I think thats clearly where they are taking the car, doesnt change though that if you want a traditional flagship sedan that car is no longer really that type of car anymore. If I wanted a Maserati or a Panamera or a CLS or something like that, I would get that.

If you want a car a lot like an LS460 today, the G90 is really the best option under six figures. When you drive the G90, they so clearly benchmarked the LS460 with it. You just have modern tech, modern features and amenities, etc that the 460 lacks.

 

you nailed it. People are easily bored and easily satisfy that boredom with new or change be it a car a wife girlfriend or whatever,, None of which has any bearing on the value reliability character or quality of the car (or person) in question. This is exactly what drives the new car market. People are easily impressed with all the flash of new tech and have no clue as to what makes a car reliable and last. They just want the flash. Long term quality is not even a thought to most buyers.

 

For sure. But you also don’t want your $100,000 car going back to the dealer in the first few years for ANY repairs.

 

The LS500 alcantera dor panels (like my LC) were really nice. The overall interior quality was excellent for sure, but the trackpad is, as we know, just dumb and just doesn't fit in either. The new screen for '21 didn't look as awkward to me as it did in pictures though.

i'm sure the LS500 with air suspension rides nicer than the G90 but then you're talking $25-30K more!

Agree with all this. And of course, in my 3 year experience that's coming to a close, i've never had to visit the dealer for any service, and the services i've had have been every 6 months like clockwork (oil/filter/rotation) plus one issue (volume ****) that was fixed of course.

Active? Ha, that genesis forum is dead. I posted a couple of times, got no real anwers, haven't been back.

People have mixed experiences with all brands/dealerships. But i'm not disagreeing that genesis should up their game with dealers. For some that matters, for others it doesn't. Depends on how much genesis wants to invest or push dealers. I think as the product line fills out and demand grows, they'll be able to demand more of their dealers. I know, Lexus did it the other way, but that's 30 years ago. Times change.

1) that is laughable, how can you know that an 8 year old Lexus will outlast a new G90?
2) source for info on 'metallurgy'?
3) many don't care about outlasting and don't intend to keep whatever they get 'forever'.

I agree with all that, but it depends what you mean by 'long term' as most people won't keep a car 10+ years so yes, to them it rightfully doesn't matter.

 

LS sales will mimic the Fiat Chrysler Auto - which is not so good either.
While TMC has $200B in equity, FCA only has $30B in equity.
FCA may not be a good role model for TMC.


Back in 2009 after President Akio took over the reigns at TMC, he wanted TMC to have more inspired styling and more inspired dynamics, hence his "No more boring cars" adage.
In the early 2010's, many new models like 2011-17 Camry and 2012-20 4GS came with firmer suspension and less sound insulation.
The 2017 5LS was certainly the last of the no more boring cars.

However, since then TMC has now back flipped.
The inspired angular origami styling is still there, but the suspension has softened and now the latest Camries, Corollas and RAV4's have more sound insulation than ever.
There is only one other element of sportiness left, and that is the lower rooflines that have been adopted across the entire industry to include lowering of both high riding CUV/SUV tall wagons as well as sedans.
Let's hope their sales bounce back too.

 

wandl, maybe your friends dad should buy bitkahunas G90 before he turns it in? Garage kept and he drives like a little old lady. although looking at the cars you listed probably looking for awd

 

Hah - well he'd prefer Apple Carplay and only the 20 & newer G90's have that, plus he's attracted to the bold style of the refreshed G90.

Don't disagree with you Jill, but (purely my opinion) that's maybe the Lexus of yesteryear. Not only does the LS500 get a score of 13/100 on Consumer Report's reliability , one can't just assume a good brand will yield a good car. Both he and I really wanted to like the LS500, and I'm sure it's a good car (i.e. design, material quality) just not as complete of a package as, say, his 13 LS.

Well I think a few forumers did have a good point - assuming my friend's dad keeps this car for 5-8 years, live life and get the better car regardless of the market's perception of value. That and, while I'm shocked I was able to find him a 19 LS ~35% off MSRP, it shows the Lexus strong resale value doesn't apply as well to the LS500 model.

Agreed - my friend's dad had a 07 LS, 13 LS and was ready to buy a LS500 till he drove it - the competition (IMHO) has caught up and leapt ahead.

All that said, I'll recommend to him to negotiate on the G90 tomorrow and keep everyone updated - appreciate the inputs on both sides!

 

Not talking about that kind of trade-in value. Talking about the trade-in value of the LS460 thereby reducing the cost of the new car. They'll get more for it at a Lexus dealer.

Lou

 

a lot of things are laughable when you know nothing about them it’s a common response. [political comment removed]

you are correct a lot of folks don’t care about anything lasting. Instant gratification is the play of the day

 

That claim that Hyundai or Genesis has inferior metallurgy is especially laughable when you realize that Hyundai is a steel company (dating back to the 50s before they even made cars) and manufactures their own steel- which other OEM's also buy. If there's any car company that knows their metallurgy, it's Hyundai.

 

Did someone say that Hyundai metal is crap?

 

Context matters:

 

From post #27.
"A new g90 will not outlast a 2013 ls460, the metallurgy of the internals are no where near the quality of what Toyota uses. This matters in time and engine cycles."

 

Listen to (and feel) the solid way doors shut on most of today's Korean products, and that will tell you most of what you need to know.....although, to be honest, I have detected a slight, (not serious) lighter-weight feel/closing-sound in the latest vehicles from Hyundai and Kia (Telluride, Palisade, and Seltos).....somewhat more-so in the new Sonata, which, unfortunately, may be starting a new trend in Korea vehicles. I hope not......Korean vehicles improved tremendously from the late 90s to the last few years, and I don't want to see it go down the drain in the name of cost-cutting.

 

laugh all you like. Time will tell.

I place my bets on Japanese steel.

How are Hyundai motors holding up to Japanese motors in Autos these days??? It’s no contest.