I too would like an EV that feels like a car and looks like a car.

 

Tesla's autonomous beta is very promising it's navigating city streets including ones not driven on before largely without intervention. But it's not perfect (or good enough yet) and in my estimation will stay in beta for quite a while. But the tech is way more advanced than many realize. And yes this is on topic since Tesla was mentioned in the 1st sentence of this thread, and self driving is a huge part of the Tesla business model. And not only Tesla every start up EV is either talking about or developing self driving, and of course the legacy auto makers and other tech companies. Self driving subscription model is worth billions that's why the likes of Apple are keenly interested they know very well the potential.

 

Agreed. I have a neighbor with an older, smaller house where the garage was converted into additional living space. He charges his BMW i8 in the driveway. The charger hangs off the side of the house and pretty much looks like a gas meter from the street, unless the cord is run to the car.

But to counter an earlier point, the vast majority of people in the neighborhoods I've lived in use their garages as intended. Sure there are some pack rats who use them as a junk space, others that have more cars than stalls so park one on the driveway anyway. Or even temporary situations, like ours, where we had an above-ground pool delivered on a pallet in December, so one stall is currently unusable while we wait for the weather to turn. But you can bet if one of our cars were an EV, it would be parked where it could be easily charged, whether that's in the other stall, or in the "correct" spot on the driveway.

I really don't think this is an issue for the majority of homeowners in this country.

 

^^^^ Ok I was getting your point until you pointed out your above ground pool and you lost me from there. Just kidding of course.

 

Lol, what can I say, I'm a cheapass. We bought it at the end of December (actually delivered in January) for $3500, it's now $4200, and if we waited until April/May it would be nearly 5 grand. I'm more than happy to collect $500/mo "rent" for one garage stall.

But anyway, back to EVs.....

 

Just to be clear, I have no problem installing a charger in my driveway, but I do not like to park in my driveway as it is long and narrow, and if I park in the driveway it makes it inconvenient to walk to the backyard as I need to squeeze by the car. I prefer to park in front of the house, but running a cable from the driveway to the car across the sidewalk is a clear tripping hazard. Such is the reality for many urban dwellers. I understand that not every city is like NYC, but NYC alone is huge, and there are many urban centers where people have similar situation. Not to mention other countries.

Right now ICE cars are convenient for everyone, EVs not so much.

 

Looking forward to the day when your car won't start because you forgot to renew your subscription

 

Like I said before, you'll adapt lol

 

Yeah, if I get an EV I'll figure something out.

 

Yup, more of the Tesla rationalization... "oh see how smart i was to get a tesla now, it will pay for my retirement and kids college as a self-driving robotaxi in 5 years."

um, yeah.

 

I made zero mention of people making money on a "robotaxi". If you pay event he slightest attention to where this is all headed the self driving business model is about a constant revenue stream for auto makers and possibly companies like Apple. I suggest doing some basic research instead of making silly comments.

 

Interesting conversation. I’d like to add my two cents. A very good friend of mine has a model X. His 250 mile range only drops to 225 during the coldest parts of Indiana winters, which can drop into the negatives. He parks it in his garage, but the reports of cars losing significant range in the cold doesn’t apply to him.

As to the range dropping when you drive it hard... on the ISF sub forum, we figured that our cars get like 3-4 miles per gallon during track use. So my 336 mile range drops to 64 miles during hard use (from 21 mpg to 4 mpg).

Ill never sell my ISF. I live in a suburb with a 3 car garage and would happily own an EV, but I keep paid off cars and refuse to spend 40 grand just to “save money.” We also take the pilot on long trips as a family with two young kids, and I would need a longer range than 200-300 miles. My sister lives 110 miles away and there is no charger between her and me. I’m about to go stay in a very remote cabin... and a 200 mile range would make me nervous.

But for my daily car commute, an EV is genius and we would save money if the cars themselves that we like werent so expensive. For that reason, I’ll keep my older paid off cars. But someday, when range is higher and my family car is dying, I will buy an EV.

Id love to have solar and never pay for energy again... but we have clouds in our skies darn near 70% of the year, and many of us have tree coverage on our properties. I’m not sure that solar is ever going to be a full time option to power homes and cars here in Indiana. It is impossible with current solar panel efficiency levels. We simply can’t make enough power in an overcast state.

I want to be solar and fully electric except for the fun car. I think it’s genius. It’s just not feasible today. Maybe another day.

 

Expense of adding a car charger??? You’re kidding, right? Have you seen the price of gas going up again? I’m putting that charger in in a heartbeat.
I also don’t think I’d mind plugging the car in every day when it’s sitting in the garage, no biggie. Range is really the issue. Would never want to be prevented from going somewhere by my vehicle, defeats the purpose of having it.

 

EV’s have their place for sure. However, last month’s extreme cold & snow brought down the Texas electric grid like it was nothing. The USA is far, far from being ready for a ton of EVs. They are not building ANY type of electrical generating plants & that will kill this. It takes years to get an electrical generation plant from planning to operational. Looks like someone better start planning some coal, gas & nuclear plants or there won’t be any electric to charge cars. Solar & wind only work part of the time & they are a great SUPPLEMENT, but they are not reliable & they only last 10-20 years tops. Power stations last 50 years or more. My neighborhood is all gas heat & hot water. It’s cheap & it’s efficient. I don’t have 200 amp electrical service & I don’t need it. If I decided to buy an EV, I would have to have my entire electrical system changed & a new meter put in. That would cost thousands - Not going to happen. There goes any savings that an EV would have provided.

Also, someone mentioned their neighbor’s Model X not losing range in the winter - BS! Even my hybrid loses considerably more range in the cold. That guy is living in some dream world & not reality. Perhaps they are keeping their X in a warm garage most of the time & it doesn’t sit out in the bitter cold. Cold weakens even the best batteries, then add the additional load of trying to heat the cabin to a comfortable temp. Scientifically, unless they are using new solid state batteries that are not available yet, they will loose considerable range in the cold. The amount of exposure to the cold, will dictate how much range is lost.

Electric Vehicles have a future, but they will not be the dominant choice for many, many years. Eventually, they will get there. The most of us will be stuck with some ICE vehicles for this lifetime either as primary or secondary transportation. Fossil fuels must continue, unless we switch to nuclear. They are the only two sustainable options & there is no way around that. Everything else is just a supplement.

 

Cold will reduce the range of most batteries for sure but actually lengthens the life of the battery . Heat kills the battery very fast...just look at all the 1st gen Leaf owners and their **** poor degradation using passive cooling systems. The only way to mitigate cold right now is to have a very large pack which adds cost. Hopefully, pricing will reduce significantly so that even the lowliest EV can have 400 miles of range.