Anyone else had their car actually CUT OUT whilst driving at a steady 20mph, and throw a P2112?
Yes, it really happened. I was able to re-start the car and drive for a very short distance before it happened again.
Not a good feeling when you're in traffic.
Well, who knew that drive-by-wire was always a dumb idea? (I did! But I was stupid enough to buy a car with it anyway.) My next vehicle (which might be soon) will probably NOT be a Lexus, and it WILL have a proper throttle cable linkage. (And proper mechanical heater controls that work by manual links and levers.) I don't actually care if it's over 25 years old.
I simply cannot bond with the 430 anyway, and this is just the icing on the cake.

 

You are going to have to go old school then, because I'm pretty sure that just about everything built since the 2000s has electronic throttle controls now.

Even the climate systems with the "manual controls" usually just use motors to activate all of the control flaps and such. I'm pretty sure that manual control cables pretty much went away on the 90s

Hell, even my cheap *** 2003 Camry with the 4 cylinder engine has an electronic throttle body.
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Even in the 70s and 80s they were using vacuum to move the temperature and air outlet doors. That's why sometimes flooring it would make the A/C start coming out the defrost vents on its own. You'd probably have to go back to something from the 60s or earlier to get a climate control system that used nothing but cables and levers.

 

Let's see... I have 2005 Ultra.... Alternator? went around 145k. Starter? went bad after bad battery at 150k. Brakes? Eats them around 30k miles. Chrome wheels? Trouble. MAF sensor? changed when I got codes.
But: throttle position issue? nope. A/C blend perfect after 19 years: even the swing vents.

I love the car. And the fact that it is modern design and build (yes, even for a 2005, with keyless entry and adaptive cruise and AFS headlights etc.) has not been an issue. Drivability has almost never been a concern (exceptiob was slight trans hesitation around 6 years ago that cleared itself up). The car feels great to this day.

My wife's 2016 Cadillac XTS has been more trouble-free. Brakes changed first time at 90k miles (impressve). Surprisingly bullet-proof, more than my LS430 from 30k-90k (I got it at 30k in 2009).

But the LS still blows it away in smoothness, comfort, headlights, radio, etc. Just how it feels on the highway or locally. Hard to define but absol,utely night and day. I'd gladly trade in the XTS far, far sooner than my LS. I've had the LS in shop (with a loaner) 3 weeks back in 2019 as they proved they solved my 3rd, frustrating Check Engine light in 4 months (they did, finally). Had an ES loaner. Newer, tighter, slicker. My LS interior felt.... old when I got it back. Not as fresh. Even smelled older! But I quickly fell back in love ("bonded") in a way that I never did with my ES or any rental I've ever had. The ES is fine. The LS is old but special, and going strong as ever. Except for tires and brakes, it is low maintenance. (Not many new cars still take conventional oil!) There may be a new car out there like it (G80 or G90 felt really nice), but why mess with success? And cars have gotten really expensive. My LS will be kept as long as it is broadly reliable or can be made to be reliable.

My point is: the car (any, really) may have problems. It is reliable overall but old and complex. But I love it and can't bear to part with it. I feel bad you have a drivability issue, but get it fixed is all. If intermittent/undiagnoseable, I get the frustration. But the electronics in this model are about as bulletproof as anything. I traded in my Buick LeSabre after 15 years with a general sense that it was falling apart. Served well but just a car. My current XTS feels the same... good, "cheap" transportation (got it with 25k miles at 1 year old for well under half of MSRP). It's a fine car, but other than $$ to replace it, I won't miss it someday, except perhaps if I can't get another sedan. And it has a beautiful interior, too. But the LS430 is just a different league in "feel". You have driven it, so I guess you don't feel it or the problems overshadowed it, so I feel bad for you. Best of luck.

To me, the LS is special, however. It is just surreally smooth, with great visibility (which I value highly). My trouble ratio is still far too low to get rid of it, It is simply the finest car I ever ride in, even with a bit of bumper damage and paint scratches. I don't write much about my other cars on other forums, but there i a reason I am on this one. Of course, that's "selection bias," (or perhaps survivor bias!) but I needed to defend this and others here. I'm in my late 50's (wow time flies) and have never felt joy driving any OTHER car. I do with this one. Weird, eh? I'm not even a car guy!

 

I appreciate your reply, and thank you.
You could probably tell that I was in a bad mood when I posted.
Nevertheless, my 430 has a very hard ride compared with the '98 LS400 I had before. (Mine has air ride w/18" rims, and also KYB rear struts which I am told could be firmer than stock.)
The 430 seemed like the logical progression from the 400. However, its styling to me is much more 'old man', yet the ride, along with gimmicks like door gobos and a somewhat illogical nav-screen layout go the exact opposite way to that. (But the ML audio system is the most incredible I've ever heard in a car, period. I'd defo miss that.)
But at the end of the day, I cannot have a car that I can't trust to not cut out on me. I thought I gave that up when I switched away from Fords.
You mention Cadillac; I have seen a few RHD STS for sale here in the UK (1999-era) and they actually look pretty nice. It'd be an interesting comparison with the LS430.
My car is in the shop right now. "First time I've had that on one of those", he says. As yet, I have no news.

 

Brand-new throttle body. Don't ask what it cost. (Just don't.) The last one ever in the European warehouse, evidently!

Old one totally siezed, so they say. I've got it and will take it apart as much as I can so as to figure out what happened. I will share my findings when I have done so.

 

OK folks, here it is. You'll never believe it.

I was totally expecting to find a stripped plastic gear. But no. All pristine, and a sealed motor that was rough and stiff to turn. (Anyhow, not so sealed that I couldn't open the tabs and remove the armature assembly.)

Wait for it.....

One of the magnets had come unglued from inside the motor housing!

Well, if this can happen then I'm totally done with drive-by-wire. It's just not acceptable. They say it's unheard of on these cars, but the AA guy (who messed up the interior of my car with black fingerprints) basically implied that throttle-actuator failure is not uncommon, generally.

With a bit of Evo-Stik to reglue the magnet I could probably have saved a lot of money. (But could I trust it? Can I even trust the new one now? Especially if it's been sat in a warehouse for 20 years?)

Everyone knows that non-porous surfaces can't really be bonded. So what were they thinking of?

Toyota need to know about this, for sure. (But how can I get them to listen to me?)

 

"For want of a nail...". Glad it is fixed. To me, a clean diagnosis and repair is a great thing. So often you get less clear-cut issues. I AM curious about the cost and hope it was not too exorbitant. To me this is a simple reminder that the car is these cars are 17-22 years old. They are so good that they often feel like new, but most of the parts are not. I mentally reset the mental clock after something like this and ask if I can go a year without being forced into the shop again... In 2022, I got new alternator and new starter. Alternator was first time car got stuck away from home (nearby, luckily) and starter may have gotten damaged due to battery issue. Plus I needed new tires after 6 years (not by mileage, more from damage). And new front brakes. I am not a DIY'er so this was not cheap. But 2023 so far has just been oil changes. Feeling good. Pricing new cars, I feel even better. Riding new brakes, new nice tires, etc. At 5-7k miles a year I'm thinking it'll last a long time. We will see!

I appreciate your concern. A good 2-3 year old car might even be more reliable than a new one (early issues resolved by first owner!). But I think reliability has gone up, not down. I have had a 19 year old car before with 130k miles and it felt horrible and the engine smelled like bad exhaust, etc. And it was a nice car when new. My 19 year old Ls feels great to drive. Aside from newer cars being newer, I think LS430 in particular is still highly reliable. Yours might be trouble-free for a long time now. Incredibly well engineered, even though you may disagree. But even if it is like new... it is, however, not new! I think that is the issue, rather than drive-by-wire in this particular highly reliable car. It's not the electronic gremlins that got you.... or even bad maintenance. (Ahem, I have never had a throttle body cleaning...). I think you just got hit by parts age! If your engine is still in good shape, be happy. My brother-in-law loves Nissans but lost his beloved Altima to oil burning/consumption with < 140k miles, and it was a pattern failure for that year. Good luck in whatever you decide.

 

Thank you again for your considered response.

The new TB cost £2000. (I've bought complete LS400s for less! But recently their prices have skyrocketed, too.)

The motor is not cushioned in any way, so I guess vibration or impact could have played a part. Nevertheless, I cannot imagine how or when.

I'm sure you are right; it may well be trouble-free from now on. I hope so, because now is hardly the ideal time to try and sell the car.

I think I'd feel better about the car if the ride was smooth. (Especially as air-ride was sold as the be-all-and-end-all.) Granted, it does have KYB struts on the rear, which my mechanic does not hold in high esteem and suggests could be the problem.

Best regards...

 

Hi Rich,
It's about the same as would happen in an olde worlde car if the throttle cable snapped (and they did!), although that would be way cheaper to fix.
That throttle body is nearly identical to the one on the LS400.
£2k is a big ouch though but then it was never a cheap car to repair.

Chances are that motor was bought in by Toyota, so the machine making it may have had an off day and not put enough glue on the magnet.
It did last nearly 20 years though.

Mine is still on the air-struts all around and drives nice and wafty at 140k miles. It's not as wafty as the LS400s I drove, but then it out handles them considerably.
I have had to replace both front wheel bearings (£1200 supplied and fitted), my air-con doesn't work, I've had to replace one O2 sensor, the exhaust Y-pipe, the reversing camera, and some parking sensors.
But it was a cheap-ish car (£4400 nearly 6 years ago) and doesn't owe me a penny now, so every mile/year is a bonus. :-)

My first Honda Legend (98 Acura RL for the Americans) died in the middle of the A13 at rush hour.
I had traffic passing me on both sides for nearly an hour. Luckily it was the usual logjam on the approach to the A128 so nobody was going very fast.
After being towed by the RAC to the Orsett **** pub car park, they diagnosed a failed fuel pump relay.
Took them an hour to get to the relay and replace it. The relay only cost £15 even at RAC inflated prices. <LOL>

I have also heard that the KYB struts are too stiff for the LS.
You should be able to feel the stiffness by doing a comparative bounce test on the 4 corners.
Otherwise, let me know when yer about and you can take mine for a quick drive to compare it.

 

Thanks BB,

I never had a throttle cable break on any car, but then I used to inspect them regularly. You can't inspect the innards of a sealed unit.

I certainly wouldn't want to be stranded on the A13, that's for sure! (Was it the coil or the contacts of the FP relay that failed?)

I appreciate your offer of a test-drive (or ride). Happy to meet up in the same place as before. I'm around Friday if that works. PM me!

Cheers....

 

Hi Rich,

It was the contacts. One of the contact pads had fallen off so no power was getting to the fuel pump.
Kinda weird as I had driven from the Isle of Dogs in the usual stop-go traffic with no issues and then when sat stationary the engine just died.
The contact pad was loose inside the relay housing. It took the RAC guy 15 mins to diagnose the fault, but an hour to get to the relay (underneath the rear seats via the boot/trunk) and swap it out.

Will PM ya re-Friday.