Which Oil Filter?
01-02-10, 11:20 AM
#46
You have really taken this to the extreme
If you have catastrophic engine failure, even if you have used a third party filter, and you can prove the oil was changed based on lexus's schedule or better, they could not deny you a claim. And again, the filter specified by Lexus for my wife's ES is a Thai filter with the associated number sequence.
Lou
If you have catastrophic engine failure, even if you have used a third party filter, and you can prove the oil was changed based on lexus's schedule or better, they could not deny you a claim. And again, the filter specified by Lexus for my wife's ES is a Thai filter with the associated number sequence. Lou
Also lobuxracer has stated, in NO UNCERTAIN TERMS, that he has changed his oil in what would be by all measurable terms, "extended intervals". This is directly against the guidelines of every Toyota service manual I have EVER read. Remember the old days when the Toyota 3.0 V-6 were all pooping the bed due to people using "extended intervals"? A lot of R&D went into the problem relating to the cause and the cure of this issue. Much was due to a poor design of the cylinder heads, a large contributing factor was the extended oil drain intervals.
I am simply advising people against doing such things, as it is in direct conflict with your owners manual, as is installing parts NOT originally intended for their vehicle. Hope this helps to all whom care, and to the rest, I wish you the best should you chose to go this route.
Last edited by ming15237; 01-02-10 at 11:42 AM.
01-06-10, 06:55 PM
#47
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Lou with all due respect, I have NOT taken this to an extreme... Advising people to use a filter that was NOT specifically designed for their vehicle is an extreme move. Especially when they are looking at best to save $90.00 over the course of 100,000 miles. That to me is an extreme move to make. I am going to put a call into a friend of mine on Monday whom is an engineer with Toyota, and find out if he can advise me on the differences between the two filters. I can assure you there is something different besides one kit comes with and extra o-ring and a drain spout. If it were not for this difference every Lexus dealer in the nation would be using the other in an effort to make an extra $4.00 per oil change.
Also lobuxracer has stated, in NO UNCERTAIN TERMS, that he has changed his oil in what would be by all measurable terms, "extended intervals". This is directly against the guidelines of every Toyota service manual I have EVER read. Remember the old days when the Toyota 3.0 V-6 were all pooping the bed due to people using "extended intervals"? A lot of R&D went into the problem relating to the cause and the cure of this issue. Much was due to a poor design of the cylinder heads, a large contributing factor was the extended oil drain intervals.
I am simply advising people against doing such things, as it is in direct conflict with your owners manual, as is installing parts NOT originally intended for their vehicle. Hope this helps to all whom care, and to the rest, I wish you the best should you chose to go this route.
Also lobuxracer has stated, in NO UNCERTAIN TERMS, that he has changed his oil in what would be by all measurable terms, "extended intervals". This is directly against the guidelines of every Toyota service manual I have EVER read. Remember the old days when the Toyota 3.0 V-6 were all pooping the bed due to people using "extended intervals"? A lot of R&D went into the problem relating to the cause and the cure of this issue. Much was due to a poor design of the cylinder heads, a large contributing factor was the extended oil drain intervals.
I am simply advising people against doing such things, as it is in direct conflict with your owners manual, as is installing parts NOT originally intended for their vehicle. Hope this helps to all whom care, and to the rest, I wish you the best should you chose to go this route.
I've been building and rebuilding engines since I was 12, and my dad has another 20 years on me. I'll be 50 in May. We've both worked on a wide range of internal combustion engines from *** .049s to Cummins and Caterpillar stationary generator sets large enough to power an entire regional hospital. We've been at this for a little while. Every generator set I've ever seen has its oil analyzed to determine when to change it, and to warn of a dangerous wear condition inside the engine. There is no better way to determine OCI, and when an oil change means 100 gallons or more, you can bet the owner doesn't want to change it any more frequently than necessary.
On most cars, it's barely cost effective to do UOA. The F is where it just starts getting worth it since it takes about 2.5 gallons. This is why the manufacturers don't say "send a sample for analysis to determine when to change your oil." They've also got to deal with the public who only want to know how often should the oil be changed.
It's pretty obvious from what I've measured through UOA the IS-F can go for a very long time between oil changes given MY driving pattern. If I only drove it 3 or 4 miles every time I started it, I might not even make 5k before the oil would be useless. I know enough about the subject to know a manufacturer recommends something to help ensure they reduce warranty costs especially when the owner is paying for the service. If Lexus were paying for the service (as BMW and Mercedes do) you can bet your bottom dollar we'd see much longer OCIs. Since it costs them nothing to recommend 5k changes, they're all over it. Even a 3 or 4 mile driving cycle owner will be unlikely to kill the oil in 5k. They use this same logic to save them money with engine calibrations. Look at WOT fuel ratios and you'll universally see very rich mixtures. Why? Because if anything does go wrong, the mix is so rich it's unlikely the engine will detonate and require warranty replacement. Anyone who tunes knows you can pick up significant WOT power just by leaning out the OEM maps - but you risk engine destruction should something go wrong. So the OEMs aren't paying for gas, but they are replacing engines that detonate to death and this means (just like our OCI) they're going to default to a very conservative map.
Saying running an aftermarket filter will cause great harm to an engine when I have lab data from an engine running this filter indicating the filter is working well is just being an alarmist. If the filter didn't filter well, it would show up in the UOA as excessive solids. If the filter didn't flow sufficiently it would also show up in the UOA as excessive wear metals. Neither of these conditions exist, so I have confidence the YZZ4 filter will be just fine.
Now...Today I was at Wal-Mart waiting for a prescription fill and I saw the Fram filter for the 2UR-GSE. It's yet another design and color. See below:
No idea if it fits, but it looks like it should. Of course so does the Purolator until you actually stuff it into the housing. No, I didn't buy one. I have 9 YZZ4 filters in a box at home. It's going to be a minute before I run out of them.
01-06-10, 07:48 PM
#48
I am going to put a call into a friend of mine on Monday whom is an engineer with Toyota, and find out if he can advise me on the differences between the two filters. I can assure you there is something different besides one kit comes with and extra o-ring and a drain spout.
Lou
01-07-10, 08:24 AM
#52
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Unfortunately, they have the INCORRECT part number listed... 
The correct Lexus Part number for the IS-F Oil Filter is 04152-51010
As seen in the image on their own site, which shows the partial number.
As far as saving a couple of bucks on an oil filter.. Yeah I guess..
But for now I will keep using the filter listed for the F, since I bought a bunch with my Lexus Reward Points.. (So they were basically FREE)
I already save more money on gas by keeping the RPMS below 2500 and get 24mpg on my daily FWY drive..
I can also save a TON OF MONEY by using Geico.. LoL
Joe Z
The correct Lexus Part number for the IS-F Oil Filter is 04152-51010
As seen in the image on their own site, which shows the partial number.
As far as saving a couple of bucks on an oil filter.. Yeah I guess..
But for now I will keep using the filter listed for the F, since I bought a bunch with my Lexus Reward Points.. (So they were basically FREE)
I already save more money on gas by keeping the RPMS below 2500 and get 24mpg on my daily FWY drive..
I can also save a TON OF MONEY by using Geico.. LoL
Joe Z
Last edited by Joe Z; 01-07-10 at 08:28 AM.
01-07-10, 10:53 AM
#54
Why do you say it's incorrect? They have the YZZA4 listed, which we all know fits just fine, and "most" of us believe it will work just fine. IMO, they are listing the most economical Toyota PN that they know will work.
http://www.sewellpartsonline.com/par...d=187438&all=Y
Lou
http://www.sewellpartsonline.com/par...d=187438&all=Y
Lou
01-07-10, 03:25 PM
#55
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Why do you say it's incorrect? They have the YZZA4 listed, which we all know fits just fine, and "most" of us believe it will work just fine. IMO, they are listing the most economical Toyota PN that they know will work.
http://www.sewellpartsonline.com/par...d=187438&all=Y
Lou
http://www.sewellpartsonline.com/par...d=187438&all=Y
Lou
Since the only Official Listed Lexus part number for the IS-F Oil filter is:
IS-F Oil Filter #04152-51010
IF Lexus USA or JAPAN wanted us to use the YZZA4, that would have been an easy application to add onto the parts catalog for said part number.
I'm not debating which filter works best, fits best or is cheaper..
Joe
Last edited by Joe Z; 01-07-10 at 03:32 PM. Reason: typo
04-19-10, 02:32 PM
#57
The correct Lexus Part number for the IS-F Oil Filter is 04152-51010, and its around $8 bucks if you pick it up discounted..
If someone here can confirm that the 04152-YZZA4 part number is the same exact filter element as the IS-F oil filter.. Then I will switch..
Otherwise I'm sticking to the right part number..
Whenever possible Lexus will reuse a part number if it can be crossed over to another model.. I don't see it happening in this case..
Joe Z
If someone here can confirm that the 04152-YZZA4 part number is the same exact filter element as the IS-F oil filter.. Then I will switch..
Otherwise I'm sticking to the right part number..
Whenever possible Lexus will reuse a part number if it can be crossed over to another model.. I don't see it happening in this case..
Joe Z
Joe,
Son at Dynamic Automotive showed me a comparison side by side of the Lexus, and Toyota filter and they are identical. He installed the Toyota on my F.
04-19-10, 02:39 PM
#58
http://www.trademotion.com/partlocat...layCatalogid=0
04-20-10, 07:30 AM
#59
One more to the mix:
http://www.knfilters.com/search/prod...x?Prod=HP-7018
And the application list:
http://www.knfilters.com/search/appl...x?Prod=HP-7018
http://www.knfilters.com/search/prod...x?Prod=HP-7018
And the application list:
http://www.knfilters.com/search/appl...x?Prod=HP-7018
10-30-10, 07:32 PM
#60
Sorry to bring this thread back from the dead, but I just picked up a Lexus 51010 Oil Filter and I noticed that it was made in Thailand. The reason I thought you guys would be interested was that I noticed that there was some debate about the Toyota V8 YZZA1 Filters being made in Thailand vs the Lexus 51010 filters being made in Japan. Makes you wonder if the Toyota YZZA1 filters are exactly the same as the more expensive Lexus Filter...Darshana S...