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As we move to a fully electric future, has anyone heard of any fully electric Lexus coming to the North American market. I know the foreign counterparts have the UX 300e, which seems okay. Last I heard, Toyota's vision is more hybrid than fully electric, which is an interested approach. I would love a fully electric LS as I own a couple gas versions and one hybrid ES in the past. In general, it surprises me that legacy automakers are still betting on gas, hybrid, and hydrogen fuel cell vehicles. I love Tesla and their mission but in order to really have affordable electric cars, we need more legacy automakers to jump on board! Thought?
Toyota has no plans to produce a mass-market battery-electric vehicle, or BEV, until 2025.
The company's stated aim is for 1 million battery-electric and hydrogen fuel cell car sales by 2030 but executives have said this could be achieved several years earlier. Still, it equates only to about one-tenth of its global car sales in 2019. A simultaneous goal for 4.5 million annual hybrid sales by the end of the decade would make more than half its cars electrified, albeit not fully electric. By comparison, Volkswagen's 2030 BEV target is 40%. source
Toyota Motor Corp does not believe in lithium ion powered fully electric BEV's.
TMC wants to bypass lithium ion batteries altogether, and jump straight into Solid State batteries which have more energy density, and more rapid recharging.
Hence TMC is presently keeping R&D of traditional internal combustion engines & ICEV's to a minimum, while all their manpower and resources are focused on Solid State batteries and their dedicated e-TNGA chassis which should be released by 2025.
Presently, TMC is only using lithium ion fully electric BEV's in the Toyota C-HR BEV and Lexus UX300e sub-compacts using conventional ICEV TNGA GA-C compact platforms restricted to the Chinese market.
TMC believes that lithium ion prices must fall before they can be used in larger vehicles for the US market.
The world has issues with rare earth metals, and even cobalt and nickel - as the world begins de-coupling and reducing their dependency on China.
Last edited by peteharvey; Oct 9, 2020 at 03:54 PM.
I'm getting really tired of these fairy tales of how Toyota has this secret war chest of magic bullet solutions to EVs that they've yet to show any signs of using. They clearly want to do more with electrification as shown with the RAV-4 Prime, but like all other OEM's they're physically incapable of doing so because of limited battery supply. Where is the solid evidence that they are establishing the contracts with battery providers? Where is the solid evidence that they are working on their own fully electric platforms? So far there is nothing.
I'm getting really tired of these fairy tales of how Toyota has this secret war chest of magic bullet solutions to EVs that they've yet to show any signs of using. They clearly want to do more with electrification as shown with the RAV-4 Prime, but like all other OEM's they're physically incapable of doing so because of limited battery supply. Where is the solid evidence that they are establishing the contracts with battery providers? Where is the solid evidence that they are working on their own fully electric platforms? So far there is nothing.
Peteharvey has a point though...there just isn't enough batteries to go around so TMC is kinda late to the EV party so they have to source another form of batteries to get their electrification strategy up to par.I hope their sold state batteries are coming along...if they don't have something by 2025 they could be in a world of trouble.
Peteharvey has a point though...there just isn't enough batteries to go around so TMC is kinda late to the EV party so they have to source another form of batteries to get their electrification strategy up to par.I hope their sold state batteries are coming along...if they don't have something by 2025 they could be in a world of trouble.
Given how long TMC's development cycles are, if they were to use solid state batteries, they would already be using them, and we would already be hearing of or seeing working prototypes. TMC is not the type of company to rush out products with untested state-of-the-art technologies in a mere 5 years. There is no magic bullet. I can't realistically see them delivering a large EV lineup by 2025 with their current lack of progress on this front, if anything their current focus is on hybridization over EV's.
Given how long TMC's development cycles are, if they were to use solid state batteries, they would already be using them, and we would already be hearing of or seeing working prototypes. TMC is not the type of company to rush out products with untested state-of-the-art technologies in a mere 5 years. There is no magic bullet. I can't realistically see them delivering a large EV lineup by 2025 with their current lack of progress on this front, if anything their current focus is on hybridization over EV's.
You are probably right but I was giving Toyota the benefit of the doubt. I think their hybridization strategy is right for them. The RAV4 Prime is a great vehicle and I wish they made it more widely available. Not everyone wants a weak hybrid so I see the lack of powerful hybrids as a failing point for Toyota right now.
I'm getting really tired of these fairy tales of how Toyota has this secret war chest of magic bullet solutions to EVs that they've yet to show any signs of using. They clearly want to do more with electrification as shown with the RAV-4 Prime, but like all other OEM's they're physically incapable of doing so because of limited battery supply. Where is the solid evidence that they are establishing the contracts with battery providers? Where is the solid evidence that they are working on their own fully electric platforms? So far there is nothing.
It's the somewhere over the rainbow argument.
Originally Posted by EZZ
The RAV4 Prime is a great vehicle and I wish they made it more widely available.
It is interesting to me how they don't have enough batteries for ramping up electric cars sooner than 2025. TMC could easily ramp up a battery production facility. Also, solid state batteries does sound interesting but I would like to see some form of products out now in the North American market. I feel like TMC would easily out compete many other legacy automakers just on their great engineering. But I guess great engineering takes time!
It is interesting to me how they don't have enough batteries for ramping up electric cars sooner than 2025. TMC could easily ramp up a battery production facility.
That's not how it works. All batteries have to be sourced from independent manufacturers like Panasonic or LG Chem. Even Toyota sources their batteries from Panasonic.
With all the OEMS out there moving to EV's, there just aren't that many batteries available.
That's not how it works. All batteries have to be sourced from independent manufacturers like Panasonic or LG Chem. Even Toyota sources their batteries from Panasonic.
With all the OEMS out there moving to EV's, there just aren't that many batteries available.
Why could they not just build a plant and start producing them? Is it a patent issue? I don't imagine funds being a big issue (not taking COVID-19 losses into consideration).
Why could they not just build a plant and start producing them? Is it a patent issue? I don't imagine funds being a big issue (not taking COVID-19 losses into consideration).
Setting up battery factories doesn't magically gift you unlimited resources to build them. Ask Tesla.
Setting up battery factories doesn't magically gift you unlimited resources to build them. Ask Tesla.
no one said it would magically grant you batteries. That is why their is a need to invest into battery cell production. That is the whole point of Tesla giga factories and their second phase of battery production. Panasonic and LG couldn’t keep up that is why Tesla’s solution is making these production facilities.
no one said it would magically grant you batteries. That is why their is a need to invest into battery cell production. That is the whole point of Tesla giga factories and their second phase of battery production. Panasonic and LG couldn’t keep up that is why Tesla’s solution is making these production facilities.
I don't think Toyota believes in lithium ion. They are pursuing Hydrogen and solid state batteries instead.
I don't think Toyota believes in lithium ion. They are pursuing Hydrogen and solid state batteries instead.
Solid state batteries seem promising! Hydrogen fuel cell to me seems limited and almost a temporary fad. I believe the only station in the US are all California based. Plus the infrastructure wouldn’t make sense to build if a lot more companies are moving hybrid/full electric.
Fully Electric Lexus
