Why Is Lexus So Inconsistent Across their Models?
08-14-12, 06:26 PM
#31
Guest
Posts: n/a
I
I am a little surprised to see so many nitpick Lexus in this forum. I mean, Lexus makes the highest quality cars on earth and has the best dealer lineup and is fairly priced. It's fair to criticize it when it blunders but it seems pointless to pick nits. But that's just me.
I am a little surprised to see so many nitpick Lexus in this forum. I mean, Lexus makes the highest quality cars on earth and has the best dealer lineup and is fairly priced. It's fair to criticize it when it blunders but it seems pointless to pick nits. But that's just me.
, welcome to CL Ron. Great observation and a sad one way to many of us have posted about and nothing has changed. Things are worse .
08-14-12, 06:34 PM
#32
Like 1SICKLEX mentioned, just because the E63 AMG can be optioned with a panoramic sunroof it doesn't mean the E63 AMG isn't a luxury sports sedan. Luxury is about options. If the GS can have rear-seat audio/climate controls I don't see why the GS's rear seat passengers can't enjoy the luxury of more sky light as well. Since Lexus decided the GS F-Sport is more driver-focused and can't be optioned with rear-seat controls, I guess it's fine for the F-Sport to leave out the panoramic sunroof, but for the non-F-Sport version I don't see why a panoramic sunroof can't be included as part of the rear-seat package.
08-14-12, 06:42 PM
#33
Lexus Fanatic
I’ve been thinking about this a lot recently and I can’t think of a reason as to why Lexus is so inconsistent when it comes to their models. In my opinion, I don’t think there is another brand that is like this, and I offer my examples and thoughts. This is just random musings.
Perhaps it’s best to start by giving an example of what I mean. I recently saw a video review of the new ES and I noticed when they were showing the sunroof panel, the map lights are not LED. I am not sure if it’s part of some package but probably not. My RX has LED map lights even though the normal dome light is halogen. If I recall correctly, the GS, LS, LX, and so on all have LED map lights.
I offer this example not because it is significant that the ES does not have LED map lights. I offer it because it is representative of all these inconsistencies. Is it cost savings? That is the only reason I can think of, but how much money would it have cost to include it? Why a price reduction on the msrp price when you could charge, what, like $10 more for them?
The same goes to the 13 inch nav screen. This could have been an option on all the Lexus vehicles. They redesign an all new ES and they don’t even bother to include it. Why do you go all the trouble to create the 13 inch screen in other models (software, hardware)? And for good reason too, as they tout that you can see both the radio and nav screen at the same time. This is a major problem on my RX at least. So why do you “punish” the other drivers in lower model ranges? This is even more glaring when you consider the ES navigation is almost $1000 more than the option on the GS. If BMW can offer their wide screen option from 3 series to 7 series, then I think Lexus can too.
I bring in the blind spot monitor with cross traffic alert. Are you telling me that when they finished designing the GS with just the BSM and moved forward to design the ES with BSM-CTA, they couldn’t go back to the GS and include the software? It doesn’t look like there are any physical components as the intuitive park assist does the sensing already. Why not include it on the GS and RX which only have the basic BSM?
There are countless more examples but all this points to how Lexus does not create uniformity within their models. If we compare Mercedes, you can get a lot of options you find on the C class as you can on the S class. But even if you disregard pricey options, there is no way to explain on the basic level, why the CT does not having LED license plate lights when every other Lexus does!
Does anybody agree with me? Bueller? Bueller?
Perhaps it’s best to start by giving an example of what I mean. I recently saw a video review of the new ES and I noticed when they were showing the sunroof panel, the map lights are not LED. I am not sure if it’s part of some package but probably not. My RX has LED map lights even though the normal dome light is halogen. If I recall correctly, the GS, LS, LX, and so on all have LED map lights.
I offer this example not because it is significant that the ES does not have LED map lights. I offer it because it is representative of all these inconsistencies. Is it cost savings? That is the only reason I can think of, but how much money would it have cost to include it? Why a price reduction on the msrp price when you could charge, what, like $10 more for them?
The same goes to the 13 inch nav screen. This could have been an option on all the Lexus vehicles. They redesign an all new ES and they don’t even bother to include it. Why do you go all the trouble to create the 13 inch screen in other models (software, hardware)? And for good reason too, as they tout that you can see both the radio and nav screen at the same time. This is a major problem on my RX at least. So why do you “punish” the other drivers in lower model ranges? This is even more glaring when you consider the ES navigation is almost $1000 more than the option on the GS. If BMW can offer their wide screen option from 3 series to 7 series, then I think Lexus can too.
I bring in the blind spot monitor with cross traffic alert. Are you telling me that when they finished designing the GS with just the BSM and moved forward to design the ES with BSM-CTA, they couldn’t go back to the GS and include the software? It doesn’t look like there are any physical components as the intuitive park assist does the sensing already. Why not include it on the GS and RX which only have the basic BSM?
There are countless more examples but all this points to how Lexus does not create uniformity within their models. If we compare Mercedes, you can get a lot of options you find on the C class as you can on the S class. But even if you disregard pricey options, there is no way to explain on the basic level, why the CT does not having LED license plate lights when every other Lexus does!
Does anybody agree with me? Bueller? Bueller?
Lexus does not always debut with the latest and greatest technology on some of the products they make, Lexus also does not always add the newest technology as they sometimes wait until the cost has come down significantly before they add it.
On the flipside, take a look at Cadillac and the stuff they debut with and then look at the reliabilty of some of their products.
Generally Lexus waits until they do a full redesign before they add some things, but lately they have been getting better at adding features before the next gen.
One thing I do like about Lexus, is that they usually get certains features right when they do add them.
08-14-12, 06:46 PM
#34
Guest
Posts: n/a
As if on cue...
This is completely false. The LS debuted 11 world firsts and the refresh 3 for example. Lexus has debuted many firsts. For goodness sakes they were FIRST with the most COMPLICATED and TECHNOLOGICALLY ADVANCED CARS IN HYBRIDS. Now everyone copied Lexus. Did we forget?
What first has Caddy debuted? I honestly can't think of one, maybe I'm wrong. How could you use them as an example.
The GS 450h is the worlds first Atkinson cycle RWD hybrid. The LFA for crying out loud uses in-house carbon fiber where everyone else outside of utlra exotics outsources things.
The CT debuted multiple firsts as well as the HS in regards to recycling ability and their more environmentally friendly nature.
Now I am not saying Lexus is the most innovative brand but either people don't have the foggiest idea that Lexus does innovate or they rather just beat up the brand.
Another poster stated what I did. We are comparing older with newer cars and the company is currently undergoing a HUGE transition period.
Lexus is not consistent because it is the profits and costs of the cars they are most concerned about.
Lexus does not always debut with the latest and greatest technology on some of the products they make, Lexus also does not always add the newest technology as they sometimes wait until the cost has come down significantly before they add it.
On the flipside, take a look at Cadillac and the stuff they debut with and then look at the reliabilty of some of their products.
Generally Lexus waits until they do a full redesign before they add some things, but lately they have been getting better at adding features before the next gen.
One thing I do like about Lexus, is that they usually get certains features right when they do add them.
Lexus does not always debut with the latest and greatest technology on some of the products they make, Lexus also does not always add the newest technology as they sometimes wait until the cost has come down significantly before they add it.
On the flipside, take a look at Cadillac and the stuff they debut with and then look at the reliabilty of some of their products.
Generally Lexus waits until they do a full redesign before they add some things, but lately they have been getting better at adding features before the next gen.
One thing I do like about Lexus, is that they usually get certains features right when they do add them.
What first has Caddy debuted? I honestly can't think of one, maybe I'm wrong. How could you use them as an example.
The GS 450h is the worlds first Atkinson cycle RWD hybrid. The LFA for crying out loud uses in-house carbon fiber where everyone else outside of utlra exotics outsources things.
The CT debuted multiple firsts as well as the HS in regards to recycling ability and their more environmentally friendly nature.
Now I am not saying Lexus is the most innovative brand but either people don't have the foggiest idea that Lexus does innovate or they rather just beat up the brand.
Another poster stated what I did. We are comparing older with newer cars and the company is currently undergoing a HUGE transition period.
08-14-12, 07:46 PM
#35
Moderator
Thread Starter
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: San Francisco, CA
Posts: 12,044
Likes: 0
Received 69 Likes
on
42 Posts
Also, lets me honest that while the tsunami did affect lexus, it wasnt the whole story. A lot of things have contributed to the lower sales numbers today than 5 years ago
08-14-12, 08:18 PM
#36
Lexus Fanatic
iTrader: (20)
08-14-12, 08:22 PM
#37
Lexus Fanatic
As if on cue...
This is completely false. The LS debuted 11 world firsts and the refresh 3 for example. Lexus has debuted many firsts. For goodness sakes they were FIRST with the most COMPLICATED and TECHNOLOGICALLY ADVANCED CARS IN HYBRIDS. Now everyone copied Lexus. Did we forget?
What first has Caddy debuted? I honestly can't think of one, maybe I'm wrong. How could you use them as an example.
The GS 450h is the worlds first Atkinson cycle RWD hybrid. The LFA for crying out loud uses in-house carbon fiber where everyone else outside of utlra exotics outsources things.
The CT debuted multiple firsts as well as the HS in regards to recycling ability and their more environmentally friendly nature.
Now I am not saying Lexus is the most innovative brand but either people don't have the foggiest idea that Lexus does innovate or they rather just beat up the brand.
Another poster stated what I did. We are comparing older with newer cars and the company is currently undergoing a HUGE transition period.
This is completely false. The LS debuted 11 world firsts and the refresh 3 for example. Lexus has debuted many firsts. For goodness sakes they were FIRST with the most COMPLICATED and TECHNOLOGICALLY ADVANCED CARS IN HYBRIDS. Now everyone copied Lexus. Did we forget?
What first has Caddy debuted? I honestly can't think of one, maybe I'm wrong. How could you use them as an example.
The GS 450h is the worlds first Atkinson cycle RWD hybrid. The LFA for crying out loud uses in-house carbon fiber where everyone else outside of utlra exotics outsources things.
The CT debuted multiple firsts as well as the HS in regards to recycling ability and their more environmentally friendly nature.
Now I am not saying Lexus is the most innovative brand but either people don't have the foggiest idea that Lexus does innovate or they rather just beat up the brand.
Another poster stated what I did. We are comparing older with newer cars and the company is currently undergoing a HUGE transition period.
Or the GX and how it has a side hinged door.
And Lexus STILL does not have a 7 passenger crossover SUV.
08-14-12, 08:56 PM
#40
Lexus Fanatic
08-14-12, 09:43 PM
#41
Lexus Fanatic
iTrader: (20)
these may be shortcomings to you, but these points are not really about the thread title of consistency. please try to stay on topic and don't use any thread for just venting. thank you.
08-14-12, 09:54 PM
#42
. . .I am a little surprised to see so many nitpick Lexus in this forum. I mean, Lexus makes the highest quality cars on earth and has the best dealer lineup and is fairly priced. It's fair to criticize it when it blunders but it seems pointless to pick nits. But that's just me.
Lexus says they are relentlessly pursuing perfection. That means nit picking since their cars are so good, no? If they get 99% of everything right, relentless pursuit means focusing on the 1% that's not right.
If Lexus is smart, they should be reading this forum looking for the nitpicks from their customers and using that as input to their future designs when it makes sense.
I'm a Lexus customer and expect I will own more of their cars in the future. As such, I would hope they correct the valid nitpicks they see here. That will make the next generation cars harder to nitpick.
I'm all for constructive feedback which is not the same as bashing.
Having said all that, the inconsistency between models discussed in this thread is not of much concern to me in terms of my feedback to Lexus.
08-15-12, 04:48 AM
#43
Guest
Posts: n/a
off topic but i think they were first with MagneRide using Magnetorheological fluid. i think the new xts feature of a buzzer in the seat to warn of an object behind is unique (and great). although not a cadillac, i also LOVE Chevy Corvette's variable numbering on their speedo (up in 10's to about 80 then up in 20's from there - makes a lot of sense).
. So we have one first. You mention Lexus doesn't have a 7 seat passenger crossover yet omit that Lexus CREATED THE LUXURY CROSSOVER VEHICLE IN THE RX 300.
Sad
I think we all just hold Lexus to a higher standard. If they are pursuing perfection, then we should hold them to it. It shouldnt just be empty words.
Also, lets me honest that while the tsunami did affect lexus, it wasnt the whole story. A lot of things have contributed to the lower sales numbers today than 5 years ago
Also, lets me honest that while the tsunami did affect lexus, it wasnt the whole story. A lot of things have contributed to the lower sales numbers today than 5 years ago
but again they are in a HUGE transitionary period.
08-15-12, 04:56 AM
#44
That's why I like this forum.
Lexus says they are relentlessly pursuing perfection. That means nit picking since their cars are so good, no? If they get 99% of everything right, relentless pursuit means focusing on the 1% that's not right.
If Lexus is smart, they should be reading this forum looking for the nitpicks from their customers and using that as input to their future designs when it makes sense.
I'm a Lexus customer and expect I will own more of their cars in the future. As such, I would hope they correct the valid nitpicks they see here. That will make the next generation cars harder to nitpick.
I'm all for constructive feedback which is not the same as bashing.
Having said all that, the inconsistency between models discussed in this thread is not of much concern to me in terms of my feedback to Lexus.
Lexus says they are relentlessly pursuing perfection. That means nit picking since their cars are so good, no? If they get 99% of everything right, relentless pursuit means focusing on the 1% that's not right.
If Lexus is smart, they should be reading this forum looking for the nitpicks from their customers and using that as input to their future designs when it makes sense.
I'm a Lexus customer and expect I will own more of their cars in the future. As such, I would hope they correct the valid nitpicks they see here. That will make the next generation cars harder to nitpick.
I'm all for constructive feedback which is not the same as bashing.
Having said all that, the inconsistency between models discussed in this thread is not of much concern to me in terms of my feedback to Lexus.
If every Lexus owner was a Lexus fanboi like the 2-3 here,the Lexus line may not be as good as it is today.Constructive feedback can be a good thing.
I'm sure some Lexus personnel do read forums.
08-15-12, 05:16 AM
#45
Guest
Posts: n/a
They are well aware of concerns posted by people from forums to focus groups to emails giving feedback.There could be 500, 000 fanbois here Lexus is a product of the Kaizen Philosophy of "Continuous Improvement". It is ingrained in Toyota and of course Lexus. Even before internet forums Lexus was improving their products. The competition is too fierce for them to ever just rely on fanbois. Internally, Lexus is their own biggest critic which is partly why they move slowly compared to the Germans. They are super safe/critical of each move they make. Lexus has inconsistencies but has never rested on laurels and depended on fanbois to buy average and sub-par products and justify things with high sales. Far from it. The majority of the time the vehicles are significant improvements each generation and sell well because they are outstanding products.
I think its fair to mention some inconsistencies like how maybe the ES has a optional panamaric roof and the GS does not. Its fair to say that the ESh does not offer LEDs when even the CTh does. Its fair to say the LS f-sport has fog lamps and the GS F-sport does not. Its even fair to say the LFA exists and the RX does lol.
It is being critical and not well thought out to say the new LS has keyless entry and a 2004 RX does not. Almost a 10 year gap. its not fair to say Lexus does not innovate and nit-pick items and not mention their innovations.