Genesis after the first year. - ClubLexus - Lexus Forum Discussion


Car Chat General discussion about Lexus, other auto manufacturers and automotive news.

Genesis after the first year.

Reply
 
 
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 06-09-17, 08:35 AM   #1
mmarshall
Lexus Fanatic
Thread Starter
 
mmarshall's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Virginia/D.C. suburbs
Posts: 65,894
Thanked 53 Times in 53 Posts
Default Genesis after the first year.

Here's how the General Manager of the Genesis division feels after a year of being in business:

I've got a lot of respect for them....and, recently, myself seriously considered a G80. And I'm looking forward to reviewing a G70.

http://wardsauto.com/industry/genesi...-luxury-market

ST. HELENA, CA – It’s no coincidence that Genesis, Hyundai’s fledgling luxury brand, played a low-key role in sponsoring an Oscar party in February for the cast and crew of “Hidden Figures.”

Like the real-life heroes portrayed in the Academy Award-nominated movie, Genesis as a brand is working hard behind the scenes, sharpening its pencils and making its case for proper consideration – in this case by the premium-car buying public.

“We don’t think that people are going to turn the switch and suddenly forget about other brands and flock to us,” says Erwin Raphael, general manager-Genesis, on the sidelines of a media drive of the ’18 Genesis G80 Sport sedan here. “We think that if people are aware and give us a fair shake and evaluate us,that a decent percentage of them will choose us and that will be enough for us to be very successful,” he says.

So far, that means it’s okay to sell just 20,000 vehicles annually, but look for that number to double on an annualized basis when the more-affordable G70 sedan arrives next April. The growth curve gets even steeper when the first Genesis CUV, based on the GV80 concept revealed in April at the New York auto show, goes on sale in 2019.

A second CUV and a sports coupe – most likely based on the Stinger platform from parent company Hyundai’s sister brand Kia – come a year after that and then, with a full portfolio, Raphael believes the brand will be firmly established as a small and fresh alternative to the American, German and Japanese premium marques.

“It’s certainly our plan to be a new and different alternative,” Raphael says.

While many Genesis buyers come from inside the Korean automaker’s family – most directly from Hyundai – Lexus owners represent the largest segment – 30% – of conquest buyers to the brand, followed by BMW (15%), Cadillac and Mercedes-Benz (both 11%). Acura, Audi, Infiniti and Lincoln buyers make up the balance of conquest buyers.

Buyers largely are white, male, college-educated and older than 50, with median household incomes touching $145,000, but Raphael is quick to point out the Genesis brand is reaching out to all potential luxury buyers and welcomes everyone interested in the products and able to afford the vehicles.

“We made a very deliberate decision early in our lives not to develop an avatar for a particular customer and say that’s who we’re going after,” Raphael says, noting data can be deceiving when it comes to determining ability to afford a premium automobile.

“Just because you don’t have a high income doesn’t mean you don’t have money and you can’t afford to buy a vehicle,” he observes.

Taking that wide-swath approach means Genesis is deliberately advertising in Spanish and directly to women who often influence buying decisions, African-Americans, Asian-Americans and the LBGT community.

“Part of our DNA is being progressive, and in this case progressive means understanding and respecting our customers for who they are,” Raphael says. “We’re really taking this diversity and inclusion approach to say we’re going to reach out to people and talk with them. The diversity in our advertising reflects that.

“We don’t want anybody – including white males – to feel alienated.”

For now, all Genesis vehicles are produced in South Korea and that won’t change until the brand can reach the kind of global volume – typically 200,000 vehicles – necessary to support a dedicated plant. So far, the brand sells about 90,000 cars annually around the world.

“When the time is right and our sales are such that it makes sense, we would consider it,” says Raphael, who dismisses the idea of building a plant as a “political statement.”

“It would be an option at that point in time, but there’s certainly no commitment at this time.”
mmarshall is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-09-17, 10:13 AM   #2
LexsCTJill
Lexus Fanatic
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: ON
Posts: 6,100
Thanked 23 Times in 17 Posts
Default

Remains to be seen how Genesis will do. From a brand POV, they are entering a North American market that is shrinking compared to the record sales they last year. Also, I am not convinced the brand image is going to be as good as a BMW or Lexus. Lexus is clearly going after a higher clientele​ in their new LC and upcoming​ LS model.

I really don't see Genesis as brand working unless they get high volume mainstream models like the RX and ES off the ground.


The article called Genesis and premium car brand I think that is where they are.
LexsCTJill is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 06-09-17, 11:02 AM   #3
Hoovey2411
Moderator
iTrader: (16)
 
Hoovey2411's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: California
Posts: 34,855
Thanked 23 Times in 21 Posts
Default

They have a decent foundation, but Genesis won't make much of an impact until its 3-Series fighter, and two SUV/CUV offerings come to fruition.
Hoovey2411 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-09-17, 12:11 PM   #4
Wandl
Lead Lap
 
Join Date: Jan 2015
Location: Tx
Posts: 708
Thanked 23 Times in 23 Posts
Default

the parent company Hyundai itself is facing financial headwind by having a more-sedan-less-suv line-up in a market that is clearly against sedans. Not saying the G80 or G90 are inferior products by any means, but the F-Pace accounts for 40% of Jaguar's revenues and Jaguar has been around for a while, Raphael is correct in stating SUV's are going to be a good game changer for Genesis.
Wandl is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-10-17, 02:09 AM   #5
Aron9000
Lexus Champion
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: TN
Posts: 3,878
Thanked 15 Times in 14 Posts
Default

They need at least 3 "SUV's" in their lineup at various price points. Once we see how their SUV's sell, then we can determine if they are a success or not. Right now, their lineup of two sedans(which are very nice and competitive IMO) is just not going to cut it if they want volume and want to be taken seriously in the luxury car game.
Aron9000 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-10-17, 08:03 AM   #6
LexBob2
Lexus Fanatic
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Illinois
Posts: 8,015
Thanked 11 Times in 10 Posts
Default

Has anyone seen the timetable for the Genesis CUV and SUV? It can't come soon enough for them.
LexBob2 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 06-10-17, 08:41 AM   #7
Johnhav430
Lexus Champion
 
Join Date: Sep 2016
Location: PA
Posts: 3,039
Thanked 95 Times in 93 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by mmarshall View Post

Buyers largely are white, male, college-educated and older than 50, with median household incomes touching $145,000, but Raphael is quick to point out the Genesis brand is reaching out to all potential luxury buyers and welcomes everyone interested in the products and able to afford the vehicles.
In 2003, the above minus about 13 years was a typical 3 series buyer. There's definitely a trend to spend more of one's income towards a car, and to I would say get less. Financing tools (really marketing tools) I guess makes this happen and possible. If we adjust to 2017 dollars, the typical 3 buyer in 2003 would be at $188,406 ($140k in 2003).

I will say their products make a person look twice. The tails remind me of zebra stripes when they light up. Still, I wouldn't trust their powertrains, but I'm old fashioned. Plenty of Sonatas 200-300k.
Johnhav430 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-10-17, 08:42 AM   #8
Johnhav430
Lexus Champion
 
Join Date: Sep 2016
Location: PA
Posts: 3,039
Thanked 95 Times in 93 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hoovey2411 View Post
They have a decent foundation, but Genesis won't make much of an impact until its 3-Series fighter, and two SUV/CUV offerings come to fruition.
I guess BMW is catering to demand (after all econ 101 says willing and able, make the 3 a sports car like it was until about 2011, the willing goes away). What a shame the 3 is no longer a true sports car.
Johnhav430 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-10-17, 09:03 AM   #9
EZZ
Lexus Test Driver
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: CA
Posts: 1,365
Thanks: 0
Thanked 16 Times in 14 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Johnhav430
I guess BMW is catering to demand (after all econ 101 says willing and able, make the 3 a sports car like it was until about 2011, the willing goes away). What a shame the 3 is no longer a true sports car.
Haha. So true. When a Lexus is able to out handle your product in the same market segment, you are far from the sporty choice.
EZZ is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 06-10-17, 09:34 AM   #10
mmarshall
Lexus Fanatic
Thread Starter
 
mmarshall's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Virginia/D.C. suburbs
Posts: 65,894
Thanked 53 Times in 53 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by EZZ View Post
Haha. So true. When a Lexus is able to out handle your product in the same market segment, you are far from the sporty choice.
On the other hand, that also shows how far Lexus has transformed their products in the handling department. In general, with a couple of exceptions, the Lexus cush-tush days are gone.
mmarshall is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-10-17, 09:45 AM   #11
SW15LS
Lexus Fanatic
 
SW15LS's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: MD
Posts: 20,421
Thanked 208 Times in 182 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Johnhav430 View Post
In 2003, the above minus about 13 years was a typical 3 series buyer. There's definitely a trend to spend more of one's income towards a car, and to I would say get less. Financing tools (really marketing tools) I guess makes this happen and possible. If we adjust to 2017 dollars, the typical 3 buyer in 2003 would be at $188,406 ($140k in 2003).
Not sure how you make this conclusion, that people are spending more of their income towards cars. That demographic data is for the whole Genesis brand, most Genesis sales are the G80, a car that sells between $38,000-$55,000, with most sales in the early 40s. The same price range as a 3 Series to your comparison to the 3 series makes sense. If anything, the 3 series is more expensive than average Genesis sales.

There are a few 65-70k G90s in there, but there are a few M3s in the 3 Series numbers too.
SW15LS is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 06-10-17, 10:06 AM   #12
bitkahuna
resisting entropy
iTrader: (20)
 
bitkahuna's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: Present
Posts: 51,827
Thanked 41 Times in 36 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Aron9000 View Post
They need at least 3 "SUV's" in their lineup at various price points. Once we see how their SUV's sell, then we can determine if they are a success or not. Right now, their lineup of two sedans(which are very nice and competitive IMO) is just not going to cut it if they want volume and want to be taken seriously in the luxury car game.
that's pretty obvious but their 'slow' approach isn't necessarily bad as they're learning what they have to do for customers and service... remember lexus had just 2 vehicles to start too.

i'd definitely be interested in an suv version of either g80 or g90.
bitkahuna is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-10-17, 10:14 AM   #13
mmarshall
Lexus Fanatic
Thread Starter
 
mmarshall's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Virginia/D.C. suburbs
Posts: 65,894
Thanked 53 Times in 53 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by bitkahuna View Post
that's pretty obvious but their 'slow' approach isn't necessarily bad as they're learning what they have to do for customers and service... remember lexus had just 2 vehicles to start too.
That's true, but when Lexus debuted in 1990, SUVs were not the enormous market force they were today. The Ford Explorer, which transformed the family SUV market in the 1990s, was just being introduced....the Jeep Grand Cherokee, which helped with that transformation, was introduced a couple of years later (1992-93). Those two original Lexus sedans (LS400, ES250) faced a market that was still much friendlier to sedans than it is today. I myself (obviously) happen to like upmarket sedans, but I'm clearly in the minority today.
mmarshall is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-12-17, 10:47 PM   #14
Aron9000
Lexus Champion
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: TN
Posts: 3,878
Thanked 15 Times in 14 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by bitkahuna View Post
that's pretty obvious but their 'slow' approach isn't necessarily bad as they're learning what they have to do for customers and service... remember lexus had just 2 vehicles to start too.

i'd definitely be interested in an suv version of either g80 or g90.
Marshall pretty much hit the nail on the head about SUV's being a much larger portion of the market and a lot more important today.

What will be interesting is if Hyundia keeps the new product coming for the Genesis brand. I know people love to say that Lexus made their mark and reputation with LS400, and attribute the company's early sucess to that car alone. Keep in mind that Lexus had 3 all new products for sale in 1992, 2 years after the LS400. The striking SC coupe, the GS300 sedan in the middle price bracket, and IMO perhaps Lexus's best hit of the 90's, the entry level ES300. The ES300 completely blew the Germans, Swedes, and Americans out of the water in terms of luxury/refinement, reliability and style at the lower price points in the market.

Just saying Genesis is going to need at least two more solid hit products ASAP. The market is crazy for SUV's, if they're as good as their sedans, they will be well on their way to success. I don't think Genesis will be the lighting strike that Lexus was in the early 90's, as things are much more competitive now days(Audi, Jaguar, Lincoln, and Cadillac in the early 90's were kind of a bad joke compared to what they are building now days)

Last edited by Aron9000; 06-12-17 at 10:53 PM.
Aron9000 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-13-17, 07:10 AM   #15
SW15LS
Lexus Fanatic
 
SW15LS's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: MD
Posts: 20,421
Thanked 208 Times in 182 Posts
Default

I agree they need more products, specifically SUVs and they seem to be coming. I think they were right to start with sedans though. True SUVs are a much bigger draw nowadays, but the core of every luxury brand (other than SUV only brands) is their sedans, the sedans build off of that and provide an experience built off of those but with added utility. Think about BMW, Jaguar now, Mercedes...

If you start with SUVs it sends a message that's what your brand is about. For instance, can Jeep all of a sudden build a sedan? Or Land Rover? No, but Jaguar can build an SUV after forever, so can Maserati, etc.

Last edited by SW15LS; 06-13-17 at 07:17 AM.
SW15LS is online now   Reply With Quote
 
 
Reply

Related Topics
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Genesis Grounded in Louisiana Lenscap2 Car Chat 11 08-07-17 03:58 PM
Hyundai Kills Off Genesis In Britain After It Fails To Lure Buyers Away From BMW, Mer LexsCTJill Car Chat 47 07-15-17 06:48 PM
Happy Holidays...MM Full-Review-2017 Genesis G90 mmarshall Car Chat 68 11-10-16 01:05 AM
Hyundai planning N-badged Genesis performance models Hoovey2411 Car Chat 14 01-15-16 08:45 PM


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 09:51 AM.


Copyright © 2000-2017 Internet Brands, Inc. All Rights Reserved We are a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for us to earn fees by linking to Amazon.com and affiliated sites.
 
  • Ask a Question
    Get answers from community experts
Question Title:
Description:
Your question will be posted in: