And your opinion would be valid...assuming you have driven the 4GS.

I neither agree or disagree with you, because I haven't driven the car. Given my experience with the same engine in the 4GS I think performance is going to be just fine, but thats a meaningless opinion because I haven't driven the 3IS.

We can post and post, and decide to buy the car or not but its all just meaningless because none of us have driven the car, and only few of us have even seen it.

 

I don't have to drive a 4GS to have a valid opinion. I've driven faster cars and I know that's the performance I'd want for my next vehicle. I know enough about these cars, their competition and what I want to apply deductive reasoning and a bit of common sense to come to the conclusions/opinions I'm coming to without having to actually drive them. We aren't the same person, you maybe NEED to drive the car to come to whatever conclusion you come to, I have enough information to not have to do that.

I suggest a logic class and maybe look up the definition of "opinion" before your next reply to me, because the only reason we are going back and forth is because you have a misconception on both these concepts.

 

LOL...you don't need to try something out to have an opinion about it, whatever. Thats the definition of a closed mind, making your mind up about something before you try it out for yourself.

It is possible for the new IS to not be enough performance for what you would want for your next vehicle and for it to still be an excellent offering that sits well within their competitors. For instance the GS' performance is very comparable to its competitors. Perhaps your needs have just outgrown a non F IS.

As to weight, the 3IS is 50 lbs heavier than the 2IS. Thats all.

 

nice. way to go.

 

By your logic, I would have to drive a Prius to know I want a car that's faster than it, even though I've already driven cars that easily out perform it. The difference between you and me is I've got a clue. Like I said, logic class would do you good. The thing is, I know you can't be that clueless to not realize this so ill chalk it up to Lexus bias. Particularly the IS.

 

Ramon, I think you've stated your opinions pretty clearly and this thread is growing increasingly antagonistic. Let's move on please.

 

I thought we can get some cool head light similar to LFA and new generation engine.

 

I'm not going to rise to the personal attacks. Its just a discussion about cars...lets keep some perspective as Dave suggests.

No, I'm not saying that you would have to drive a Prius to know you want a car thats faster than it. What I am saying is that whether or not its fast enough *for you* is not the metric by which a car enthusiast measures a car. I would never buy a Prius, I would never buy an IS, but that doesn't mean I don't recognize how those particular cars fit in between their competitors. I can drive a car that would never appeal to me and still recognize what positives and negatives it has with its competition.

If you want something thats over the top powerful, like a Dinan modified 335i or an ISF thats great, thats what you should buy. However, the IS350 is not poorly designed because its not as powerful as a modified 335. I think if you compared the IS350 with a stock 335 you'd find the IS is pretty comparable, thats certainly the case with the GS350 vs the 535i. Does it compare powerwise to a 550i? No. The Prius is not poorly designed because its slow, you have to look at comparable cars and compare and contrast these cars with their competitors. I enjoy experiencing cars that I would never be interested in buying because I'm a car enthusiast.

For the record I have no Lexus bias. I like Lexus vehicles a lot, and obviously have chosen to drive them but that doesn't mean I don't recognize that other manufacturers have better products in certain segments...and I've said that here. No IS bias, I have never owned an IS nor would I ever consider purchasing one. Its not my kind of car.

 

I know my 2012 IS has an aluminum hood or "bonnet" . I figured it out when I tried to attach my magnetic flashlight to it an it just fell off. Was wondering why it was so light when I opened it for the first time. Not sure of any other body panels though. I'll have to check!

As far as trading, I did want to trade due to having a 250 and wanting a 350. But after seeing the photos, I think I'll have to wait. Maybe I can trade for a 2012 350?

 

Whats the big deal about aluminum? I'm assuming its the weight factor, but I've never paid attention to what's under the pain..

 

Well, Lexus did not say that the new 3IS is lighter than the out going model, that's why question about using aluminum was popped up. It's weight factor for us consumer, but it's cost saving factor for manufacturer. I don't really mind if it comes steel or aluminum hood, I just want to make sure if it's the reason 3IS is not lighter.

 

Its 45 lbs heavier, mainly due to the 3 inch in rear legroom it gained. When the 4GS came out they applied a lot of lightweight techniques that actually dropped the GS weight by 50lbs over the previous gen but the size didnt change significantly. The 3IS gained a lot of rear legroom, and im assuming the same lightweight techniques were applied to minimize its weight gain to 45 lbs.

 

What an "enthusiast" uses as a metric is entirely subjective, and the rest of your post, while accurate, has nothing to do with the debate we were having. I see where it fits in with it's competition. I can recognize it's positives and negatives and "for me" there aren't enough positives about the car.

Lets just wait for the reviews, and if Lexus pulls off what i'd consider to be a miracle and the 3IS 350 is significantly faster than the 2IS 350 I'll gladly eat some humble pie and never again pre-judge a Lexus vehicles performance. If however its roughly equal, or less than the 2IS, you stop claiming I need to drive the car first. Deal?

 

i honestly dont know how can you claim anything about the car without driving it... no matter what it is. There are much more important things about the car than 0.1s better 0-60 time.

 

Judging a car by 0-60 or quarter mile times is the crudest way of assessing a car. For example the previous gen BMW E90 330i was never the fastest or most powerful sedan in its segment when compared to its competition yet was widely acknowledged to be the best driver's car.Seems like you're quibbling over internet specs cos you're reaching for a reason to dislike the car and don't want an actual test drive to change your ( already made-up)mind.