I've pulled up my receipt from my 30K visit, Here it is:

30K Service MnHrs 4.3 Hrs $414.95
- Change Engine Oil and Filter
- Check and Set Tire Pressures
- Check Spare Tire and Adjust Tire Pressure as needed
- 28 Pt Safety Inspection
- Replace Air Filter
- Inspect Brake Pads, Rotors, Calipers, Brake Lines and Hoses
- Rotate Tires
- Inspect A/C Filter
- Balance all 4 tires
- Trans service, Front and Rear Diff Service
- Service Battery, Check Fluid and Terminal Connections
- Replace Brake Fluid and Flush System
- Service Cooling System and Replace Coolant
- Inspect Drive Belt, Exhaust Pipes and Mounts, Fuel Lines and Connection Ball Joints and Dust Covers, Body Chassis nuts and Bolts, All Hoses and Steering Rack and Pinion and Fuel Injection Cleaner
- Replace fuel tank gasket
- Inspect and Adjust headlights
- Check diagnostic system for faults or codes
- Replace Wiper Blades
- Test Drive Vehicle

Parts:
Wiper Blade $7.37
Wiper Blade $8.71
Air Type I-4 $36.93
Antifreeze $13.23
Brake Fluid $6.84
Fuel Additive $29.95
Gasket $14.26
Air Refiner Element $54.81
Grease $4.20


Total 604.83 (Corrected from my last statement of $700)

 

are just a cut above "gofers", which is the term I used, and gofers are just a cut above McD "flippers".

What I have observed is that dealer service departments, not just Lexus by any means, predominantly use low paid gofers to perform any, or almost all, routine scheduled maintenance items. "Routine" procedures, items that don't require any particular skill level.

ATF:

Has anybody out there ever had their passenger car have a premature, less than 120k, transmission failure that wasn't due to misuse or some manufacturing defect?

I believe NOT!

The gears and bearings in your rear differential "work" just as hard and absent LSD clutches are expected, and do, last until the car is sent to the junkyard, historically without any interim maintenance.

Here it si 2002 !!

Up until now the only maintenance procedure for an automatic I ever heard of was adjusting the bands (type of "clutch").

ATF is specifically formulated: to lubricate the bearing and gears, to carry the heat away to be transferred to the engine water jacket, and to NOT maintain contaminant and/or particulates in suspension, they (clutch wear particles) settle to the bottom of the sump.

Oil, ATF, doesn't lose it lubricating and heat transfer charactoristics, EVER!

If I could drive a 1968 (and a 75) Ford V8 for over 100k Miles without opening the tranx, why would I now need to in a modern vehicle?

Has ATF manufacturing or formulation technology gone backward? Has bearing and/or gear manufacturing knowledge gone backward at the same time we have figured out how to build gear driven fluid pumps and many mechanical devices for the space shuttle that must last in the heat of launch and the cold of deep space?

NO ??

We launched Pioneer 10 in 1972, it is now almost 8 BILLION miles from the earth, twice as far from the sun as Pluto, it still reliably responds to enquiries with sensor data.

To you really think the people who can do that can't figure out how to make an automotive transmission more reliable today than they did in 1972 when Pioneer 10 was launched?

If I were to EVER allow you to tinker with my tranx, diff'l or brake fluids you can be damn sure samples would be sent off to a lab to discover what was wrong within that device that created the need for the ATF, lubricant, fluid to be changed out.

Just so you know, I over-hauled my first engine, from a John Deer tractor, in 1955.

 

Today, transportation becomes part of our life. Without transportation, I can't imagine how we're gonna get from point A to B. Our cars need some maintanace just like our body. We have to go see the doctor for pyhsycal check up and see the dentist for cleaning every once or two a year, right, so your car. It's good idea to take care of your car and make sure it's in good shape.
Man vs Car
Nose/Lungs > Air Filter/Intake
Food > Fuel
$hit/fart > Exhaust
Energy > Horsepower
Shoes > Tires
Drink and **** > Fluid exchanges
wwest..what's wrong with your John Deer tractor and why did you have to overhauled the engine back in 1955? Lack of maintenace...
I've called NASA and talked to some of the Rocket Scientis. He said It's cost NASA almost 1 billion dollas to get the Pioneer 10 to travel 30K miles. After 8 billion miles they can't get it back.
Sorry folks, I think I'm in the wrong thread. I think we're talking about 30k service.
Houston, we've got a problem.

 

Lexus gave up on being "Relentless" (implies they're never going to get there) and changed their motto to "Passionate Pursuit of Perfection", apparently while some of you weren't listening.

Like the way they have publicly acknowledged a design change in the "sludge" prone engines to alleviate the problem and didn't tell their own dealer's employees.

 

well wwest, I mispoke then. None of the mechanics @ my dealership are a little above hamburg flippers. They may have brain farts, but they are more skilled that the greasers @ mickee dee's.


My SC400 has a flutter because the last owner (my father) stopped getting regular dealer service & didn't have his ATF changed. The 1UZ-FE's AT is designed to have its fluids changed. It's also very common to see tranny seals to go also. If you don't have your ATF changed regularly, you'll most likely not notice this seal failure. And it wouldn't take a lab sceintist to figure out you've got engine oil in your ATF, hence a seal failure. But you could get your ATF analized if you want.
(Chairmnofthbord had this seal fail on his 92 SC400)

Additionally, this may be my problem too, my 93 SC400 has a flutter around lockup. But the vibration was fixed w. an ATF change.


About your diff never needing service, it's not uncommon to find metal filings in diff oil. I'd perfer to talk w/ a differential expert about diff fluid changing, but If I had something other than an open differential, I'd be much more **** about keeping it properly maintained.

about Pioneer, how much did that project cost the government & the tax payers?

"How much money did it cost to fund this program in the beginning? Again, this is from Mark in Lost Creek. Well, Mark, this was a rather economical program by today's standards. I believe the spacecraft itself cost about $200 million. That wouldn't include the launch costs or operations. But for a space program, that was relatively inexpensive even by the standards back in the 1970s."

If my car cost $200 million to build, I'd expect it to function w/out its fluids being changed, yet...
http://quest.arc.nasa.gov/sso/cool/p.../pmonetxt.html

"Pioneer 11's RTG power supply is dead. Its last communication with Earth was in November 1995. Pioneer 10 is still functioning (barely) but is no longer being tracked regularly due to budget cutbacks. The last data was received from it on 1997 March 31. They are heading off into interstellar space, the first craft ever to do so."
http://www.seds.org/nineplanets/nine...pacecraft.html

You know, @ my dealership, all the cars that come in w/ sludge are ones that were not maintained properly. Maybe they're more sensative to engine sludging, but if they had done the proper maintenance, it wouldn't have happend.

kreativ, I stopped work, and walked down to meet shinchan @ the front desk & work through service items he didn't need so that he could get a more accurate price. It's a matter of personal preferance. Some people like "the works" others just want what they feel is critical and needs to be done. Pick & choose what you want serviced. I'm coming to the conclusion that it's pointless to even try to explain this to you guys.

Oh yea. And by the way, I'm not a service consultant, I don't work in the parts department, and I'm not a mechanic (or I would have taken a real offense @ your gofer comment west). I'm the IT Director -- I end up interacting w/ everyone from the owners, to the clients, and every employee.

BTW: If you don't want to spend your money to have your fluids changed, then don't. But don't call it a design flaw when a component fails because you didn't follow the scheduled maintenance.
https://www.clublexus.com/forums/sho...5&pagenumber=3

If your ford was so much better, what didn't you buy another 1975 V8 model? Why not a brand new 2002 V8? Grand Marquis? Mercury Marauder? Mustang? F-150?


I'm getting the feeling west that you just don't want to spend money. But if you spend the money needed to purchase the car, then maybe you should at least consider looking into doing the maintenance.


Idea: We've got dyno tests, but how would you guys like some fluid test? I'll see about sending some fluids to a lab from a car that has 30 or 60k on the clock w/ the fluids in it (save oil) that came from the factory. Rather than speculating, I'll put my $$ where my mouth is. On maintaining the car.

John


PS: I don't care if you guys ever change your fluids... But I can't help but disagree with you. Keep your money, keep your original fluids. It's fine by me. But just be careful dispensing your advice.

 

But still out of date...

On the thirty year anniversary of its launch, earlier this year, Pioneer 10 responded to an enquiry sent (friday) from the deep space tracking network, enquiry went out from CA, response was recieved 22.5 hours later (Sat) in Spain.

Funding ran out for the program in 97 but a small team at NASA, including Van Allen, is keeping it alive by begging and borrowing time and equipment. I believe they now have enough public interest that NASA will allow them to contact PIONEER 10 on something of a regular basis.

I bought my first Lexus, a 92 LS400, in late 91, I have no doubt at all that it is the best value in the world for a car of this vintage.
With over 80k, other than oil & filters, tires, and one oxygen sensor, absolutely nothing has been done to this car. It has NEVER been back to the Lexus service facility since some gofer over-filled it with engine oil, didn't bother to drain first, at about 7k miles.

I wasn't the one who insulted mechanics and/or technicians by referring to them as gofers. No Lexus service manager is stupid enough to allow a highly paid skilled mechanic/technician do routine maintenance procedures. That's the problem!

OH, human comparisons

Exploratory surgery: Lexus scheduled maintenance

Elective surgery: Lexus needless use of "rough service" schedule.


Given the current state of things, continuous technological improvements in virtually every venue, I'd be really interested in knowing what is unique about the Lexus automatic transmission (and the brake system) that causes it to require (need?) fluid changes on such a short term scheduled basis.

Are they by chance making the gear teeth "soft" to reduce the gear mesh noise?

 

Dumb question, but why does the 60k service costs almost twice as much as the 30k service? It seems to be the same service from the breakdown I received from my dealer. Any ideas why so much?

Just in case anyone cares, the G35 service costs $498@30k but $898 with brake and coolant flush, and a computer diagnostic at Stewart Infiniti in Serramonte. Same for 60k service. Something about the plugs not needing changing until 105k miles.

What is the labor rate these days?

 

I meet with John last week discussion on what is to be service for the 30K. I have cross out several item... Not because I think they are unnecessary.. but rather.. I have aftermarket parts that doesn't need to be service by Lexus.

ie.. Air filter for the Intake... (SRT HFI)
Roate tire?.. got my 18" on about 1 month ago.
Change Oil...oil filter... use my Mobil 1 Syn.. and My Own Oil Filter.

If you don't think you need your car maintenance prop.. that is more of personal opinion. Now when I get the TC and LSD installed.. those oil should be monitor and change regularly...

 

Then why not monitor only ( a small sample to the lab for analysis) as a first step, and if the lab says something is wrong with the oil/fluid then you can go ahead and do the necessary repairs and then put in new oil or fluid.

Absent something being wrong inside your tranny, diff'l, or brakes, (radiator, cooling system) the oil/fluid tests will come back "normal" and your worry is assuaged.

 

Hi, What I was told is that roughly 10k is $100; so, 30k miles would be roughly $300, but normally you get $295 or so.