hyundai genesis (merged threads)
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Just as cushy as what? The Genesis? No. I've driven a 2008 528i with no sport package and the ride was still significantly different (less refined, much less isolated, and much more direct/sporty) than the genesis.
I've also driven a GS350 and an LS430 and I'd equate the driving experience much closer to those cars.
In comparing the way the actual cars drive the Genesis is closest to the cars I listed earlier. I'm basing this on having actually driven them.
If you're saying that it will take more buyers away from the brands you perceive as more tier-2 or at least less badge-focused then I agree with you for the time being, but remember Lexus at one point was a nobody with their brand and after producing the knock out 1990 LS400 the Lexus name really started changing in the way people perceived it.
Will that happen with the Genesis? Possibly, though ultimately probably not. But again, go actually drive one and try to not pay attention to the badge - just to the car itself.
No offense intended but I think you in particular are going to have a very hard time with that as badge-focused as you seem to be. For example every other post I read of yours is 100% anti-Acura. Sure Acura isn't doing the greatest at the moment but you've dug your claws into hating that brand as a whole and won't let go. If you have already decided that Hyundai is a brand you don't like then you're never going to be able to judge the Genesis without the badge.
I understand you're no different from many people though... so I'm not saying lots of other people won't be stuck on the Hyundai name. I'm just saying drive it with an open mind and compare it to a 3rd gen GS or LS and let me know if you don't feel the similarity in the way they drive and the dissimilarity from almost anything made in Germany.
I've also driven a GS350 and an LS430 and I'd equate the driving experience much closer to those cars.
In comparing the way the actual cars drive the Genesis is closest to the cars I listed earlier. I'm basing this on having actually driven them.
If you're saying that it will take more buyers away from the brands you perceive as more tier-2 or at least less badge-focused then I agree with you for the time being, but remember Lexus at one point was a nobody with their brand and after producing the knock out 1990 LS400 the Lexus name really started changing in the way people perceived it.
Will that happen with the Genesis? Possibly, though ultimately probably not. But again, go actually drive one and try to not pay attention to the badge - just to the car itself.
No offense intended but I think you in particular are going to have a very hard time with that as badge-focused as you seem to be. For example every other post I read of yours is 100% anti-Acura. Sure Acura isn't doing the greatest at the moment but you've dug your claws into hating that brand as a whole and won't let go. If you have already decided that Hyundai is a brand you don't like then you're never going to be able to judge the Genesis without the badge.
I understand you're no different from many people though... so I'm not saying lots of other people won't be stuck on the Hyundai name. I'm just saying drive it with an open mind and compare it to a 3rd gen GS or LS and let me know if you don't feel the similarity in the way they drive and the dissimilarity from almost anything made in Germany.
With Lexus its still different as the Genesis does not have a new badge to flaunt, while LExus did, which did help perception. Surely if the LS was sold here as a Toyota Celsior, it would not have been nearly as successful.
Since you want to assume things, clearly you didn't read ANY of my multiple posts in this thread and others supporting the Genesis, I think its superb. So maybe you should read before jumping to conclusions..
As for Acura, not sure why you want to bring it up in a HYUNDAI thread but nope I am not fond of the brand at all, the Acura I knew died in the 1990s. Its amazing some people act like they are some holy internet Saint and don't like anything and try to call people out on disliking something. I have no issues saying Acura is Tier 83 for all I care and those that know me in person have heard me say the same thing. Hyundai> Acura
Bottom line your post has no merit as I've stated I LIKE THE GENESIS A LOT.
Let me help you;
Nice chops!! Weight is pretty damn good for a big car, 3750 with the V-6 and 4000 with the V-8, which is lighter than the GS/5/E etc....which are smaller...
Brakes are a tad small on the V-6, 13" on the V-8. It has dimensions of the old LS 430 to give you an idea of size.
Rear tails remind me of the old Infiniti I30/I35.
Brakes are a tad small on the V-6, 13" on the V-8. It has dimensions of the old LS 430 to give you an idea of size.
Rear tails remind me of the old Infiniti I30/I35.
Some luxury brands should take their badges off b/c this car embarrasses entire LINEUPS, not just cars.
Seriously, I now take some of them even less serious, knowing the specs of this car. A Hyundai owner can brag more on their car than some entire luxury brands. That is hilarious.
Seriously, I now take some of them even less serious, knowing the specs of this car. A Hyundai owner can brag more on their car than some entire luxury brands. That is hilarious.
So since Acura is really a 3rd tier brand at this point and that is proven even more so as HYUNDAI has a V-8 and RWD and a 6 speed auto, well, advantage Hyundai.
I would rock the Genesis before any Acura. Believe that. I am IMPRESSED with this car.
Looking at how Hyundai management is today, they basically took a page out of Toyotas book and sit and watch and take notes. They have improved so much its not even funny, from laughing stock to solid competition.
Seriously, lets compare the FLAGSHIP RL to this. In 15 years, Acura can't figure out what to do.
Hyundai comes out the blue with this.
I would rock the Genesis before any Acura. Believe that. I am IMPRESSED with this car.
Looking at how Hyundai management is today, they basically took a page out of Toyotas book and sit and watch and take notes. They have improved so much its not even funny, from laughing stock to solid competition.
Seriously, lets compare the FLAGSHIP RL to this. In 15 years, Acura can't figure out what to do.
Hyundai comes out the blue with this.
I like how this man thinks.
I think a luxury brand would have helped it but do yall know how much MONEY and RESOURCES that would have taken?
One of the reasons Mazda dropped their "Amati" aspirations in the 1990s was escalating costs.
I also feel the luxury market is just over saturated now. Some luxury brands are faltering, some are selling but are average and even the big dogs are fighting more intensely. Its hard to find a bad or poor luxury vehicle today.
This being a Hyundai, may be an advantage some.
I think a luxury brand would have helped it but do yall know how much MONEY and RESOURCES that would have taken?
One of the reasons Mazda dropped their "Amati" aspirations in the 1990s was escalating costs.
I also feel the luxury market is just over saturated now. Some luxury brands are faltering, some are selling but are average and even the big dogs are fighting more intensely. Its hard to find a bad or poor luxury vehicle today.
This being a Hyundai, may be an advantage some.
I have to say the major advantage IMO, on paper for the ES, is, well its a Lexus.The badge. The Genesis seems to have it beat.
I prefer RWD to FWD anyday and we are talking a V-8 with 100 more hp than the V-6 ES.
I am sure there will not be an ES exodus to the GEnesis but I am sure a few buyers who are not concerned about image will choose it.
I prefer RWD to FWD anyday and we are talking a V-8 with 100 more hp than the V-6 ES.
I am sure there will not be an ES exodus to the GEnesis but I am sure a few buyers who are not concerned about image will choose it.
Im tired......
Lexus Champion
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 3,474
Likes: 2
From: Tennessee
OK if you like the car and are able to see past the badge then why are you saying it will only compete with Tier 2 and Tier 3 premium brands? I'm not saying it won't... I'm just looking for your reasoning.
As far as the Acura thing goes... it's just apparent that you love to hate them and have your mind made up on then based on the name Acura (and Honda). I was hoping you didn't do the same thing for the Hyundai name. But no I didn't read the entire thread. To be honest I've lacked the desire to post in here recently but when I was passing through the forum and saw the genesis thread I figured I'd at least post my experiences from test driving one.
As far as the Acura thing goes... it's just apparent that you love to hate them and have your mind made up on then based on the name Acura (and Honda). I was hoping you didn't do the same thing for the Hyundai name. But no I didn't read the entire thread. To be honest I've lacked the desire to post in here recently but when I was passing through the forum and saw the genesis thread I figured I'd at least post my experiences from test driving one.
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OK if you like the car and are able to see past the badge then why are you saying it will only compete with Tier 2 and Tier 3 premium brands? I'm not saying it won't... I'm just looking for your reasoning.
As far as the Acura thing goes... it's just apparent that you love to hate them and have your mind made up on then based on the name Acura (and Honda). I was hoping you didn't do the same thing for the Hyundai name. But no I didn't read the entire thread. To be honest I've lacked the desire to post in here recently but when I was passing through the forum and saw the genesis thread I figured I'd at least post my experiences from test driving one.
As far as the Acura thing goes... it's just apparent that you love to hate them and have your mind made up on then based on the name Acura (and Honda). I was hoping you didn't do the same thing for the Hyundai name. But no I didn't read the entire thread. To be honest I've lacked the desire to post in here recently but when I was passing through the forum and saw the genesis thread I figured I'd at least post my experiences from test driving one.
I never said people will not buy a Genesis over a Lex/BMW/Benz, what I am saying is people will be more apt to buy a Genesis over an Acura/Infiniti/Saab/Lincoln/Volvo etc b/c they have less badge presence so owning a "Hyundai" isn't that much of a downgrade.
We both can agree that many thousands of people buy a BMW/Benz/Lexus b/c of badge, they don't care about the price, the features, the HP, they just want that car.
Others in the segment have to really prove their worth and value over the status quo. The more expensive the product, the more this holds true.
As for Acura, did you see another one of their blah blah blah articles
https://www.clublexus.com/forums/sho...d.php?t=373139
they truly are lost. And I just found out some top secret info that involves Clublexus and Acura, more to come VERY soon
If it looks like tier 1, feels like a teir 1, and drives like a teir 1, then it must be tier 1
Had the Genesis belonged to BMW, Lexus, or Mercedes, dealers wouldn't be able to keep it on the lot. But because it wears a Hyundai badge, it wont be considered 'tier 1', which I think is nonsense BS. I would happily save thousands of dollars if it meant I had to drive around with a Hyundai name. I think it's pathetic that a car cannot be considered 'high-end' just because it doesn't bear the luxury nameplate, even if its loaded with luxury gizmos and gadgets. But then again, if everyone bought the car for what it is, then Lexus/BMW/Mercedes would be bankrupt by now
Had the Genesis belonged to BMW, Lexus, or Mercedes, dealers wouldn't be able to keep it on the lot. But because it wears a Hyundai badge, it wont be considered 'tier 1', which I think is nonsense BS. I would happily save thousands of dollars if it meant I had to drive around with a Hyundai name. I think it's pathetic that a car cannot be considered 'high-end' just because it doesn't bear the luxury nameplate, even if its loaded with luxury gizmos and gadgets. But then again, if everyone bought the car for what it is, then Lexus/BMW/Mercedes would be bankrupt by now
Lexus Champion
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 3,407
Likes: 1
From: Texas
If it looks like tier 1, feels like a teir 1, and drives like a teir 1, then it must be tier 1
Had the Genesis belonged to BMW, Lexus, or Mercedes, dealers wouldn't be able to keep it on the lot. But because it wears a Hyundai badge, it wont be considered 'tier 1', which I think is nonsense BS. I would happily save thousands of dollars if it meant I had to drive around with a Hyundai name. I think it's pathetic that a car cannot be considered 'high-end' just because it doesn't bear the luxury nameplate, even if its loaded with luxury gizmos and gadgets. But then again, if everyone bought the car for what it is, then Lexus/BMW/Mercedes would be bankrupt by now
Had the Genesis belonged to BMW, Lexus, or Mercedes, dealers wouldn't be able to keep it on the lot. But because it wears a Hyundai badge, it wont be considered 'tier 1', which I think is nonsense BS. I would happily save thousands of dollars if it meant I had to drive around with a Hyundai name. I think it's pathetic that a car cannot be considered 'high-end' just because it doesn't bear the luxury nameplate, even if its loaded with luxury gizmos and gadgets. But then again, if everyone bought the car for what it is, then Lexus/BMW/Mercedes would be bankrupt by now
Imagine the learning curve Hyundai dealers are going though.
Lexus made it's name from it's incredible value BUT primarily because of the outstanding customer service AND reliability.
BMW & Mercedes have yet to match this level of customer satisfaction...how do you think Hyundai is going to fair?
My opinion? It's a great car if you are comparing feature to feature, but still needs to match service and reliability.
Lexus Fanatic
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 7,864
Likes: 0
From: Massachusetts
If it looks like tier 1, feels like a teir 1, and drives like a teir 1, then it must be tier 1
Had the Genesis belonged to BMW, Lexus, or Mercedes, dealers wouldn't be able to keep it on the lot. But because it wears a Hyundai badge, it wont be considered 'tier 1', which I think is nonsense BS. I would happily save thousands of dollars if it meant I had to drive around with a Hyundai name. I think it's pathetic that a car cannot be considered 'high-end' just because it doesn't bear the luxury nameplate, even if its loaded with luxury gizmos and gadgets. But then again, if everyone bought the car for what it is, then Lexus/BMW/Mercedes would be bankrupt by now
Had the Genesis belonged to BMW, Lexus, or Mercedes, dealers wouldn't be able to keep it on the lot. But because it wears a Hyundai badge, it wont be considered 'tier 1', which I think is nonsense BS. I would happily save thousands of dollars if it meant I had to drive around with a Hyundai name. I think it's pathetic that a car cannot be considered 'high-end' just because it doesn't bear the luxury nameplate, even if its loaded with luxury gizmos and gadgets. But then again, if everyone bought the car for what it is, then Lexus/BMW/Mercedes would be bankrupt by now
). Only one "H" badge in the back identifies this car as a Hyundai.
If it looks like tier 1, feels like a teir 1, and drives like a teir 1, then it must be tier 1
Had the Genesis belonged to BMW, Lexus, or Mercedes, dealers wouldn't be able to keep it on the lot. But because it wears a Hyundai badge, it wont be considered 'tier 1', which I think is nonsense BS. I would happily save thousands of dollars if it meant I had to drive around with a Hyundai name. I think it's pathetic that a car cannot be considered 'high-end' just because it doesn't bear the luxury nameplate, even if its loaded with luxury gizmos and gadgets. But then again, if everyone bought the car for what it is, then Lexus/BMW/Mercedes would be bankrupt by now
Had the Genesis belonged to BMW, Lexus, or Mercedes, dealers wouldn't be able to keep it on the lot. But because it wears a Hyundai badge, it wont be considered 'tier 1', which I think is nonsense BS. I would happily save thousands of dollars if it meant I had to drive around with a Hyundai name. I think it's pathetic that a car cannot be considered 'high-end' just because it doesn't bear the luxury nameplate, even if its loaded with luxury gizmos and gadgets. But then again, if everyone bought the car for what it is, then Lexus/BMW/Mercedes would be bankrupt by now
Service is HUGE when it comes to the luxury car business. You can't be tier 1 without having tier 1 service.
On paper the car is great (can't say as for on the road as I haven't seen it in person and haven't test driven one) and it's definitely a great deal but it's not the epic win of the century. The LS came out as luxury vehicle under a new nameplate and new dealers. The Genesis has a lot of interest in it right now but things like service will steer some completely away. It's a great first attempt and I think if Hyundai makes or exceeds their sales goals than they should head into a luxury division and start training people to sell and service ONLY luxury vehicles.
Lexus Champion
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 3,474
Likes: 2
From: Tennessee
Threxx, like what 1SickGoat said, you assume things way too easily without really knowing about these Genesis cars. You said you have test driven the V6 version, and not the V8. What makes you think both will handle exactly the same? There is more to it than just engine difference. Hyundai isn't stupid to simply add a bigger engine and do nothing on the suspension/spring tuning.
Hyundai isn't stupid to simply add a bigger engine and do nothing on the suspension/spring tuning.Any review I've read so far also states they couldn't tell much difference.
http://www.canadiandriver.com/testdr...ai-genesis.php
Originally Posted by Canadian Driver
I had the opportunity to drive both V6 and V8 versions of the Genesis on the winding roads north of Santa Barbara, California and on an improvised slalom at Buttonwillow racetrack. With its rear-wheel drive layout, four-wheel independent multi-link suspension and fairly balanced front to rear weight distribution (V6 52/48; V8 54/46), the Genesis handles switchbacks and decreasing radius turns with ease and balance - the suspension includes shock absorbers that automatically adapt to rougher roads for improved control and ride comfort. Both traction control and stability control (ESC) are standard on the Genesis, and the ESC can be turned off if desired. I didn't find much difference in ride or handling between the V6 and V8 models.
Originally Posted by meowcat
Also the brakes are much more powerful than the V6 version. Also you didn't even mention about the wheel/tire size on the V6. Most of the V6 version models (depending on the options) come with little 17" wheels with FAT *** tires (similar to ones like from Lincoln Towncar), DUH, that's why you felt the ride was more isolated, and not directly responsive when you steer. It's obvious.
If the Genesis V8 brakes are larger it may improve pedal feel (which wasn't really bad, per se, on the V6 anyway) but it's doubtful that it will improve stopping distance, which is at this level dependent far more on total weight, weight distrubution, suspension travel, and most of all tires. It's not like I tested out the 60-0 stopping anyway... it was a brand new car.
Even MORE importantly, don't go around and dictate what the Hyundai Genesis is simply by driving ONE V6 version of the Genesis.
This is another attitude problem you have.. it's been like that the whole time. This is why, I don't ever go by your posts.
In case you forgot...
https://www.clublexus.com/forums/sho...=351201&page=4
I haven't been posting on this board much... that was only 3 threads ago for me, so while it has been a month, it seems you can't help but reply in an aggressive/attacking way.
Another recommendation, I know you like to argue...and you seem extremely defensive.
Arguing with moderators I'm afraid you will not last much long here.
Take your own advice from the last thread we replied to each other and stop replying to me.
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Posts: n/a
Guys lets be clear, there is nothing wrong with debating with me or another moderator, once its about a subject. What is not approved of is arguing with a moderators decision in public or attacking moderators in public but we don't allow that with members either.
There is an ignore button if you just can't seem to agree on anything
There is an ignore button if you just can't seem to agree on anything
Guys lets be clear, there is nothing wrong with debating with me or another moderator, once its about a subject. What is not approved of is arguing with a moderators decision in public or attacking moderators in public but we don't allow that with members either.
There is an ignore button if you just can't seem to agree on anything
There is an ignore button if you just can't seem to agree on anything
Obviously kidding Mike. Please don't ban me!
On a more serious note though, Mike has strong points. We can all disagree upon the car but let's not start a bash about personal opinions.
I love ClubLexus because of the diversity of backgrounds and opinions people have. We're all very much alike in the end. I love that CL is almost a onestopshop for car info. I've seen other forums and just from what goes on in those forums I've never even signed up for them. CL Pride!
Talk about scary 
Not to go completely off topic...but I know the GS 300 Sport Designs had a different suspension from other 300 models. Was this setup shared with the 430, or different from both?
. Perhaps they figured that most of the owners wont track their cars, so they'd never find out.
Supposedly only the sport design models had stiffer shocks. All the rest of the lineup shared the same suspension. In fact, the 2nd gen GS shares the same springs in the front as the IS300 and SC430. And you wonder why they got never got the handling down . Perhaps they figured that most of the owners wont track their cars, so they'd never find out.
. Perhaps they figured that most of the owners wont track their cars, so they'd never find out.Sooo back to the Genesis, folks. lol. PS, mike, that picture you posted above of the "VIP" looking one is god awful.
They do need to get rid of those tacky chrome bumper protectors. I hate seeing that crap on cars. Okay so it might be cheaper to replace the bumper protectors rather than respraying your bumper but they still look ugly.