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I know bit had a decent experience with his rental 3 but most of the time I'm traveling it's for work and I don't have time to find a charger before getting to the airport. The overpriced gas station at the airport highway exit is my best friend.
Yeah I just don’t see the appeal unless I could charge it where im staying while I sleep.
Taycan refresh should be announced pretty soon. Kyle from Out of Spec recorded a charging test that Porsche and EA had setup and the charging curve is even better than the current Taycan which is already one of the best charging cars out there. Whether the infrastructure will actually be able to support it is another question
Here's one I watched last night. Awesome redesign!👍
Just wondering because before you said all you see where you live are Teslas, but now there are tons of Taycans. Taycans are not all $250k either, they start at $90,000.
Constantly defending EVs to you is exhausting. Of course if Hertz is selling their EVs they’re going to cancel the ones they have on order. EVs don’t make great rental cars, it was an experiment that didn’t work out well.
"The experiment that didn't work well" that you're brushing off, cost/lost a lottttttttttttt of money that I really don't think they were anticipating losing. You're acting like it was just some teeny little misstep.
And what do you want to pick apart every thing I say? There are Taycans here but way more Teslas, sure. And they're all plugged in over night in garages. Go to the non rich part of town and count EVs.
Oh, and please find me a brand new Taycan for $90k in my area..... I'll definitely wait. Cheapest one I can find at the dealer is $155k.
Summary: Ford's EV business unit lost almost $1.6 billion in Q4 and lost $4.7 billion in 2023.
Opinion: Ford continues to flounder in their EV business and blames it on the cost of EV's being too high compared to ICE vehicles. Meanwhile, the base price of a Mach E Mustang is within $500 of the base price of a Model Y (Mach E being cheaper). And this is current - the base model Y price used to be higher. Seems to me Ford is not making EV's that enough people want to buy, regardless of price.
DETROIT — Ford Motor is rethinking its electric vehicle strategies, including “reassessing” the need for vertical integration of batteries, CEO Jim Farley said Tuesday.
The Detroit automaker previously confirmed plans to delay or cut $12 billion in spending on all-electric vehicles, but the comments made Tuesday are the most detailed about Ford’s changing plans for EVs, sales of which are growing at a slower-than-expected rate.
“One of the things we’re taking advantage of in taking some timing delays is rationalizing the level and timing of our battery capacity to match demand and actually reassessing the vertical integration that we’re relying on, and betting on new chemistries and capacities,” Farley said during the automaker’s fourth-quarter earnings call.
Farley reiterated the company still believes EVs will grow, but noted widespread adoption for mass-market consumers won’t happen until the costs are more in line with traditional vehicles. EVs are typically thousands of dollars more expensive than their gas-powered counterparts.
Ford Chief Financial Officer John Lawler said in addition to reassessing the vertical integration in new battery chemistries, the company is further looking into adjusting installed production capacity to match demand and potentially delaying next-generation EVs to “to ensure they meet our criteria for profitability, given the new market reality.”
The company’s EV business, known as Model e, lost $4.7 billion last year, including $1.57 billion during the fourth quarter of 2023, offset by profits in the company’s fleet and traditional internal combustion engine units. Both businesses earned more than $7 billion each last year.
Lawler said Tuesday that the unit will have to stand on its own “sooner rather than later.”
He also said the company is pulling a target for its EV unit that called for 8% margin by 2026. The company had already set a target of two million vehicles sold annually by that time.
As Ford pulls back and reevaluates the EV business, it intends to lean in on sales of hybrid vehicles, specifically trucks. The company expects its hybrid sales to increase 40% this year. It sold 133,743 hybrid vehicles in the U.S. in 2023.
Every word in this article is more confirmation that the demand everyone thought there would be just isn't there. Numbers to back it up. Big numbers.
Teslas will always sell like hotcakes, I think they are niche vehicles. It's just not happening like they thought except for Tesla. Ya'll can put me up in a cross like you do, it's nothing personal toward anyone.
Every word in this article is more confirmation that the demand everyone thought there would be just isn't there. Numbers to back it up. Big numbers.
Teslas will always sell like hotcakes, I think they are niche vehicles. It's just not happening like they thought except for Tesla. Ya'll can put me up in a cross like you do, it's nothing personal toward anyone.
I think what you are saying is correct, but the reason Tesla is so successful is they can 1) sell EV's for low prices and make profit 2) they have a reliable massive charging infrastructure and 3) they have service centers everywhere. Other car companies can't match this. Demand is there, only Tesla can meet it, keep pricing low, and offer value around it's brand.
Tesla sells more Model Y than RAV4, Corolla and Camry, which means it's not a niche product. If you see them everywhere, then they are not niche
Lastly, it's one hundred percent a mis step for the rental companies, they made no planning when purchasing EV'S. They just did it thinking they were going to attract a bunch of Uber and Lyft drivers, most who had no experience with EVs. That's the experiment that backfired
Last edited by AMIRZA786; Feb 7, 2024 at 09:03 AM.
I think what you are saying is correct, but the reason Tesla is so successful is they can 1) sell EV's for low prices and make profit 2) they have a reliable massive charging infrastructure and 3) they have service centers everywhere. Other car companies can't match this. Demand is there, only Tesla can meet it, keep pricing low, and offer value around it's brand.
I agree. Like I said, they turned a "service center" into a full blown dealer, it's nice.
And yes, Tesla seems to have no problem meeting demand which is good.
It's the $60,000+ Blazer EV that MT crowned as SUV of the year that there's currently a stop sale on because it's such a POS that I'm ragging on, not Tesla.. How like Motor Trend said the Lightning was one of the most significant vehicles of all time? Yeah how are those sales working out for Ford lol.
"The experiment that didn't work well" that you're brushing off, cost/lost a lottttttttttttt of money that I really don't think they were anticipating losing. You're acting like it was just some teeny little misstep.
And what do you want to pick apart every thing I say? There are Taycans here but way more Teslas, sure. And they're all plugged in over night in garages. Go to the non rich part of town and count EVs.
It is what it is, companies try things and they do or they don't work out. You're trying to magnify every misstep and magnify every niche use case and use it to forward your anti-EV agenda. EVs not making sense as rental cars does not on any level mean EVs don't or cant make sense for people as their own vehicle. Progress is not a straight line...EVs absolutely will be mainstream that is just some time away, and even when they are until the infrastructure is there renting an EV when traveling with no home base to charge it just won't have much appeal.
Oh, and please find me a brand new Taycan for $90k in my area..... I'll definitely wait. Cheapest one I can find at the dealer is $155k.
Which is still $100,000 less than you said they cost lol
The point is its all rhetoric. You say there are nothing but Teslas when you're trying to say that only Tesla has and will have success with EVs, then we talk about Taycans and "Taycans are everywhere" which means what you said about Teslas before wasn't accurate. You're just so anti-EV biased.
It's the $60,000+ Blazer EV that MT crowned as SUV of the year that there's currently a stop sale on because it's such a POS that I'm ragging on, not Tesla.. How like Motor Trend said the Lightning was one of the most significant vehicles of all time? Yeah how are those sales working out for Ford lol.
By the way I see these POS Blazer EVs all over the place. I have seen at least 5 on the road in the past 2 weeks. Stop Sales happen in the industry all the time they will solve the problem.
It is what it is, companies try things and they do or they don't work out. You're trying to magnify every misstep and magnify every niche use case and use it to forward your agenda that "EVs are not going to be mainstream". EVs not making sense as rental cars does not on any level mean EVs don't or cant make sense for people as their own vehicle. Progress is not a straight line...EVs absolutely will be mainstream that is just some time away, and even when they are until the infrastructure is there renting an EV when traveling with no home base to charge it just won't have much appeal.
Which is still $100,000 less than you said they cost lol
The point is its all rhetoric. You say there are nothing but Teslas when you're trying to say that only Tesla has and will have success with EVs, then we talk about Taycans and "Taycans are everywhere" which means what you said about Teslas before wasn't accurate. You're just so anti-EV biased.
By the way I see these POS Blazer EVs all over the place. I have seen at least 5 on the road in the past 2 weeks.
You're just so in denial about EVs. EVs will never be mainstream, not in our lifetimes.
And the rationalizations about losing BILLIONS AND BILLIONS of dollars as just "small mis-steps", that's giving it all a huge pass and frankly kind of ridiculous.
I guess I'll say my piece then----A lot of stupid people at Hertz, because they could have just called me and I could have saved them billions of dollars with pretty much common sense advice.
You're just so in denial about EVs. EVs will never be mainstream, not in our lifetimes.
I don't even own an EV lol, I think you're 100% wrong. EV transition is happening, and god willing we both have 40-50 years left to live, thats a long time. I just call it like I see it without bias.
Government regulation alone will force EVs to be mainstream as localities ban the operation of ICE vehicles.
And the rationalizations about losing BILLIONS AND BILLIONS of dollars as just "small mis-steps", that's giving it all a huge pass and frankly kind of ridiculous.
Its not rationalizations, it is what it is. Just because there are losses now does not mean there will always be losses. Do you realize the massive losses taken on basically everything that is now mainstream and hugely profitable? You love your Lexus...Toyota lost a TON on Lexus before they started making money.
You're just so in denial about EVs. EVs will never be mainstream, not in our lifetimes.
And the rationalizations about losing BILLIONS AND BILLIONS of dollars as just "small mis-steps", that's giving it all a huge pass and frankly kind of ridiculous.
I guess I'll say my piece then----A lot of stupid people at Hertz, because they could have just called me and I could have saved them billions of dollars with pretty much common sense advice.
That's just not correct, with all due respect. They are already mainstream, Tesla has already made them mainstream. Legacy automakers have already started to make the move to fully electric, but it's tricky trying to make them profitable, which will happen as they figure out the manufacturing process. They are not losing billions due to lack of demand, but lack of profit, as sales numbers have been going up, but they are losing money on every car sold, which I suspect would make any company a little cautious.
I'm sorry to burst the bubble, but EV's are here to stay. Once mainstream EV's are priced right and people get to drive them, they will sell themselves. You rarely hear someone who owns an EV say they are going back to gasoline car. I'm an example, a long time motorhead. In 2021 I was in the market for a new IS350 or slightly used RCF or GSF, and now there's no way I'm going back. As automakers figure out how efficiently build EV's so they can profit on them and sell them at lower prices and regular buyers start driving them, they will just sell themselves. I would bet everything I own on it
Last edited by AMIRZA786; Feb 7, 2024 at 09:32 AM.
There you go again, because one neighborhood in Kentucky has all trucks EVs will never be mainstream. Want me to post pictures of the cars in neighborhoods here? 30+% of them are already EVs. On my street alone there are 7 EVs, one household only has EVs. Means nothing in the grand scheme of things.
