliances are boring, period.
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Old Jan 13, 2026 | 07:21 PM
  #8466  
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Originally Posted by Hameed
I have to disagree. Appliances are boring, period.
You have a Model S, so a bit less of. The Model Y is the absolute definition of an appliance for the road. It's almost perfect!
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Old Jan 13, 2026 | 08:17 PM
  #8467  
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Originally Posted by Hameed
I have to disagree. Appliances are boring, period.
hard to say. my model 3 is nothing exciting but i like it, same with my appliances.

i really don't mind calling my tesla 3 an appliance. i do think it is more or less one -- it just does a lot more than my toaster. the key is i don't think it's a bad thing at all. for car enthusiasts who want the real driving experience, tesla is a terrible idea. however to achieve daily needs, it's incredibly good. to me, that's the beauty of it
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Old Jan 13, 2026 | 08:53 PM
  #8468  
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What is a real driving experience?
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Old Jan 14, 2026 | 04:02 AM
  #8469  
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Couple of other random things I forgot.

The edges on the Cybertruck are sharp and look very unforgiving to fingers.
Diamond black also has a little too much diamond in it.. To the point that I thought it was dusty before wiping and realizing it was the sparkle in the paint. Prefer the old flat black.
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Old Jan 14, 2026 | 05:41 AM
  #8470  
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Originally Posted by rominl
hard to say. my model 3 is nothing exciting but i like it, same with my appliances.

i really don't mind calling my tesla 3 an appliance. i do think it is more or less one -- it just does a lot more than my toaster. the key is i don't think it's a bad thing at all. for car enthusiasts who want the real driving experience, tesla is a terrible idea. however to achieve daily needs, it's incredibly good. to me, that's the beauty of it
A Tesla fails the full appliance definition:
  • It still requires active judgment and situational awareness
  • It operates in uncontrolled environments (roads, weather, traffic)
  • It carries high safety and legal responsibility
  • Owners often exhibit strong emotional attachment
  • It remains a status and identity object
A refrigerator never kills someone if misused. A car—Tesla included—can.

My S, the latest S LR, the new Y LR I've driven felt exciting, very responsive and fun to drive. Definitely not in anyway appliance like. Do they have gears and make noise, ofcourse not. I couldn't care less about that. I want instant torque, silent speed and not want to go to gas stations. I don't care about taking a car to a track. You need deep pockets for that and I would rather spend my money on other things.

Once the cars become fully autonomous - the "appliance" definition will be more closer to reality.
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Old Jan 14, 2026 | 06:38 AM
  #8471  
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Originally Posted by Hameed
A Tesla fails the full appliance definition:
  • It still requires active judgment and situational awareness
  • It operates in uncontrolled environments (roads, weather, traffic)
  • It carries high safety and legal responsibility
  • Owners often exhibit strong emotional attachment
  • It remains a status and identity object
Why are some owners so defensive of anyone's opinion that differs from theirs, regarding anything Tesla?



^ That defines our Y to a tee. Yes, it's also fun to drive at times, but that doesn't make it any less a capable appliance.
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Old Jan 14, 2026 | 07:02 AM
  #8472  
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Originally Posted by Mike728;12017521[i
]Why are some owners so defensive of anyone's opinion that differs from theirs, regarding anything Tesla?



^ That defines our Y to a tee. Yes, it's also fun to drive at times, but that doesn't make it any less a capable appliance.
Lol

Amirza stated his opinion that he considers Teslas to be appliances. I said that I don't consider my S to be an appliance.

You stated yours is an appliance. And now I'm being defensive? 😄

And we're all talking about Teslas......too funny

Last edited by Hameed; Jan 14, 2026 at 07:24 AM.
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Old Jan 14, 2026 | 08:17 AM
  #8473  
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Haha glad I stayed out of that one . Model 3 and Y are appliances, maybe not like a fridge, but an appliance none the less. So is a Camry and RAV4, except Tesla's have a fun factor built in when it comes to straight line performance. They are funner to drive, and technically superior. Drive better, and are more efficient. And are excellent daily commuters. BTW writing this while commuting to work

Model S I wouldn't consider an appliance, it's more a sports/luxury vehicle that has a special place in my heart
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Old Jan 14, 2026 | 08:59 AM
  #8474  
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Originally Posted by Hameed
Lol

Amirza stated his opinion that he considers Teslas to be appliances. I said that I don't consider my S to be an appliance.
No, that's not what you wrote. You claimed that appliances were boring (period).

No one was putting your S in the appliance category. Also, all are not boring. Some smart appliances are very cool, like our Y.
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Old Jan 14, 2026 | 09:19 AM
  #8475  
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I don't (yet) have a Tesla, a situation I will likely remedy soon, but I don't consider them to be appliances at all. I find them to be the very opposite of dull, utilitarian and boring.
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