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Christmas in June, wooo!
My 3rd mid-pipe showed up. PPE H-pipe with high flow cats and resonators.
First let me say the guys at PPE are pleasant to work with.
The quality of the pipes and welds were top notch.
One hiccup was that I requested them to include new crush gaskets but none was sent..
Installed with one issue. The right side pipe still had clearance issues and was rubbing on the oe middle chassis brace’s bolt.
Had to grind the bolt head down half way to gain the 1/8” clearance needed. Sigh...
was hoping the PPE one would fit better. That’s the kind of issues I had with the previous ARH one.
Good thing is it’s all fixed now. No more grinding noises.
My feed back on PPE mid pipe:
1. The low to mid range torque definitely is better than the ARH one.
I contribute that to the back pressure/pipe size difference.
PPE is 2.5”. ARH was 3” all the way, hence the clearance issues.
2. The PPE one has a much lower tone, more muscle car like; due to H configuration I’m guessing.
I actually liked the ARH one better... It sounds more exotic, with a higher pitch tone.
3. The sound volume definitely is lower now due to having cats vs no cats on ARH one.
Oh well. It’s a more “mature” sound. Haha.
i have a h pip design that comes on the apexi. I prefer the H pipe design on this car. I had the x pipe style with my JOEZ and i had headers with both. the x pipe is way to raspy and i think the x pipe is scavenging too much exhaust gasses
i have a h pip design that comes on the apexi. I prefer the H pipe design on this car. I had the x pipe style with my JOEZ and i had headers with both. the x pipe is way to raspy and i think the x pipe is scavenging too much exhaust gasses
Ryan, thanks for input bro.
I got so many compliments on the new exhaust sound yesterday while at Road Atlanta. I haven’t had this many people say something since I removed my meisterschaft x pipe.
The ARH x pipe definitely didn’t get as many compliments although I personally liked it the best. It was big time raspy on the street in lower rpm, but on track it was awesome. Really high pitched screams that reminisce F1 car sounds.
Strange thing I noticed yesterday after being on track with my ppe H pipe.
My RR oil catch can were not nearly as full as previous track sessions.
I only got like half the amount compare to when I had the X pipes.
Didn’t think exhaust design would effect the EGR system and change the blow by that much.
A nice surprise though!
Made plans to get my Rennen rims refinished. Kinda tired of the red now. Going to change just the lip and barrel to gloss black. Spokes will stay the same.
After I took all the hardware off, it was all in one small box and felt pretty heavy. Now I’m wanting to get Ti hardware to replace the original ones. Anyone have a lead to where to buy? Haven’t started searching yet.
you will probably need something close to m8x30-35... that's gonna get pricey at $15 a pop... but hopefully you can get some bulk discounts going for the 160 range.
Well...the Cup2s didn’t really hold up. Killed fronts in 2800 miles/3 track days/180 min on track. That was an expensive experiment.
My last set of tires were Yokohama AD08R which lasted me almost 14 months and like 12-15 track days.
Still not positive what exactly made the tires fail... Thinking rough track surface, plus hot weather, plus super hard braking with high negative camber was what did it.
Road Atlanta is a fast track that’s hard on brakes and tires.
The inside edge was all scrubbed off on one tire plus some “chunking” where the tread blocks were torn off.
It may look like an alignment issue. It’s not. The specs are right on. -2.8 camber with almost zero toe.
^^^
sup bro? Been a min. Hope the GSF treating you well.
Typically psi coming off track at 36, may be 38 if I push it.
I start em at 28-30 and adjust as the first session goes based on how car feels.
Yeah I heard they like a tad lower psi too because they weren’t gripping like I was expecting/hoping. Was gonna shoot for 34 hot next time. Oh well...
Tested temp with pyrometer too.
Inside usually 170 max. Typically 160.
Outside is like 140-150.
That’s right on so I don’t think I cooked them. Not sure why tires look like that.
"What pressure should I use for track driving with Michelin track-focussed tyres (e.g. MICHELIN Pilot Sport Cup 2)?
For a track day, always begin with inflation pressures recommended for ROAD USE, gradually bring the MICHELIN PILOT SPORT CUP 2 tyres up to temperature with steady moderate laps.
- After a run of some steady laps, then only slightly adjust, the inflation pressure to reach the best operating inflating pressure HOT TYRES
- The best operating pressure of MICHELIN PILOT SPORT CUP 2 is between 2.3 bar (33 psi) and 2.7 bar (39 psi) hot, according vehicle model and track where used
- However, some vehicle models will need a higher inflating pressure than 2.7 bar (39 psi Hot)
COLD TYRES
- Don’t ever use inflation pressure below 1.9 bar (28 psi) cold
- To optimize the track longevity of MICHELIN PILOT SPORT CUP 2, MICHELIN strongly recommends to use a minimum inflation pressure between 2.0 (29 psi) and 2.4 bar (35 psi)
CAUTION
- Regularly check the aspect of external sidewalls: If you notice any level of wear to the sidewalls (erasure of the sidewalls markings) that could mean that Inflation/operating pressures are TOO LOW . So, re-set at least to +0.2 bar (+ 3 psi) minimum to increase the grip and maximize the track longevity of your tyres
- After a track day
Before leaving the track to drive on the road again: once tyres have cooled, re-set to car manufacturer inflation pressure recommendations."
Teutonic
Thank you. I’ve actually read all that before. Those are very generalized rules that most veteran track guys know inherently.
Other than me starting the tires at 28 one time, everything I’ve done is pretty much what it says. The other two days I started at 30 and 32.
They recommend starting higher than 28 is bacause it helps preserve side wall rigidity when cold. I take like 3 laps to warm up without pushing the car so I know the sidewalks weren’t stressed.
Side wall failure is typically on the outside. My issues were on the inside. It’s not due to over driving the car on the side walls plowing corners.
You have to understand I’m in Ga and most track days are in 85+ degrees to start. The tires heat up very fast. Last time at Road Atlanta, it was like mid 90s and we ran right after spec MX5 peeps got off track so the track was already warm.
When I first got the Cups and didn’t know exactly what pressure to set to get the grip I wanted, I would pit every 3-4 laps to check the tire pressure since I don’t have tpms on the track rims.
Anyhow, just wanted you to know that the failure isn’t due to over inflating. The very first time out I did hit 40 psi but I corrected that after 1/2 of first session. The tire has never gone over 38-39 since. Typically I kept it at 35-36 hot.
Michelin recommend max peak at 39, and with the weight of our cars, it needs to be on the high side of the range so the car don’t squirm in high G. Imo 35-36 was correct.
I was actually wanting to run them at like 33-34 next time but...
For me, the cups got greasier feeling faster at 36-37 psi. I was constantly correcting around sweepers...way more so than with the Yokohamas.
New Toyo R888R went on today. Will see how they feel. Next track day is Wednesday so I’ll know soon how they stack up.
Ming---I'm curious what you find out especially considering that you said the alignment is fine. Have you always been running -2.8 camber? Are you running spaces or a radically different offset? Good luck on Wednesday!
Teu,
camber has been 2.8 for like the last year. For slower tracks with less straights it’s perfect. For Road atlanta, which is a faster track-meaning turns are less curvy-the high camber does make the tires ride on the inside more. That’s why I thought Road Atlanta was the reason why I scrubbed through the tires. I should change the camber between tracks but that’s not easy to do with the way the T-demand uca is set up. The Figs ones are better but i haven’t been wanting to buy another set.
No spacers.
The advan rims have +35 offset all around.
Just to give a tire update.
The R888R went on (square set up 275/35/19) and back on track I go.
These tires have been the best tires I’ve ran on the F so far.
Grip was slightly better than the Cup2. Not head and shoulders above but definitely more.
I think the largest car behavior difference was that I ran the Cup2 at staggered 275/285 while the R888R were square.
Much less tread squirm than the Cup2 (each session ended with around 140-150 degrees on the inside and 150-160 on the outside on a 90 degree day.)
The limit was very predictable. When it wanted to let loose, it would be progressive so corrections could be made sooner.
Overall I am happier with these tires than I did with the Cup2 on the first outing. Time will tell if they hold up better and how they feel as the tire heat cycle more.
Lastly, if anyone thinking about using these daily...pretty noisy but doable.
06-23-18, 08:24 AM
