DaveGS4

iTrader: (2)

Reminder from request above
and let's knock off the baiting comments as well.

Lex2InfiN

Not biased against Hyundai, but I have seen some surveys where they were below average in reliability and it was fairly recent. Which is why I said "barely average". If they were matching Acura in reliability and offering RWD luxury sedans and matching their mpg claims, believe me, I would be praising them. Perhaps they will improve, but I just don't think their cars are as good as they look.

yowps3

Hyundai's are on the flimsier side no doubt. The sheet metal and materials used aren't substantial and solid. And also they don't have first class panel gaps and assembly quality, an area where Lexus has always been the king.

hlee12

i examined the new genesis carefully and i thought it was well built. flimsy would be an inappropriate word for this genesis. not sure about other hyundai's.

and i would rank audi over lexus in terms of overall build quality. lexus is the reliability king, but to me audi always has been the build quality king.

yowps3

I've yet to see the new Grnesis in person. But yeah I'm talking about all the other hyundai models

audi has better build quality than Lexus? You kidding right?

Audi's build quality is so bad that I can slide my entire hand into the hood gap!

SW17LS

All the modern Audis I've seen have excellent build quality...

LexBob2

Same here.

MPLexus301

iTrader: (3)

Audi is hit and miss, in my experience. Models like the A7, A8 and R8 are impeccably built, but you look at the Q5, A6 or A4, and especially the A3, and you're going to find some cheaper, shiny plastics and hollow feeling panels in the lower part of the doors and dash. I don't fault Audi for this because it's become the norm in the industry, but somehow Audi continues to get a pass for it and still earns a reputation for first-rate interiors.

I do think Audi does a very nice job with initial presentation and visual appeal - beautiful woods and stitching, well placed lighting and nice contouring. But in my experience, once you start to run your hands over different pieces and panels, and really gauge the thickness, grain and quality of some of the materials, there cars are no better than Lexus or some of the newer Mercedes, and in some instances, worse.

SW17LS

Build quality and material quality are two different things. I agree that from the A6 down there are some cheap feeling materials, but everything is put together and finished very well.

Lexus is no different. The GS has nicer materials than the A6 I agree, but the ES, IS, RX, GX, CT have some downright terribly cheap interior materials...that are also assembled very well.

MPLexus301

iTrader: (3)

^Good point about material quality vs. build quality

Hoovey689

iTrader: (16)

Someone frame this and get this guy a beer

rominl

iTrader: (4)

brilliant post very well put on separating build vs material

now i would really like to see that. any pics? not saying it's impossible, just think it will be good to see

hlee12

totally agree. IMO honda also has a great build quality. even if their material quality is down, they know how to put the car together..

if audi a6 is 9.7/10 in build quality, i would say this genesis is 8.5/10 ish. i really thought it was well built. material would be 7.5/10 ish. there were very nice materials, and some not so nice materials. but overall presentation didn't feel like there were drastic cost cutting like the previous gen. it looked and felt like 45-50k car.

mmarshall

I'll agree with most of that (and, yes, it's a good post). But Audi, specially with the A6/A7 and A8, wrote the book on how to use attractive materials inside.

Carmaker1

Wow, it is quite unfortunate that some of us cannot be more objective here. I may not be the biggest Lexus fan, but at the same time I have great respect for and interest in what Lexus has done for the Japanese automotive industry and also the industry as a whole. Hyundai's DH Genesis from what I've seen (and felt) of it in person is not a poor quality effort, but a very good one in its category.

The problem Hyundai has is a general lack of innovation and massive stand-out appeal to its competitors, not necessarily "atrocious quality". The LS400 possibly may have not been as great of a success story, if Mercedes-Benz had successfully launched the W140 in late 1989 as planned (ahead of '91 recession) and BMW made more substantial updates for the E32 mid-cycle in 1990 (some were scrapped for E38 project, initially scheduled for 1993). We'll never know, as Lexus caught the German automakers with their pants down and nearly obliterated British and American luxury automakers.

Constructive criticism should be the main focus here, not directionless and superficial derision. I cannot say how many times I've seen between various new model launches, copycat accusations or baseless derision gathered from limited knowledge and access against the target of such opinions. I hope what I've said here isn't too off-topic.