Thanks for the answers. Although the 4.6 is rated at something like 342hp in the GS and I don't see "valvematic" bringing it up to 400hp. Of course the LS 460 is at 380 so that may be closer. I am not sure what valvematic is but it will very likely be implemented for the mpg gain rather than hp. Not sure the 350 will get much more, more from the standpoint of corporate policy than anything. But that is certainly the engine the RX was waiting for IMO.

For years I saw GM play this nonsense that, for example, the corvette would always have more hp than a camaro or other model. Don't misunderstand me, there would be a more restrictive induction, exhaust manifold, or exhaust system that would strangle the hp but all too often the vette part was a direct bolt on to the Camaro so the phony reasons about packaging were just so much nonsense. It is obvious that the V8 for Lexus is being developed for the LS with the GS just getting dragged along wiht what they decide to give it. When the 2nd gen GS4 came out, even the 430, I may be wrong but it seemed like at that time the GS got the higher rating over the LS. Don't know what all this means as the hp wars may not be dead, but they are sure going to be on life support.

Once again, thanks for the answers.

 

Yeah the GS30 had around 300 hp from the 4.3 while the LS430 had 290hp. If I remember correctly...the LS430 had more torque.

They also did this with the Sequioa/LandCruiser..the Sequioa had 245hp while the Land Cruiser had 230 hp...However the LC had more torque at 320 vs 315

 

I predicted the GS would have 400hp, boy was I wrong

Another thought is maybe with the IS-F coming, they didn't want the GS 460 to have 380hp as the GS/IS-F buyer would cross shop way more than the LS/IS-F buyer?

I am not sure but being a GS 400 and now 430 owner and with the 3GS in the running for my next ride, well having a new bodystyle with the same engine I have now is not fully appealing and the GS 460 simply doesn't have the performance over my 430 that makes me drool. The GS 450h appeals to me most and the GS350 nearly makes both seem redundant.

In ten years, the GS 400 is now GS 460 and performance times have dropped barely 0-60 and maybe .4 seconds in the quarter mile...sigh..

 

You might want to look beyond the stated EPA numbers, and perhaps prod around in our own 3GS forum and maybe a Hyundai forum.

Many GS 460 and LS 460 customers are averaging 23-25MPG in MIXED driving, with some cresting 30mpg on the highway. Again, not sure what the real world numbers are for the Genesis 4.6, but I work at a Lexus dealership and have seen and talked to plenty of owners who report mileage like what I posted above, and I have seen it on their readouts for proof.

 

yes, they stopped carring... just look at GS350, look at IS-F and look at LS460 engines... just really stopped carring with these top of the class powertrains.

 

And RX400h, and GS 450h, and LS 600hL, and LX 570

I don't feel like Lexus has dropped the ball with powertrains, at all. Fuel economy, power, technology...their engines (except the SC) are all at the top of their class in one respect or another.

I am inclined to agree that the GS is the weakest product in the Lexus portfolio right now, and they could have done more with it. For one they could have offered a sport package relatively easily which would open it up to a whole other audience and they could certainly do more to market the car. I haven't seen a single ad for it since late 05 when the car came out.

That doesn't mean it's a bad car though, and in fact, I'd venture to say that I think the GS 350 is the best car in it's class with all things considered- price, power, features, fuel efficiency, options, etc. They really do need a sports package for the V8 (and even the V6), and while they couldn't make the 380hp happen on the 460 because of air intakes, they could do a little more with this car.

This generation of IS has been knockout product so far, LS has matured significantly and stayed on top of it's class, ES (while my least favorite) seems to have it's target market down pat and still sells consistently, and the LX is probably the best full size luxury SUV on the market. The GS is a 90% product in a company that has been hitting homeruns, which is what makes it look so bad.

 

A lot of it is Lexus even with the IS-F, just doesn't make cars that will make magazine covers and make internet folks drool. So even with improvements or hybrids, they are overshadowed by the RX/ES/LS. People still think that is only what Lexus is about.

Lexus does need to show the world their cars are not all bland/boring. There are doses of excitement in the brand.

I also find their hybrid marketing to be horrible and not getting the message across. You still think PRIUS when you think Hybrid, not Lexus.

 

I think this is the fundamental truth. With the exception of the uberpanzers (sorry Doug, no insult intended) the V8s are really being eaten up by the 6's. This is not at all a bad thing. HP is HP regardless of the number of cylinders it comes out of. Any notions of smoothness in relation to number of cylinders just doesn't really apply to the premium V6s like Lexus. In fact, I am still in love with that straight six in my wifes GS300. That straight six has always been smoother than my 430 and overall makes a much more pleasant car with just a few suspension tweaks.

 

It should be.. smoothness is a function of the mechanical balance of the engine not the number of cylinders... The Inline-6 is perfectly balanced (Just like the V12 and Flat 6 arrangements) in that all balance/vibration problems are cancelled out... no need for balance shafts or other contrivances. (Memories of turbine-like BMW's) The I6 to me is a perfect blend of sufficient displacement, economy, and performance for future premium cars... (Albeit the packaging efficiency is less than that of a V6)

Chris

 

Pretty sure most everyone here knows about the fundamental design advantage of the straight six for balancing of both rotating masses and firing pulses. I thought my E type had the smoothest engine in the world and a 4.2l straight six with nine quarts of oil was awfully smooth, until I had a chance to spend some time with the V12. Once you get beyond the simple books and, at that time, slide rules, the smaller combustion volumes of the V12 taught the lessons about engine smoothness for firing order balance better than any blueprint would. But fundamentally I suppose the reason I find the 535 engine preferable to the GS350 is for exactly this reason.

 

I don't recall the exact torque on my LS400, but it was rated at 290HP. 10 HP less than the GS400. Even when it turned into the GS430/LS430 the HP ratings were still the same 300 HP for the GS and 290 for the LS, but the torque went up in both. LS as of 1998+ always had less HP and torque (Possibly equal torque but I'm pretty sure not more) than the GS until the new LS460 came out. I believe my GS430 has 300HP and 310 lbs-ft torque.

 

I honestly think the Genesis should be compared to the Avalon/Camry SE V6, the Accord EX-L V6/TL and the Buick Lucerne IMO...

 

In a mag, I saw the overall comment. It said "Lexus should be worried". Psssh yea right.

 

2009 HYUNDAI GENESIS DELIVERS NHTSA FIVE-STAR SAFETY RATINGS

FOUNTAIN VALLEY, Calif., 08/27/2008 The National Highway Traffic Safety Administration (NHTSA) awarded five-star crash test ratings, the highest government rankings under the agency’s New Car Assessment Program, to the all-new 2009 Hyundai Genesis for both frontal and side-impact crash tests.

“Genesis was engineered with a lightweight but strong body shell, featuring ultra-high tensile steel, laser welding, and advanced adhesive bonding,” said John Krafcik, vice president of Strategic Planning and Product Development, Hyundai Motor America. “Add eight airbags and electronic active head restraints and you can see the focus we placed on designing Genesis for occupant safety. These five-star results are just one indication of the dedication Hyundai engineers place on safety.”

Maintaining Hyundai's emphasis on delivering leading safety technology, Genesis boasts world-class active and passive safety features that both prevent accidents and maximize the well-being of its occupants in the event of a collision. The Genesis continues the Hyundai tradition of standardizing key life-saving safety technology, with features such as Electronic Stability Control (ESC), eight airbags and electronic active head restraints.

ESC compares the driver’s intended course with the vehicle’s actual response. It then brakes individual front or rear wheels and/or reduces engine power as needed in certain driving circumstances to help correct understeer or oversteer.

Genesis' eight airbags include advanced dual front airbags, front and rear seat-mounted side-impact airbags, and roof-mounted side curtain airbags for both front and rear outboard seat occupants.

Hyundai is the first popular brand to offer electronic active front head restraints, a standard feature on the 2009 Genesis, which are an improvement over mechanically-based active head restraint systems. Until now, electronic active head restraints could only be found on select Mercedes-Benz, BMW and Lexus models. Active front head restraints have been proven by the Insurance Institute for Highway Safety to help prevent whiplash.

Genesis is brought to a halt by large four-wheel anti-lock disc brakes with Brake Assist and Electronic Brake Distribution (EBD). The V6 models feature 12.6-inch front rotors with single-piston floating calipers, while the V8 models feature 13-inch front rotors with four-piston calipers. All models are equipped with 12.4-inch rear rotors.