I'm looking at this 95' sc300
11-14-17, 06:53 PM
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I'm looking at this 95' sc300
Hello everyone, I'm currently looking at this 95' SC300 Manual.
https://www.autotrader.com/cars-for-...delCode1=SC300
I'm fairly new into JDM just want to build a nice car under low budget.
It's a 2jz-ge
Is this a good engine? Would i be able to get nice gains out of it? If so which mods would give me the most gains?
Would i be better off swapping to 2jz-gte? How much it be to swap from 2jz-ge to 2jz-gte?
I went to see the car, it's really clean inside and out. theres one problem, the power steering wheel doesnt move up or down. its a electronic so i think its broken, how much would it be to replace that?
I know the carfax dont show but its only have a little hit to the rear and nothing else. its fixed now
please any help is good help.
https://www.autotrader.com/cars-for-...delCode1=SC300
I'm fairly new into JDM just want to build a nice car under low budget.
It's a 2jz-ge
Is this a good engine? Would i be able to get nice gains out of it? If so which mods would give me the most gains?
Would i be better off swapping to 2jz-gte? How much it be to swap from 2jz-ge to 2jz-gte?
I went to see the car, it's really clean inside and out. theres one problem, the power steering wheel doesnt move up or down. its a electronic so i think its broken, how much would it be to replace that?
I know the carfax dont show but its only have a little hit to the rear and nothing else. its fixed now
please any help is good help.
11-15-17, 11:03 AM
#2
If you havent already read about it, the JZZ31 in general is a good platform and lots of mods available from the soarer and supra. The naturally aspirated 2JZ-GE is rock solid engine that can go well past a quarter millions with routine maintenance. With the relatively low miles, the current engine is a good candidate to turbo, which will give you the most gains. Some of the turbo'd guys here can chime in if you have any questions about going turbo. As for the steering wheel, there are some DIY and writeups that talk about fixing it. Good luck on your research!
11-16-17, 02:31 AM
#4
Victor, nice find! Very low miles and an original 5-speed manual in what appears to be excellent condition.
The 2JZ-GE is a very good engine. It is not overly powerful in stock form with only 225hp / 210 ft-lbs of torque which hits its peak torque at 4800 RPM but it is still plenty torquey and it is not slouch at all. The factory 5-speed manual makes a huge difference in how fun these cars can be. However to match up to a V8 Mustang's or M3's power it would need a turbocharger setup or engine swap. And a stronger manual gearbox option for long term turbo use. The engine is not very responsive to naturally aspirated engine modifications-- it's not worth it to go that route. The only real engine modification for power is turbocharging.
But before you get into that, decide on what you want from the car and how you will use it. There several common suspension, braking, suspension bushing, rear LSD and other modifications that can really change the car's character from how it feels in stock form before you even get into more horsepower.
There is a lot to read up on to get started if you're very new to these cars but as Jadu has said they are a great platform with many parts shared or cross-compatible with the Toyota Supra MKIV and Toyota Soarer Z30.
...
For the steering column, that is a common issue to repair. It's not expensive or hard to fix following these DIY threads:
https://www.clublexus.com/forums/sc-...ng-repair.html
https://www.clublexus.com/forums/sc-...ng-column.html
...
As for other common things that can go wrong:
-- front lower control arm bushings and eventually the non-replaceable factory ball joints on those (replace with OEM Lexus or if available you can use front LCA's for a Supra MKIV; an aftermarket alternative is being evaluated but so far nothing conclusive; there is also an pricey aftermarket set of arms made by Figs Engineering)
-- factory steering rack bushings: we recommend replacing the originals with the $40 bushing set from Daizen Sport Tuning or another aftermarket equivalent
-- door lock actuators, with enough years of cycling, may require replacement
-- factory front brakes, while nothing goes wrong with them, are VERY under sized for this car especially when used as a high performance vehicle. The common and cheap upgrade is front brake calipers from a 1995-2000 Lexus LS400. Much documentation on this is available. The upgrade makes the car's stopping power far more capable and it improves the overall safety. Minimum 17" wheels with enough offset are required for this.
-- factory center vents tend to crack. This is an extremely common occurrence and there is no fix for it. It is a design flaw on the part of Toyota/Lexus for placing ABS plastic right against real wood and exposing both to rapidly changing heat and cold cycles from the heater and air conditioning. This is very minor if it happens to your car however. It does not hamper any function if it does happen to your car's center vent and it is not extremely obvious to see at a casual glance unless you examine it up close.
-- factory CD changer in the trunk was never a great design and tends to go out. An alternative is to perform a DIY aux-in jack modification to the factory stereo (if your factory stereo does NOT say "Nakamichi" on the front panel) and rig the factory CD function to go into a "CD ERROR" mode on the stereo LCD which effectively gives you a clear channel for your aux-in jack for any input device you would like! Also alternatively there is a big thread made by Raine which details how to remove the factory stereo and wire your car the correct way for an aftermarket head unit.
-- factory headlights are OK but a plug and play aftermarket Phillips 4200/4300K HID conversion using the factory bulb locations is a good way to improve your car's lighting visibility. These cars use an old style Halogen bulb projector lens so this is a decent way to go HID and achieve acceptable results. After having vetted a few crapshoot aftermarket HID companies I would recommend the folks at XenonDepot. They actually have customer service and their kits stand up. The next step up from this would be sending your original headlight housings into Organized Garage Status for a much more in depth conversion to HID with all sorts of options they offer.
-- The factory heater control valve (HCV) assembly's main valve can fail with very high miles (I would not concern yourself with this with only 119k). The factory assembly can be obtained and there is also a thread showing a couple of ways to replace a broken HCV valve itself.
-- the engine has very few if any flaws. It is bulletproof if maintained well. There are some common things required every 60k such as the timing belt, spark plugs/wires/cap/rotor.
-- the main engine ECU does have one major weakness with enough age: leaking original capacitors. The fix for this is to send it to Tanin Auto Electronix to have new capacitors put in. You will know when this is an issue if the car begins electrically behaving abnormally, loses power or exhibits over-fueling. This can be taken care of preventatively before any issues at all show up or once issues have arisen. It's not really triggered due to mileage so much as age. All SC's (300's and 400's as well as several other Toyota/Lexus cars from 1985-1998) may develop this at completely different ages and odometer readings. Once the ECU is rebuilt it is good for at least another 20+ years. Very easily remedied if this ever becomes an issue
-- the tilt column may have an issue as you have found out. Easy and cheap DIY repair.
-- in rare cases the Mirror Control ECU may fail. Rare to happen but a few cars with very high mileage have been affected. Currently replacement with a used or new ECU is the fix.
-- factory power retracting antenna can have broken if left up in a car auto-wash or the motor itself can go bad. This is an easy repair or replacement back to factory operation or the factory power retracting antenna can be replaced with an aftermarket solution. Some people use an Acura MDX antenna of certain years or a Honda S2000 antenna. factory repair or aftermarket replacement both do the trick. The factory antenna has incredible FM & AM reception range though... if that matters to you.
-- factory cluster display bulbs may need replacing if any have gone bad. Lexus sells these bulbs to pop in. Factory lighted gauge needles can go bad eventually. If this happens to be the case, DO NOT SEND YOUR CLUSTER TO LEXTECH LIGHTING!!! A lot of advertising exists for this company for Lexus cluster repairs but they are not the place to go to. Instead, once again we recommend a cluster requiring lighting repair be sent to Tanin Auto Electronix. The Tanin folks know what they are doing for these repairs and also offer some different non-factory color options... IF you wish to change some of the gauge cluster lighting colors.
-- factory HVAC control LCD going bad is a common failure. The unit still works but you can't see what mode it is in. Tanin Auto and a few ebay companies repairs these. It involves de-soldering the old broken factory LCD from that unit and installing a fresh LCD panel.
-- factory leather seats and leather surfaces can be worn or ripped due to age and use from previous owners. There is a quality fix for any of these.
-- floor mats: even if the factory floor mats are worn out and in bad shape there are companies that make non-logo'd replacement mats in the factory cut and there are also several recommendations for other Lexus mats that are still new and available that fit the 92-2000 SC.
-- interior door upper surrounds can crack in the middle due to age, sun exposure and/or too much resting of elbows on their middle for years (best to avoid that if you can). Again, a design flaw on the part of Toyota/Lexus but if the crack has not become very bad yet they can be repaired and the vinyl covering can be mended. Not all SC's are affected by this in the same way or at the same time. It is a common quirk with these cars.
...
I am going to stop there because those are all the main flaws of the SC series. Notice how I haven't mentioned anything of a mechanical or driveline nature that is a common failure point? The things listed above are all the well known minor cosmetic issues that can arise once these cars get 20+ years old. The cars themselves however are very reliable and are mechanically bulletproof. You can expect an old Lexus of this era to be a very reliable car that will not let you down. That also goes for a properly sorted GTE swapped example or well sorted NA-T example. They are very tough, over engineered cars.
Take a look around at some of the "sticky" threads and to get a greater idea of where you can take things with this car if you decide to buy it.
Whether you keep it 100% stock or wish to modify it the 1992-2000 SC's are very good cars.
The 2JZ-GE is a very good engine. It is not overly powerful in stock form with only 225hp / 210 ft-lbs of torque which hits its peak torque at 4800 RPM but it is still plenty torquey and it is not slouch at all. The factory 5-speed manual makes a huge difference in how fun these cars can be. However to match up to a V8 Mustang's or M3's power it would need a turbocharger setup or engine swap. And a stronger manual gearbox option for long term turbo use. The engine is not very responsive to naturally aspirated engine modifications-- it's not worth it to go that route. The only real engine modification for power is turbocharging.
But before you get into that, decide on what you want from the car and how you will use it. There several common suspension, braking, suspension bushing, rear LSD and other modifications that can really change the car's character from how it feels in stock form before you even get into more horsepower.
There is a lot to read up on to get started if you're very new to these cars but as Jadu has said they are a great platform with many parts shared or cross-compatible with the Toyota Supra MKIV and Toyota Soarer Z30.
...
For the steering column, that is a common issue to repair. It's not expensive or hard to fix following these DIY threads:
https://www.clublexus.com/forums/sc-...ng-repair.html
https://www.clublexus.com/forums/sc-...ng-column.html
...
As for other common things that can go wrong:
-- front lower control arm bushings and eventually the non-replaceable factory ball joints on those (replace with OEM Lexus or if available you can use front LCA's for a Supra MKIV; an aftermarket alternative is being evaluated but so far nothing conclusive; there is also an pricey aftermarket set of arms made by Figs Engineering)
-- factory steering rack bushings: we recommend replacing the originals with the $40 bushing set from Daizen Sport Tuning or another aftermarket equivalent
-- door lock actuators, with enough years of cycling, may require replacement
-- factory front brakes, while nothing goes wrong with them, are VERY under sized for this car especially when used as a high performance vehicle. The common and cheap upgrade is front brake calipers from a 1995-2000 Lexus LS400. Much documentation on this is available. The upgrade makes the car's stopping power far more capable and it improves the overall safety. Minimum 17" wheels with enough offset are required for this.
-- factory center vents tend to crack. This is an extremely common occurrence and there is no fix for it. It is a design flaw on the part of Toyota/Lexus for placing ABS plastic right against real wood and exposing both to rapidly changing heat and cold cycles from the heater and air conditioning. This is very minor if it happens to your car however. It does not hamper any function if it does happen to your car's center vent and it is not extremely obvious to see at a casual glance unless you examine it up close.
-- factory CD changer in the trunk was never a great design and tends to go out. An alternative is to perform a DIY aux-in jack modification to the factory stereo (if your factory stereo does NOT say "Nakamichi" on the front panel) and rig the factory CD function to go into a "CD ERROR" mode on the stereo LCD which effectively gives you a clear channel for your aux-in jack for any input device you would like! Also alternatively there is a big thread made by Raine which details how to remove the factory stereo and wire your car the correct way for an aftermarket head unit.
-- factory headlights are OK but a plug and play aftermarket Phillips 4200/4300K HID conversion using the factory bulb locations is a good way to improve your car's lighting visibility. These cars use an old style Halogen bulb projector lens so this is a decent way to go HID and achieve acceptable results. After having vetted a few crapshoot aftermarket HID companies I would recommend the folks at XenonDepot. They actually have customer service and their kits stand up. The next step up from this would be sending your original headlight housings into Organized Garage Status for a much more in depth conversion to HID with all sorts of options they offer.
-- The factory heater control valve (HCV) assembly's main valve can fail with very high miles (I would not concern yourself with this with only 119k). The factory assembly can be obtained and there is also a thread showing a couple of ways to replace a broken HCV valve itself.
-- the engine has very few if any flaws. It is bulletproof if maintained well. There are some common things required every 60k such as the timing belt, spark plugs/wires/cap/rotor.
-- the main engine ECU does have one major weakness with enough age: leaking original capacitors. The fix for this is to send it to Tanin Auto Electronix to have new capacitors put in. You will know when this is an issue if the car begins electrically behaving abnormally, loses power or exhibits over-fueling. This can be taken care of preventatively before any issues at all show up or once issues have arisen. It's not really triggered due to mileage so much as age. All SC's (300's and 400's as well as several other Toyota/Lexus cars from 1985-1998) may develop this at completely different ages and odometer readings. Once the ECU is rebuilt it is good for at least another 20+ years. Very easily remedied if this ever becomes an issue
-- the tilt column may have an issue as you have found out. Easy and cheap DIY repair.
-- in rare cases the Mirror Control ECU may fail. Rare to happen but a few cars with very high mileage have been affected. Currently replacement with a used or new ECU is the fix.
-- factory power retracting antenna can have broken if left up in a car auto-wash or the motor itself can go bad. This is an easy repair or replacement back to factory operation or the factory power retracting antenna can be replaced with an aftermarket solution. Some people use an Acura MDX antenna of certain years or a Honda S2000 antenna. factory repair or aftermarket replacement both do the trick. The factory antenna has incredible FM & AM reception range though... if that matters to you.
-- factory cluster display bulbs may need replacing if any have gone bad. Lexus sells these bulbs to pop in. Factory lighted gauge needles can go bad eventually. If this happens to be the case, DO NOT SEND YOUR CLUSTER TO LEXTECH LIGHTING!!! A lot of advertising exists for this company for Lexus cluster repairs but they are not the place to go to. Instead, once again we recommend a cluster requiring lighting repair be sent to Tanin Auto Electronix. The Tanin folks know what they are doing for these repairs and also offer some different non-factory color options... IF you wish to change some of the gauge cluster lighting colors.
-- factory HVAC control LCD going bad is a common failure. The unit still works but you can't see what mode it is in. Tanin Auto and a few ebay companies repairs these. It involves de-soldering the old broken factory LCD from that unit and installing a fresh LCD panel.
-- factory leather seats and leather surfaces can be worn or ripped due to age and use from previous owners. There is a quality fix for any of these.
-- floor mats: even if the factory floor mats are worn out and in bad shape there are companies that make non-logo'd replacement mats in the factory cut and there are also several recommendations for other Lexus mats that are still new and available that fit the 92-2000 SC.
-- interior door upper surrounds can crack in the middle due to age, sun exposure and/or too much resting of elbows on their middle for years (best to avoid that if you can). Again, a design flaw on the part of Toyota/Lexus but if the crack has not become very bad yet they can be repaired and the vinyl covering can be mended. Not all SC's are affected by this in the same way or at the same time. It is a common quirk with these cars.
...
I am going to stop there because those are all the main flaws of the SC series. Notice how I haven't mentioned anything of a mechanical or driveline nature that is a common failure point? The things listed above are all the well known minor cosmetic issues that can arise once these cars get 20+ years old. The cars themselves however are very reliable and are mechanically bulletproof. You can expect an old Lexus of this era to be a very reliable car that will not let you down. That also goes for a properly sorted GTE swapped example or well sorted NA-T example. They are very tough, over engineered cars.
Take a look around at some of the "sticky" threads and to get a greater idea of where you can take things with this car if you decide to buy it.
Whether you keep it 100% stock or wish to modify it the 1992-2000 SC's are very good cars.
The following 2 users liked this post by KahnBB6:
Deegee (11-17-17),
XenonDepot (11-22-17)
11-16-17, 10:15 AM
#5
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super helpful! I really appreciate it!
there's two ways I'd like to go with this car
Stay with the 2jz-ge and see how much power I can get out of it or swap to JDM 2jz-gte.
One question how much power can I get out of the 2jz-ge can I hit over 400whp?
How much would it be to swap to 2jz-gte? If i do swap, would I be able to sell my 2jz-ge or would I have to stay with it?
I'd like to get gains out of it but not waste too much money. I'm getting this car to save up for my dream car which is an ISF.
there's two ways I'd like to go with this car
Stay with the 2jz-ge and see how much power I can get out of it or swap to JDM 2jz-gte.
One question how much power can I get out of the 2jz-ge can I hit over 400whp?
How much would it be to swap to 2jz-gte? If i do swap, would I be able to sell my 2jz-ge or would I have to stay with it?
I'd like to get gains out of it but not waste too much money. I'm getting this car to save up for my dream car which is an ISF.
11-16-17, 03:48 PM
#7
So long as it's up to date with its maintenance schedule and all the major components are in good shape an SC300 5-speed is excellent on long road trips. I've done L.A. to Florida and back in mine plus several weekend camping trips from L.A. to California mountains and Death Valley.
Road salt accumulation in the winter is all I would be concerned about. If you will encounter snow then I would invest in a set of snow tires. Along with wise winter driving technique that is the biggest safety improvement to any car that can be made when it gets into severe cold weather conditions.
Now you should be aware that all 1992-1997 SC300 5-speed M/T's lack any traction control system. They all have cruise control and ABS braking but the antiquated "TRAC" system (traction control for early 90's Toyota/Lexus cars) was not offered. So you must drive wisely to the conditions as with any classic car before the complexity of modern traction control safety systems. Don't let this deter you though. It shouldn't. The SC is a very safe car.
I would recommend the 1995-2000 LS400 front brake caliper upgrade, some 17"x8" rims (or wider in the rear) and some wider high performance summer compound tires. 255mm or 265mm wide in the rear without a turbocharged engine being sufficient. The braking upgrade and added grip are very good safety improvements to the car. Also the simple HID upgrade to the headlights that I mentioned would be good for long road trips.
I would say that an original SC300 5-speed manual with a turbocharged engine (or an imported Soarer 1JZ) is for some people just as desirable a dream car as is the IS-F so when it comes to what we'd recommend to have equal or greater performance than a 1st gen IS-F that's going to be complicated to answer. I don't even know what those cars go for these days. Also, the first two model years lacked the Torsen LSD that the later IS-F's got so that has to be addressed in those.
With low miles like this the engine should be good to handle 500whp or so with the rest of the numerous supporting mods that you'll need to do it for an NA-T setup. You should still perform a compression test and leak down test before you replace the head gasket with a thicker one. Why? Because you want to know the health of the piston rings as to their sealing. But at 119k miles with a stock engine they should be perfectly fine. Still... always test first.
Doing an NA-T 2JZ-GE the right and reliable way isn't cheap but I will have to let other members with more experience chime in here. Generally on a budget NA-T build though you will want to find and use an Aristo 2JZ-GTE ECU for engine management since all GTE ECU's are programmed well to read boost pressure while all GE ECU's are not. There is a LOT more to one of those builds, however.
For engine swaps you can do a 1JZ-GTE Non-VVT-i, 1JZ-GTE VVT-i, 2JZ-GTE Non-VVT-i or a 2JZ-GTE VVT-i. They all have varying costs. I hear that the VVT-i GTE's are better on cost these days but know that there is a little more harness wiring require to adapt them to a pre-1998 chassis. If you're determined then that still should not deter you-- many people are embracing the GTE VVT-i engines now as compared to years past. They are becoming more popular.
I am sorry though... I don't have figures I can give you off the top of my head. Other members are more familiar with the current ballpark costs with all of these options. I have built a factory stock USDM 2JZ-GTE from scratch for CA emission purposes but that is NOT going to be a common total invested figure that you would encounter and I would say it's not comparable at all in cost to buying an imported JDM 2JZ-GTE engine set (which is cheaper than what I did).
However, consider this: how far off are you realistically from buying a used IS-F that you want? Are they really that up there in real world used market value right now? The SC is an equally great car that, once set up well, is going to rival the IS-F. And you get a manual transmission as a plus over the IS-F. In fact, you have several very strong manual transmission alternatives to the non-turbo factory W58 5-speed transmission in the SC. My point is that if you want to go the full monty and do a 2JZ-GTE swap to your car that is very doable and you will still have a reliable manual rear-drive coupe that is very powerful.
But it takes some investment to do this. Another reason why I have said don't bother with any naturally aspirated modifications at all. Focus on the suspension, braking, wheels, tires, small fixes and various small improvements. Or do the big no brainers such as the brake upgrade and very quickly get into planning out an NA-T build or GTE engine swap right from the start.
Without a turbo but with lots of suspension work, upgraded brakes and an LSD (with the stock 4.083 final drive or a 4.272 final drive) and such an SC 5-speed with the stock engine feels and drives like a big FR-S. Except the engine loves to rev. Now you'd think because it's not that powerful without a turbo that it's not fun to drive. Wrong. Dead wrong. I am finally coming close to a 2JZ-GTE engine swap myself but I will still argue my position on that without a flinch.
Would you sometimes, especially in very hot summer heat, wish you had more power courtesy of a turbo? Of course you would. But once you've taken the floaty hovercraft suspension qualities out of a 100% stock SC 5-speed and improved the braking confidence it's a luxury muscle driver's car (that actually handles) that just lacks for serious horsepower. The stock NA power is still enough to push the car like the performance driver's machine that it is even if it definitely isn't Mustang V8 or Supra TT fast off the line. A turbo truly changes everything but it isn't the only thing that makes a manual SC fun to drive.
Now that said, I'm also not really trying to convince you not to turbocharge an SC 5-speed. If you want to, you should go for it. I'm just pointing out that at least from the experience of owning a manual SC as a driver's car the stock engine still provides a lot of fun even if it isn't truly fast in non-turbo form.
Conversely, once you get into a well sorted NA-T or GTE SC it becomes a different and very addictive and satisfying animal.
But since you brought up getting this car as a cheaper alternative in the interim to an IS-F I thought it might be of benefit for you to hear some of these points. Personally I cannot help but be biased in that I'd take a turbocharged manual transmission SC over an IS-F hands down but your preference and attraction to either car may be different.
An even more long term possibility: why not have both cars?
Road salt accumulation in the winter is all I would be concerned about. If you will encounter snow then I would invest in a set of snow tires. Along with wise winter driving technique that is the biggest safety improvement to any car that can be made when it gets into severe cold weather conditions.
Now you should be aware that all 1992-1997 SC300 5-speed M/T's lack any traction control system. They all have cruise control and ABS braking but the antiquated "TRAC" system (traction control for early 90's Toyota/Lexus cars) was not offered. So you must drive wisely to the conditions as with any classic car before the complexity of modern traction control safety systems. Don't let this deter you though. It shouldn't. The SC is a very safe car.
I would recommend the 1995-2000 LS400 front brake caliper upgrade, some 17"x8" rims (or wider in the rear) and some wider high performance summer compound tires. 255mm or 265mm wide in the rear without a turbocharged engine being sufficient. The braking upgrade and added grip are very good safety improvements to the car. Also the simple HID upgrade to the headlights that I mentioned would be good for long road trips.
I would say that an original SC300 5-speed manual with a turbocharged engine (or an imported Soarer 1JZ) is for some people just as desirable a dream car as is the IS-F so when it comes to what we'd recommend to have equal or greater performance than a 1st gen IS-F that's going to be complicated to answer. I don't even know what those cars go for these days. Also, the first two model years lacked the Torsen LSD that the later IS-F's got so that has to be addressed in those.
With low miles like this the engine should be good to handle 500whp or so with the rest of the numerous supporting mods that you'll need to do it for an NA-T setup. You should still perform a compression test and leak down test before you replace the head gasket with a thicker one. Why? Because you want to know the health of the piston rings as to their sealing. But at 119k miles with a stock engine they should be perfectly fine. Still... always test first.
Doing an NA-T 2JZ-GE the right and reliable way isn't cheap but I will have to let other members with more experience chime in here. Generally on a budget NA-T build though you will want to find and use an Aristo 2JZ-GTE ECU for engine management since all GTE ECU's are programmed well to read boost pressure while all GE ECU's are not. There is a LOT more to one of those builds, however.
For engine swaps you can do a 1JZ-GTE Non-VVT-i, 1JZ-GTE VVT-i, 2JZ-GTE Non-VVT-i or a 2JZ-GTE VVT-i. They all have varying costs. I hear that the VVT-i GTE's are better on cost these days but know that there is a little more harness wiring require to adapt them to a pre-1998 chassis. If you're determined then that still should not deter you-- many people are embracing the GTE VVT-i engines now as compared to years past. They are becoming more popular.
I am sorry though... I don't have figures I can give you off the top of my head. Other members are more familiar with the current ballpark costs with all of these options. I have built a factory stock USDM 2JZ-GTE from scratch for CA emission purposes but that is NOT going to be a common total invested figure that you would encounter and I would say it's not comparable at all in cost to buying an imported JDM 2JZ-GTE engine set (which is cheaper than what I did).
However, consider this: how far off are you realistically from buying a used IS-F that you want? Are they really that up there in real world used market value right now? The SC is an equally great car that, once set up well, is going to rival the IS-F. And you get a manual transmission as a plus over the IS-F. In fact, you have several very strong manual transmission alternatives to the non-turbo factory W58 5-speed transmission in the SC. My point is that if you want to go the full monty and do a 2JZ-GTE swap to your car that is very doable and you will still have a reliable manual rear-drive coupe that is very powerful.
But it takes some investment to do this. Another reason why I have said don't bother with any naturally aspirated modifications at all. Focus on the suspension, braking, wheels, tires, small fixes and various small improvements. Or do the big no brainers such as the brake upgrade and very quickly get into planning out an NA-T build or GTE engine swap right from the start.
Without a turbo but with lots of suspension work, upgraded brakes and an LSD (with the stock 4.083 final drive or a 4.272 final drive) and such an SC 5-speed with the stock engine feels and drives like a big FR-S. Except the engine loves to rev. Now you'd think because it's not that powerful without a turbo that it's not fun to drive. Wrong. Dead wrong. I am finally coming close to a 2JZ-GTE engine swap myself but I will still argue my position on that without a flinch.
Would you sometimes, especially in very hot summer heat, wish you had more power courtesy of a turbo? Of course you would. But once you've taken the floaty hovercraft suspension qualities out of a 100% stock SC 5-speed and improved the braking confidence it's a luxury muscle driver's car (that actually handles) that just lacks for serious horsepower. The stock NA power is still enough to push the car like the performance driver's machine that it is even if it definitely isn't Mustang V8 or Supra TT fast off the line. A turbo truly changes everything but it isn't the only thing that makes a manual SC fun to drive.
Now that said, I'm also not really trying to convince you not to turbocharge an SC 5-speed. If you want to, you should go for it. I'm just pointing out that at least from the experience of owning a manual SC as a driver's car the stock engine still provides a lot of fun even if it isn't truly fast in non-turbo form.
Conversely, once you get into a well sorted NA-T or GTE SC it becomes a different and very addictive and satisfying animal.
But since you brought up getting this car as a cheaper alternative in the interim to an IS-F I thought it might be of benefit for you to hear some of these points. Personally I cannot help but be biased in that I'd take a turbocharged manual transmission SC over an IS-F hands down but your preference and attraction to either car may be different.
An even more long term possibility: why not have both cars?
Last edited by KahnBB6; 11-16-17 at 04:01 PM.
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Deegee (11-17-17)
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11-16-17, 05:21 PM
#8
for that price and with your lack of wrenching experience i'd say get an is300 manual with comparable miles. If a shops going to end up doing your turbo work the is will be a better bet i think for you. An older Sc300 especially turbo is going to have things happen. I just had my heater control valve crack mid 3 hour trip through the rocky mountains and luckily i was able to rig a bypass together find a stream fill the car back up and get where i need to go. I drive a turbo charged sc300 with a jdm ecu per Alisc3's mod and its great but i think you would like a lighter weight 2jz powered newer version is300 in manual for the same price.
If your sure u want the Sc300 i think that's a lot of money to pay for a 22 year old car that your planing on dropping another 5-10k into If the car was 6000 or 5000 than that would be alright amount to pay in my opinion
I got my 5 speed 1993 sc300 for 1300 with a spun bearing with everything else in pretty good shape. This might be a route for you to consider if your thinking of swaping a turbo engine in then get one for the low with a bad engine.
If your sure u want the Sc300 i think that's a lot of money to pay for a 22 year old car that your planing on dropping another 5-10k into If the car was 6000 or 5000 than that would be alright amount to pay in my opinion
I got my 5 speed 1993 sc300 for 1300 with a spun bearing with everything else in pretty good shape. This might be a route for you to consider if your thinking of swaping a turbo engine in then get one for the low with a bad engine.
11-19-17, 02:27 PM
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I came to the conclusion, thank you all for helping out and giving me nice advice. I went to go look at the car a second time, the car needs another 2k for it to be 100% it needs a new timing belt, it has some leaking coming from the engine, needs new rotors.
I love the car but I'm looking for a daily driver. In my situation I can't afford to waste time on going through all that hassle. I need a car that needs no work to it. I will buy a sc300 manual one day. If you guys find one thats in good condition and stock under 7,000 then I'd love to see. I got excited because it was near my house and that moding potential is crazy high. I'm young I always wanted a tuner car still do.
I think I will have to go for this ISF I've been looking at aswell.
I love the car but I'm looking for a daily driver. In my situation I can't afford to waste time on going through all that hassle. I need a car that needs no work to it. I will buy a sc300 manual one day. If you guys find one thats in good condition and stock under 7,000 then I'd love to see. I got excited because it was near my house and that moding potential is crazy high. I'm young I always wanted a tuner car still do.
I think I will have to go for this ISF I've been looking at aswell.
11-19-17, 03:26 PM
#10
Glad to help, Victor!
Honestly though you DID find an SC300 5-speed with very low miles in very good condition. The asking price is on the higher end for this one but the couple of issues you mentioned should be easily negotiable to knock it down a bit.
The timing belt service (plus a water pump if there are no records of it being ever replaced) should be worth $800-$1,000 or so at a Lexus dealer (less elsewhere and especially if you don't buy the parts from a regular Lexus dealer that will charge full MSRP+ on the parts)
The oil leaking from the engine is likely from the valve cover gaskets. That is a common issue due to 20+ years of age wearing on those rubber gaskets. They should always be replaced with the Toyota/Lexus OEM rubber gaskets. It is not a crazy thing to fix at all, just tedious to get into and put everything back on if you do it yourself.
New brake rotors... well... that's no big deal either. In fact, if intending to drive spiritedly I would recommend just going right into a 95-2000 LS400 front brake caliper upgrade (and a set of 17" rims) to give the car the brakes it should have had from the factory.
These are actually very reliable daily driver cars in their stock tune. I use a 1993 as a daily with about 250k on the clock.
I know you've made your decision already. I just wanted to point out that those couple of things you noticed that the car needed really are just common things to be expected with any car of this age. There aren't many of these manual SC's in circulation in such good condition as this and they do have an excellent track record. It doesn't mean you can't find another one eventually or that the price on this one shouldn't be negotiated (it should be) but if you do like this particular model just keep in mind that they won't always show up for sale and condition will vary from car to car.
All in all, this one is in pretty good condition from the sound of it. It is a rare 22 year old Toyota from their best era with pretty low mileage. A couple of very minor things to service shouldn't be a surprise.
Just trying to give some perspective as to its condition
That said, if you're set on the IS-F again, good luck and I hope you find a good model that fits your needs and wants!
Honestly though you DID find an SC300 5-speed with very low miles in very good condition. The asking price is on the higher end for this one but the couple of issues you mentioned should be easily negotiable to knock it down a bit.
The timing belt service (plus a water pump if there are no records of it being ever replaced) should be worth $800-$1,000 or so at a Lexus dealer (less elsewhere and especially if you don't buy the parts from a regular Lexus dealer that will charge full MSRP+ on the parts)
The oil leaking from the engine is likely from the valve cover gaskets. That is a common issue due to 20+ years of age wearing on those rubber gaskets. They should always be replaced with the Toyota/Lexus OEM rubber gaskets. It is not a crazy thing to fix at all, just tedious to get into and put everything back on if you do it yourself.
New brake rotors... well... that's no big deal either. In fact, if intending to drive spiritedly I would recommend just going right into a 95-2000 LS400 front brake caliper upgrade (and a set of 17" rims) to give the car the brakes it should have had from the factory.
These are actually very reliable daily driver cars in their stock tune. I use a 1993 as a daily with about 250k on the clock.
I know you've made your decision already. I just wanted to point out that those couple of things you noticed that the car needed really are just common things to be expected with any car of this age. There aren't many of these manual SC's in circulation in such good condition as this and they do have an excellent track record. It doesn't mean you can't find another one eventually or that the price on this one shouldn't be negotiated (it should be) but if you do like this particular model just keep in mind that they won't always show up for sale and condition will vary from car to car.
All in all, this one is in pretty good condition from the sound of it. It is a rare 22 year old Toyota from their best era with pretty low mileage. A couple of very minor things to service shouldn't be a surprise.
Just trying to give some perspective as to its condition
That said, if you're set on the IS-F again, good luck and I hope you find a good model that fits your needs and wants!
11-19-17, 03:47 PM
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it's not that I made my final decision yet.
I love the IS-F stance super clean to me.
I love this car for the manual. Love that it can be unlocked to be a scary beast.
I feel like if I give up on this car that I'll miss out on something great. I love it because it's in my budget more than the IS-F. I do look at the sc300 and say damn I can turn this car to look like a million bucks. It doesn't seem too expensive. By fixing all the stuff I named, would I be clear of fixing those parts again anytime soon?
I know with this car I can save money then upgrade it later.
If I can get a guide with this SC300 I'd appreciate it and love to get it. I know this is a gateway car to the mighty Supra and thats what I love.
Appreciate it so much!
I love the IS-F stance super clean to me.
I love this car for the manual. Love that it can be unlocked to be a scary beast.
I feel like if I give up on this car that I'll miss out on something great. I love it because it's in my budget more than the IS-F. I do look at the sc300 and say damn I can turn this car to look like a million bucks. It doesn't seem too expensive. By fixing all the stuff I named, would I be clear of fixing those parts again anytime soon?
I know with this car I can save money then upgrade it later.
If I can get a guide with this SC300 I'd appreciate it and love to get it. I know this is a gateway car to the mighty Supra and thats what I love.
Appreciate it so much!
11-20-17, 03:55 AM
#12
Definitely get some quotes locally for a timing belt service, water pump and valve cover gasket replacement, new brake pads and rotors and probably spark plugs, cap and rotor and ignition wires (specify Toyota Lexus parts). Use those quotes to negotiate the price on the car. Still, being a 5-speed with relatively low miles it's not going to go for the same price that an automatic will be sold for no matter what Kelly Blue Book says.
Based on what you've told us and the pictures in the ad it does appear to be a very clean example.
All in all these are not expensive cars to obtain and they are designed very well and to last. Yes, by fixing the immediate maintenance needs you will be resetting them for the next big intervals. Nothing abnormal actually appears to be wrong with the car other than the leaky valve cover gaskets (at least it is very possible that is what the engine oil leak from the top is).
--Replacing the leaky (I assume this to be the issue but obviously I'd have to see the car) valve cover gaskets resets those for another 20+ years or so. No aftermarket gaskets for this. Use Toyota gaskets in accordance with the factory service manual procedure which also requires a couple of specifically placed dabs of Toyota FIPG (Form In Place Gasket) up where the valve covers seal the cam shaft area. The shop doing this (again, if they are the determined source of the leak) should be following the Lexus/Toyota shop manual in their All-Data system for reference.
--Replacing the timing belt, tensioner and water pump mean you've reset those for another 60k miles of use before they are due again. That is how these engines are designed. Timing belt every 60k. The water pump technically doesn't *need* to be done every 60k. Personally I try to use mine for 120k each so long as they are still in good shape. The water pump is accessed by removing the timing belt which is why it is associated with a t-belt job.
--If the SC's brake rotors are completely shot to the point that the car is unsafe to drive then just get them fixed. How long they last depends on driving style but really with spirited driving as the intention it makes more sense to just upgrade the front brakes to the LS400 calipers. The improvement is night and day to stock and I would say most pads available for those calipers (try Tirerack but searching brake pads for a 1995-2000 LS400 for the front brakes only) should last longer since the tiny stock SC300 front calipers and rotors will not be overworked.
Here's a good recent video showing how this is done with a late model SC400. It has slightly larger front and rear calipers than early SC300's but the procedure is exactly the same and the reasons for doing so are also exactly the same.
SC's can be gateway cars to the MKIV Supra but they are much more accessible. As you know they also need some significant modification to their stock configurations in order to do what an MKIV turbo or Toyota Soarer Z30 will.
If you like a nice 5-speed example like this and want to keep the costs down then the plan should be leaving the stock engine and transmission alone (unless you need a slightly more durable organic full face clutch) and just focusing on upgrading the wheels, tires, brakes, suspension, replacing worn bushings or control arms and anything else that would further enhance it to bring out the driver's machine. An LSD is a pricey addition to the driveline to aid in handling capability but it does make a difference even with a 4.083:1 naturally aspirated manual SC.
Beyond that the only next step is a turbocharged JZ engine and the other components and gearbox needed to support that upgrade and of course that gets into much more money invested
The price is on the high end for this one but you have still found a very good example with very low mileage. And you may have found another good car with a local IS-F. They're both great cars but very different from each other.
If in doubt about anything with this SC in the ad, have a trusted independent mechanic or dealer you like check it out for you and give their own evaluation.
At the end of the day, yes these are 20+ year old cars now but they do stand up very well if they are maintained. And being Toyota's it's not that hard to maintain them. Once in a while something may need to be addressed but on the whole they are very reliable cars even after all these years.
It would not be the same as trying to maintain a 90's BMW 5, 7 or 8 series or a 90's Audi or 90's Mercedes-Benz non-diesel. The 2JZ-GE engines have been known to go well in excess of 300k miles and some of them past 500k miles. Again... if maintained well.
Another key thing is to learn how to do at least a little of the work on them yourself but even barring that it is more affordable to own one if you don't buy service and replacement parts from your average Lexus dealer. There are alternative deals out there for many factory new parts service parts for SC's. Not dirt cheap but not highway robbery prices. Some Toyota or Lexus "Trademotion" sites have good prices. Also Rockauto and Driftmotion for some service parts.
Based on what you've told us and the pictures in the ad it does appear to be a very clean example.
All in all these are not expensive cars to obtain and they are designed very well and to last. Yes, by fixing the immediate maintenance needs you will be resetting them for the next big intervals. Nothing abnormal actually appears to be wrong with the car other than the leaky valve cover gaskets (at least it is very possible that is what the engine oil leak from the top is).
--Replacing the leaky (I assume this to be the issue but obviously I'd have to see the car) valve cover gaskets resets those for another 20+ years or so. No aftermarket gaskets for this. Use Toyota gaskets in accordance with the factory service manual procedure which also requires a couple of specifically placed dabs of Toyota FIPG (Form In Place Gasket) up where the valve covers seal the cam shaft area. The shop doing this (again, if they are the determined source of the leak) should be following the Lexus/Toyota shop manual in their All-Data system for reference.
--Replacing the timing belt, tensioner and water pump mean you've reset those for another 60k miles of use before they are due again. That is how these engines are designed. Timing belt every 60k. The water pump technically doesn't *need* to be done every 60k. Personally I try to use mine for 120k each so long as they are still in good shape. The water pump is accessed by removing the timing belt which is why it is associated with a t-belt job.
--If the SC's brake rotors are completely shot to the point that the car is unsafe to drive then just get them fixed. How long they last depends on driving style but really with spirited driving as the intention it makes more sense to just upgrade the front brakes to the LS400 calipers. The improvement is night and day to stock and I would say most pads available for those calipers (try Tirerack but searching brake pads for a 1995-2000 LS400 for the front brakes only) should last longer since the tiny stock SC300 front calipers and rotors will not be overworked.
Here's a good recent video showing how this is done with a late model SC400. It has slightly larger front and rear calipers than early SC300's but the procedure is exactly the same and the reasons for doing so are also exactly the same.
SC's can be gateway cars to the MKIV Supra but they are much more accessible. As you know they also need some significant modification to their stock configurations in order to do what an MKIV turbo or Toyota Soarer Z30 will.
If you like a nice 5-speed example like this and want to keep the costs down then the plan should be leaving the stock engine and transmission alone (unless you need a slightly more durable organic full face clutch) and just focusing on upgrading the wheels, tires, brakes, suspension, replacing worn bushings or control arms and anything else that would further enhance it to bring out the driver's machine. An LSD is a pricey addition to the driveline to aid in handling capability but it does make a difference even with a 4.083:1 naturally aspirated manual SC.
Beyond that the only next step is a turbocharged JZ engine and the other components and gearbox needed to support that upgrade and of course that gets into much more money invested
The price is on the high end for this one but you have still found a very good example with very low mileage. And you may have found another good car with a local IS-F. They're both great cars but very different from each other.
If in doubt about anything with this SC in the ad, have a trusted independent mechanic or dealer you like check it out for you and give their own evaluation.
At the end of the day, yes these are 20+ year old cars now but they do stand up very well if they are maintained. And being Toyota's it's not that hard to maintain them. Once in a while something may need to be addressed but on the whole they are very reliable cars even after all these years.
It would not be the same as trying to maintain a 90's BMW 5, 7 or 8 series or a 90's Audi or 90's Mercedes-Benz non-diesel. The 2JZ-GE engines have been known to go well in excess of 300k miles and some of them past 500k miles. Again... if maintained well.
Another key thing is to learn how to do at least a little of the work on them yourself but even barring that it is more affordable to own one if you don't buy service and replacement parts from your average Lexus dealer. There are alternative deals out there for many factory new parts service parts for SC's. Not dirt cheap but not highway robbery prices. Some Toyota or Lexus "Trademotion" sites have good prices. Also Rockauto and Driftmotion for some service parts.
Last edited by KahnBB6; 11-20-17 at 04:09 AM.
11-21-17, 08:38 AM
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I got the carfax today. Wanted to share with you guys, please let me know what the car needs and if it’s in good car condition
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