I searched the forum for this issue and didn't find anything, so I'll start a new thread to see if anyone has an opinion on an issue that just arose.
I purchased a 2004 Lexus SC430 in July 2020. I recently took the car into a Lexus dealership for the airbag recall. While there they found a few other things that needed to be done and I approved the work. They also found some tire wear and suggested that I replace the tires. I okayed that and I agree there was tire wear. The tire wear was on the inside edges of all wheels. I asked them to check the suspension and do an alignment. The service advisor said the suspension was fine and they did an alignment and everything was good.
I didn't look at the written service work order very close until just yesterday and I found the following statement under "Alignment". "Performed 4 wheel alignment. Adjusted rear camber and front toe, rear toe is severely far out of spec but cannot be adjusted due to welds for eccentric adjuster being gone. Will need frame welding on both rear toe adjusters to complete alignment properly."
I immediately called the dealer and asked why this wasn't mentioned to me and asked for further details. To make a long story short, I'll need to take the car to a body shop for the welding to be done.
I removed the left side rear wheel and took a look at the toe link and bracket. I've tried to attach a couple of photos below showing where the toe link bracket is welded to the frame. I don't see where any weldment is missing, but I'm not an expert. Any thoughts?
I agree that the outer rim of the toe control mount is beveled out, but the side you are showing is the eccentric washer/welded nut side. The forward side is the one that actually bears most of the adjustment holding stress. Can you get a pict of the other side where the eccentric bolt head engages. I know it's partially obstructed and difficult to see, but that would be vital in assessing how bad the situation is.
Oh wait.... Is the 2nd pict tyring to show a crack on the inner aspect of the forward mount bracket. Then, yes. that would need to be rewelded. I'd also swap out the eccentric bolt hardware given its state of corrosion.
Thanks for your reply. That 2nd photo is shot from beneath and looking up. I did see that space between the frame member and the toe end bracket. I didn't know if that was a crack or the weld just ended.
If it is a crack, the bracket must have been subjected to some force which may have pulled it out. Both brackets are apparently like that. I don't know what would cause that to occur. I wonder if it has been there for a long time.
I'm assuming the toe end adjustment is made by putting a wrench on the outer nut and loosening that nut. The inner nut which looks to be part of the adjustment eccentric is then turned. It doesn't look like anyone has broken that outer nut loose. Your comment about replacing the eccentric bolt hardware makes sense.
I'll take this into a body shop. I'm hoping it won't be a costly repair. It looks like it might be a little difficult getting to that weld. If that bracket is bent that would mean more money. Oh well, you can't take it with you.
Yes the inner nut is welded to the eccentric washer. Adjustment is done breaking the outer nut free. Then I place a wrench on the bolt head and the welded nut and move both together. Don’t ever try to move it using just the welded nut. You’ll just break stuff. The bolt head is what can bear the adjustment torque.
I agree the locking nut doesn’t look like it has ever been broken free.
Rear toe adjust is a total PITA using an eccentric instead of a threaded rod like up in front
Let me clarify because I want to be sure we are looking at the same thing. The portion circled in magenta has a dark detail that is the potential "crack" in your 2nd image. However, this could also be a shadow in the photo. If it is just a shadow, or merely the unwelded, interior of that portion of the bracket, you don't have a crack to to get welded. I don't see a potential crack anywhere else.
If this is not a crack, then your only problem is some potentially seized locking nuts that the dealership didn't even attempt try to break free.
I think you got it right, that is, it is a crack. I went out and got a better angle and took the below photo. The crack is clearly shown. It doesn't look like the bracket has bent. I think it just may have been a stress crack that propagated along the weld. The car has a lot of miles (157K) and a lot of stress and vibration over the years. I'm hoping it is an easy fix - remove the eccentric bolt and weld. They may want to end drill or do some grinding, I don't know. Good time to replace that hardware. Again, many thanks.
Inspected my rear toe ties and thankfully don't have such cracks. The top and side welds look intact.
Didn't get a good photo from below, but here are OEM 223,000 mile SC430 suspension parts look like without midwest salt.
Just some witness marks on the nuts and bolt from my adjusting alignment recently.
I took my car to a body shop today and they put it on a lift and we were able to look at the area in question. There wasn’t a crack where the bracket was welded to the frame. From the photos, it did appear to be a crack, but when we got a better viewing angle, that was not the case.
As Seattle SCone mentioned in an above comment, he noted that the edges of the bracket appeared to be “beveled out” and that was correct. The eccentric on the adjustment bolt rides against the edges and when the eccentric is turned, it moves the toe rod in and out. Because the edges had “beveled out” or bent out, the eccentric could no longer “ride” on those edges.
In the photos above, you can see the edge had beveled out on my car’s bracket. Seattle SCone inserted a photo of his car’s bracket and you can see the edge on his bracket is nice and straight.
The body shop tech thought that the toe rod had likely seized due to age/corrosion. When trying to make a toe rod adjustment, an alignment tech couldn’t get the toe rod to move and he likely put a bigger wrench on the eccentric bolt. Instead of moving the toe rod in and out, he bent the metal edges. Sounds logical and who knows when this happened.
So, the fix is to remove the adjustment bolt and the toe end link (a tough job) and bend the edges back in place. There might also need to put a bead of weldment down. This would be done for both the left and right sides. New adjustment bolts and toe end rods would be installed. The rear wheel alignment would then be completed.
Has anyone had any experience with this? The toe links are cheaper than buying replacement Lexus links and instead of replacing the eccentric bolts, non-eccentric bolts could be used where the toe link bolts to the bracket. The bracket wouldn't have to be bent back. The toe could be adjusted much easier. I may be grabbing at straws, but why not look for alternatives?
Figs Engineering has a nice set of adjustable toe links that I've been eyeing.
While the suspension is unloaded, you may be able to move the tie in/out with wrenches on both eccentric nut and bolt simultaneously. Adjustment isn't held in place by the eccentric being jammed against the ridges. The high torque is the friction hold. Those bevels only allow you to shift things.
If I were you, I'd go with the adjustable tie rod solution. Cheaper and a LOT EASIER to adjust than the relatively clumsy eccentrics.
You know it is funny, I was just looking at Figs website when you answered my question. I think that might be the answer. I also saw a set from TruHart that might work as well. Thanks for the help, it is nice to get an informed opinion from someone who doesn't have an agenda.
