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Absolutely true. But the IS would most likely still be running strong after 200K, original head gasket, valves, and cylinders and trans if it was properly maintained. There are guys in the 2nd gen forum at 300K, everything original except the usual maint items, still running great. The IS's flame may not burn as bright, but it burns longer
EDIT
Stock 2nd Gen IS is around 286-287 at the wheels @6400 RPM
Oh hell yeah. No question about that at all, my 02 430 still tied it's factory 1/4 mile time at 220k before I tuned it and cut .2 sec off. No way in hell a BMW will make it that long lol!
Yup, I don't like bringing tuning into the equation. I could supercharge the IS 350, and then what? It'd be 400+ horsepower at the wheels. But then, I could put a larger turbo on the Bimmer... it never ends. And I am sure the BMW's stock power is pretty much 250-260 wheel horsepower, which honestly is very close to the Lexus's wheel horsepower.
Regarding gear ratios, I have that, too.
The Lexus has taller ratios until you get to 5th gear. 4th and 5th are similarly close-ratio as the ZF's 3rd and 4th. Once you get up to highway speeds the Lexus and BMW are closer since the Lexus is going to stay in the power band a lot better. However, I think the BMW is still overall quicker. Not by much, but yes. And it'll definitely feel quicker due to the low-end grunt.
edit: And the above doesn't actually factor in the wheel size! Thankfully the two cars have very similar overall tire diameter.
Oh yeah, all true. The Lexus actually would have the edge if given a turbo, an NA engine that receives FI always beats a factory forced induction option since they were already competitive stock. Think LT1 or 5.0 vs a B58 Supra.....a very fair fight, until you add FI to the former options. It quickly becomes insanely unfair for the B58 even with uprated turbos. Even the 4.0 German stuff doesn't have much chance vs US large cube FI engines. Just a totally different game....
Car and Driver recorded similar numbers, with the IS350 accelerating faster to and beyond 100mph.
Really to me that just speaks to how much turbos help with the low-down acceleration. Around town the 330i would be quicker while you're moving especially. But, if you notice the 5-60 MPH rolling start time, where the IS 350 manages a still-decent 5.9 seconds versus the Bimmer's 6.7. If you have the boost available, the BMW will really scoot. I felt the same way about the VWs. Thing was, they were even lighter, and highly limited by front-wheel-drive traction. I bet that on the highway they'd actually keep up with something like an IS 350 thanks to their lower weight.
I think handling is really what I like about these cars anyway. Neither is a rocket ship, but both really feel nice in the bends. The Lexus gives me more confidence though because its steering just feels a little more natural.
Car and Driver recorded similar numbers, with the IS350 accelerating faster to and beyond 100mph.
As expected, I'm actually considering getting rid of my 4.0 A8 for a 6.3 W12 since while I would lose .1-.3 0-60 stock I would gain a LOT past 100 mph due to how it delivers power vs a turbo engine. VAST out of Michigan also has a tune to delimit and raise output to 600 crank vs 550 stock, makes them into 200+ mph cars. According to owners I've talked to with the VAST tune you can expect 3.5-3.7 0-60 and sub 7 second 0-100.
0-60 is fun but I'm willing to trade a little for the insanity of 200+ and far easier 150+, turbos are fun with the mid and low end punch but just don't have the same emotion and excitement up top as large NA engines for me.
As above I'm also souring to how nose heavy my A8 is, it's not as good in the corners as the 460 since while it's grip levels are high it will plow once you go past the limit. The Lexus yaws and plays with you nicely in a way the AWD car just doesn't. I don't feel like I'm going to loose the car when I'm partially sideways, it just gives me intangibles that the German doesn't deliver. That's the best way I can put it, hard to describe unless you drive them back to back.
Last edited by Striker223; Jul 26, 2022 at 05:13 PM.
Just got back from test driving the 06 LS and making sure it's all good, I'm still astounded every time I drive it. Unreal quality and silence and it doesn't appear to shift at all on up shifts. Truly some of the best built cars ever.
Totally blows my Audi away for comfort, ride isolation, wind isolation, and utter silence. Won't even bring build quality into it.....
Same, I usually drive the truck and I love it. But LS430 is still more special, if not by that much. It drives heavenly, and I know exactly what you mean about the upshifting. It likes to hover around 1900-2300 RPM and that's all it needs. The way the power delivery is so linear with the shifting, it's almost like a CVT minus all of the awfulness. It's slow by today's luxury car standards but certainly quick enough. It's a joy to exercise that V8 out. Your post made me want to take some pics but it started raining, however I did that this pic at the liquor store. Look at the panel gaps to start. Also the car is so tall yet, please all LS430 owners take note:
LS430 is such a tall car but it is crazy low to the ground, your sitting position. LS430 drivers, notice how much lower you are than people in more modern sedans. Look at this pic I took, of how much higher the belt line is in this newish E-Class: (Also notice the headliner how high quality, and the wood still gleams. That's real mesh over the speaker there, in my LX it's cheap-by-comparison plastic.). LS430 is a very low to the ground car. Mine needs a very very expensive interior detail and front bumper respray but I just haven't gotten around to it, otherwise everything is perfect.
Really to me that just speaks to how much turbos help with the low-down acceleration. Around town the 330i would be quicker while you're moving especially. But, if you notice the 5-60 MPH rolling start time, where the IS 350 manages a still-decent 5.9 seconds versus the Bimmer's 6.7. If you have the boost available, the BMW will really scoot. I felt the same way about the VWs. Thing was, they were even lighter, and highly limited by front-wheel-drive traction. I bet that on the highway they'd actually keep up with something like an IS 350 thanks to their lower weight.
I think handling is really what I like about these cars anyway. Neither is a rocket ship, but both really feel nice in the bends. The Lexus gives me more confidence though because its steering just feels a little more natural.
Totally agree. I've thoroughly enjoyed the B46 in the loaner cars I've had, it's sprightliness around town is great in traffic.
Originally Posted by Striker223
As expected, I'm actually considering getting rid of my 4.0 A8 for a 6.3 W12 since while I would lose .1-.3 0-60 stock I would gain a LOT past 100 mph due to how it delivers power vs a turbo engine. VAST out of Michigan also has a tune to delimit and raise output to 600 crank vs 550 stock, makes them into 200+ mph cars. According to owners I've talked to with the VAST tune you can expect 3.5-3.7 0-60 and sub 7 second 0-100.
0-60 is fun but I'm willing to trade a little for the insanity of 200+ and far easier 150+, turbos are fun with the mid and low end punch but just don't have the same emotion and excitement up top as large NA engines for me.
As above I'm also souring to how nose heavy my A8 is, it's not as good in the corners as the 460 since while it's grip levels are high it will plow once you go past the limit. The Lexus yaws and plays with you nicely in a way the AWD car just doesn't. I don't feel like I'm going to loose the car when I'm partially sideways, it just gives me intangibles that the German doesn't deliver. That's the best way I can put it, hard to describe unless you drive them back to back.
Interesting. The LS460s I've driven did not seem to enjoy being pushed, I can't imagine ever taking them to the limit. The most playful large cars I've driven are the Maserati Quattroporte and Jaguar XJ, but those ride more on the firm side and fail at the ultimate luxury experience. Plus since you like modding so much they would probably not be the best platform to play with.
Interesting. The LS460s I've driven did not seem to enjoy being pushed, I can't imagine ever taking them to the limit. The most playful large cars I've driven are the Maserati Quattroporte and Jaguar XJ, but those ride more on the firm side and fail at the ultimate luxury experience. Plus since you like modding so much they would probably not be the best platform to play with.
My LS430 was smooth, quiet and comfortable, but the handling was little short of horrific with a ton of understeer. My XJ was wasn't as comfortable, but it handled very well.
Interesting. The LS460s I've driven did not seem to enjoy being pushed, I can't imagine ever taking them to the limit. The most playful large cars I've driven are the Maserati Quattroporte and Jaguar XJ, but those ride more on the firm side and fail at the ultimate luxury experience. Plus since you like modding so much they would probably not be the best platform to play with.
They like being pushed way more than an LS430, but not a sport sedan by any means.
The 4.0/4.6 engines are way better at speed than any of the 6s, that's a fact.
Perhaps you can share BSFC figures to back that claim?
Originally Posted by Striker223
That's what they get, and sorry but no. The 4.0/4.6 engines are way better at speed than any of the 6s, that's a fact. The 450h is heavier than a 350, and has a CVT plus a less effective engine with the hybrid system out of the picture. You also also forgetting aero differences at speed and lockup of the 8 speed trans being far superior to the CVT or early 6 speed V6 cars. All of those differences start giving an edge to the high end cars at speed.
At those speeds I'm at 2800 rpm vs 4000 for a 6...
No SoC change (read: no power going out of the battery). Outside temp 29C, AC set to 24.
4000rpm is around 125kw sustained power output. This car does not generally see >2000rpm during steady state cruising on the highway, unless traffic allows for such speed and I'm in the hilly section.
are you comparing similar cars? What I find interesting is gle350 has worse mpg than X5 40i.
BMWs are excellent when it comes to fuel efficiency I've found. Mercedes almost always lags behind them with their gas engines. Their cars are frequently heavier too.
It'd be 400+ horsepower at the wheels. But then, I could put a larger turbo on the Bimmer... it never ends. And I am sure the BMW's stock power is pretty much 250-260 wheel horsepower, which honestly is very close to the Lexus's wheel horsepower.
