Rglaz

The issue that i see with both Camry and Avalon is they eliminated fog lights. Sometimes you need extra light. Couple that with stingy leg room in the Avalon I traded in ( donated) my 229,000 mile Camry xle on a Lexus RX350...

Aron9000

Its also at least $10k more expensive than basic stuff like a Fit or Soul. Comparing a basic Golf to other cheap cars, I come up wanting, mainly because VW's are unreliable money pits once the warranty runs out.

Anyways, getting back to the Avalon, with big sedans going out of favor for SUV's, I'm surprised Toyota is putting out a new model. The ES350 is basically the same car and sells A LOT better, if people want something bigger/nicer than a Camry.

I think the R&D money could have been better spent on a Toyota 2 row crossover to slot between the Rav4 and much bigger Highlander. Its a gaping hole in Toyota's lineup IMO, Nissan has the Murano, Ford has the Edge, Jeep has a Grand Cherokee for every budget. SUV's sell right now, big sedans are out of fashion. And I don't see that changing long term, if gas prices rise, people will buy small sedans and the Prius, not a V6 Avalon that gets about the same mileage as the big V6 Highlander.

mmarshall

Agreed.....I'm with you on that. Though I normally am in favor of more consumer-choice, I don't see much reason why they keep the Avalon in the American market. It does little or nothing that the Lexus ES doesn't do as well or better, with far more sales, and with a longer warranty than the Avalon.

LexBob2

The Avalon gives Toyota a flagship sedan which every brand needs. Thru June nearly 17k have been sold and in 2016 they moved 48k. With a new generation coming it looks like it will be around for quite a while.

mmarshall

I agree on the necessity of a flagship, but only where it is feasible. The problem, though, is that the Avalon butts up against the always-popular Lexus ES....and is squeezed from below by the extremely popular Camry. We see more or less the same problem at GM, where the excellent but slow-selling Chevy Impala (no longer a rental-class car) gets crowded out from below by the strong-selling Malibu (also not a rental-class car any more) and the popular (until this year) Buick Lacrosse from above. And, at Hyundai/Kia, we have a situation where neither flagship (Azera, Cadenza) sold well at all, though the Azera has been discontinued in the American market while the Cadenza still plugs along. The neglected Azera, of course, was hemmed in by the (former) Hyundai Genesis from above and the hot-selling Sonata from below, while the Cadenza, while hemmed by the hot-selling Optima from below, had no Kia products above it except the extremely slow-selling K900, which is not even sold at some Kia shops.

situman

My point was its been that long since any Toyota product was considered a gold standard and the Avalon was supposed to be the torch bearer outside of the Land Crusher. Here's to hoping they can let the Avalon live up to its flagship status.

situman

Not just the Avalon. Both Toyota and Lexus got caught flatfooted with the SUV craze, or perhaps they ignored it. Just look at the amount of car introductions in the last few years and all, except the Camry, are low volume cars. RC, LC, LS, Avalon, Camry and next gen ES. What do they have in the SUV lineup? A warmed over Rav4, Highlander, Land Bruiser and the new mediocre CHR WITH NO AWD!!!! The NX and RX is average at best, GX and LX is pretty much neglected. The upcoming 3 row RX is based on the current RX with a third row meant for small people with their legs chopped off instead of basing it on the next highlander or TNGA. Their product cycle is completely mismatched with the market and what the consumer wants.

sorptd

Despite some gaps in their SUV line up i dont think their product cycle is completely mismatched or they were caught flatfooted. Rav4, Highlander, 4runner, NX and RX are all doing very very well which probably accounts for majority of high volume segments.

situman

They admitted to being caught flat footed themselves. Besides, good selling products aren't always the best or near the best. Selling on reputation will only last so much longer when your competitors are leapfrogging you in the quality surveys.

sorptd

I am not sure what to make of these quality surveys and how it impacts actual sales. Anyhow, after looking at new Camry (which is quite impressive inside & out) and the fact Toyota is finally rolling out new engines, chassis etc i am hopeful the next gen of Toyota vehicles like this forthcoming Avalon will be top notch.

Wandl

Like GM's recent announcement, interesting to see how the auto market will evolve their offerings in 2021(ish) with a lot less sedans. Most sedans I'd imagine would be going to fleet sales (rental, govt, corporate fleets) because people will still want to rent economy cars....just not own one. And presumably when oil prices go up, gas starts going over $3/gallon, we're going to see a big (not massive, given the availability of hybrid/turbo powertrains in some SUV's) sell-off towards fuel efficiency again.

American consumers clearly buy the cars they want, not the cars they need (i.e. see Honda Ridgeline)

Back to the Avalon, the ES is on the Avalon platform and Lexus' largest volume sedan seller, so would make sense for Toyota Corp to come out with something new. I've had my eye on the ES300h and interested to see what the next generation would look like especially with the new/updated safety features.

GFerg

2019 Toyota Avalon to debut at the 2018 Detroit Auto Show

http://https://www.autoblog.com/2017...ound-ab-tile-1

GFerg

Toys4RJill

Buick LaCrosse incentives just got bigger

Seriously, this news came out of nowhere. Didn't expect to hear this so so soon. Nice to see that Toyota is not going to keep the current platform extra long. I doubt we will see a turbo. Hopefully the rear seats regain the reclining feature that was on the previous gen. can't wait.

mmarshall

This whole class of entry-level luxo-sedans is in decline. IMO sad, too, because it's one of the ways to really get some comfort behind the wheel without a prohibitively expensive price.

This time, hopefully (2019), Toyota will get it right the first time. The last major redesign for the Avalon resulted in some (IMO) flimsy parts inside, too-firm underpinnings, and too stiff a ride for most of those who were attracted to this class of vehicle. A quick-softening of the suspension/tires had to be done on all but the Touring versions.


Agreed. The Lincoln MKS and Cadillac CT6 have both been criticized for their 2.0T base powerplants.