I'm curious how people here do their brake fluid exchanges, I have found a way to do it that makes sure there is no particulate at all remaining and all old fluid is gone.

Reason I ask is threefold, I want to see if there is a correlation to method and failures, I want to see if there are ways I haven't seen on here or considered, I also want to see if the dealers are lazy or not.

This is not a thread about if the actuator will/has failed on you but one specifically addressing fluid exchange method and if any trend can be determined.

My prompting for this is my car had its actuator replaced less than 10,000 miles prior to my purchase, it also didn't have a history of brake service past 2012......when I picked it up I noted a good bit of particulate in the Lexus dealership greenish tint fluid. I suspect that when the dealers perform repairs they do not take much care to really, properly, flush everything when repairs or service are completed. This may contribute to some of the issues we have seen/had. I want to try and solve this and the KCLV issue on these cars.

 

I asked "The car Care Nut" on U Tube who is a brand mechanic. He said that a proper flush can be done on LS460 without tech stream. Maybe he's right or maybe he's an example of how dealer techs do their job regularly. I'm with you, if the actuator is not flushed, it's not a proper job. I've got 60k miles and don't know who to trust to do this right for me. I can't do it myself because of logistics, or I would follow TS procedure. My Toyota dealer was asked to do a full coolant flush. They only drained the radiator and not the block drains. An example of the shortcuts that dealers take. So glad you're addressing this.

 

He is wrong. I'm a subscriber too. We had private discussion about this. There is NO link between pedal and rear cylinders. Rears are bled only using accumulator pressure. Can't be done without TaSCAN (mad ref, I know lol).

 

I used this manual power bleeder to do the job and it worked perfectly fine: 2008 ls600hl 100k miles still original actuator and no weird noise coming from it. I knew at the time about the Techstream method but the power bleeder seems more convenient for a one man job. I also hear that the Techstream method is only required when changing the master cylinder, the abs module or maybe if you have air in the system. So far I wasn't able to find a proper explanation on why the Techstream method would be required for a regular flush. The system used in the LS seemed similar to any other Toyota and although you can use the Techstream method on a Scion there probably not a lot of people going that route.

 

I believe, you have to use Techstream due to internal valves that need to be opened or closed at certain steps for a proper flush. If valves are not cycled at right times, some old fluid might stay behind.

 

For the front, you can do the traditional way with a bleeder bottle. For the rear, you need to open the valve with Techstream. Toyota dealer usually run the brake fluid special around $150. I will let them do it if I'm unsure.

 

swfla, I saw the same youtube video and went with it. I have the bleed kit but haven't gotten around to doing it. Hoping it can be done.

 

While not a true flush I pick option G. The turkey baster method. (suck it out of the reservoir and refill)

The reservoir holds a decent amount of fluid, perhaps 1/4 of the system capacity? Plus there is no wear and tear on the brake system.

If I remember correctly when I replaced my brake actuator Techstream had a note not to overheat the brake actuator during the bleed process. There have been a few people who posted actuator failures during bleeding. At least the turkey baster method is safe.

 

I understand how the traditional two persons method could not be the right way for this car if the rear brakes won't bleed but by using the power bleeder I can assure you that more than enough fluid came out from the rear, just like my Subaru which I did the same way. I would certainly be the first to go the extra step to do it the right way but by "some old fluid" are we talking about a few teaspoons or quite more than that ? Not disputing that the best method would obviously be the one from the service manual but it would be nice to have an absolute confirmation on what's going with the LS design versus any other car.

 

If you can find engineering type diagrams of how the actuator is constructed and operates, then you might be able to figure it out. What matters here is that the actuator needs to be completely FLUSHED of fluid to prevent it from failing due to particulates and moisture. It's the expensive heart of the braking system. Sure, any other method will remove some fluid from other areas, that's not the point of this particular system's vulnerability. Someone above mentioned no failure at 100k miles, great, but why not do it right? Unless you're selling it soon.

 

Ding ding! New Year's delivery service, Boykie here (and I'm sufficiently drunk and FEISTY!)!
One engineering level type diagram - COMING UP!
Hope this can clear up some widespread misconceptionions and rumouors (I mean you can suck and masturbinate milk fluid from rear wheels all day long but all that does is massaging two pairs of fragile valves in your 1700$ advics equipment )
am i kewl or whatz
Oh I'm on New Year roll! Anyways - some engimeniring - there are distinct 'pressure/power source' and 'drainage' circuits, as well as some 'amplification' type of stuff going on. Boffins! Your turn!

 

LOL Happy NY Boykie. Excellent post.

 

BTW, the subject of this thread is to FLUSH the system. If you're only servicing your pads/rotors, bleeding air is a simple procedure. There are a couple of posts above that seem to be blurring the line between procedures.

 

Okay I I'll add in what I found as well when I did mine and why I have adopted a particular procedure. I intentionally experimented on mine since my actuator is still under warranty.....I think this thread has good spread of input now so here is mine.

If you try and bleed it normally the rear wheels won't have fluid flow past the line pressure leaking out when you open the rear bleeders.

The fronts can be done but it will possibly confuse the system and put strain on it.

When you zero down the accumulator it does more than just vent the pressure back to the reserve tank. It actually opens all the valves, I confirmed this is true UNLESS you open the cars door. You need to leave the door closed, key IN the car and zero it down and turn it off for it to keep all valves open. You also can't just zero down once, I did so and then sucked everything out of the reserve tank and refilled it with new fluid and to test a theory I opened the door.

Pump spun up and the actuator valves locked the rear lines closed, I first checked to see if I could still move fluid to the rears and after the door was opened I could not anymore. When the door was closed I could gravity bleed 1/4+ of the reserve tank to each wheel. After I opened the door it stopped.

Once I figured that out I then decided to zero down again.....and it flooded the tank with the same particles I already removed! The accumulator holds a good bit of debris in it, I had to zero down 4 times to totally clean it out. Do not assume Lexus will do this, they did NOT bother to do so when they replaced my cars unit so I seriously doubt they would take the time to do it for just a flush.

Then I used the techstream bleed to finish, did offset learning and finished with a parking brake adjustment and calibration. I used almost 4 quarts of ESI6 fluid to do this experiment, I'll report back if the fluid lives up to the hype.

 

Very informative and worrisome. It would explain why so many units require replacement. Lexus procedure doesn't produce a proper flush. Am I reading that right? Seeing those particles of debris with your own eyes convinces me that finding an independent shop who will comply with your procedure is my best bet. If not, is your procedure something I can do alone? No one to press the pedal for me. Would a vacuum type bleeder do the trick?