360LexusEs

The ride on my 2010 RX 450 H has become real bad. So bad that if I drove over uneven snow it's uncontrollable. When I drive down a road that's uneven you can visibly see the steering wheel all over the place. The dealer wound up replacing the bushings for the control arms which were leaking and the left and front control arms. The ride now actually feels worse since that work was done. They also replaced the left front sway bar endlink due to a leaking boot and stated on the invoice that front struts front strut tops and bearings for both sides recommend to replace front suspension due to customer being unhappy with ride quality but state that front suspension isn't making noise and does not have any abnormal leaks. The car has 101,000 miles on it and I'm 99.99% sure they shocks and struts have never been replaced on the car based on the service history. I have the extended warranty on it to 130k but it seems to me like the dealer it's screwing me. Any thoughts? Am I being unreasonable? The drive is terrible and you can visibly see the steering wheel all over the place on uneven road but because they aren't leaking it's a no go?

salimshah

Dealer is the middle entity, and your warranty is with Lexus Corp [please verify]. So that gives you the option to go to any Lexus dealer [depending on where you are, it can be only one in town].

But that still gives you the option to escalate and get in touch with Lexus Corp. Usually they would listen, but the expert opinion comes from the shop. You can ask an independent professional suspension shop for diagnosis [Check with Lexus first ... what you would want is that if the problem is with the struts, Lexus pays for the diagnosis and if not then you eat the cost].

To support the dealer diagnosis .. the checks are for leaks, torn bushings, bent arms, and non-smooth operation [for smooth operation at times the shock has to be removed and tested without the springs. Experts need not do the disassembly.

There can be other reasons to mistrack in snow. Like toe-in, camber, tire (tread) condition etc.

Salim

F250

Just to be clear, then, Salim, you're suggesting the OP go through the following steps:

1) If available, go to another Lexus dealer for a revisit to the diagnosis. If this second dealer agrees to replace the components, then the "problem" is solved (hopefully). Otherwise, proceed to the next step below.
2) If another dealer is not nearby or does not agree with the OP regarding the strut replacement, then the OP pursue the issue with whoever supports the extended warranty (Lexus or other), and that contact would be to gain approval for a third party suspension shop diagnosis.

Pursuing the above assumes there are no issues with alignment or tire tread condition.

Did I get that correct?

salimshah

You said it much better than my rambling.

Salim

F250

It's always easier for someone to simply re-state what someone else said... the hard part, which you took care of clearly, is coming up with what needs to be said in the first place

mjeds

pretty sure struts and shocks are wear items and not covered under any warranty unless there is a defect, and at 101,000 miles pretty sure you are past the defect stage and into the worn out from use stage.

wear items are usually specifically excluded from warranty coverage, brakes, shocks/struts, tires, fluids, wipers, etc..

MellonC00

that's gonna be tough to have the Lexus pay for this. They spent pretty good money so far on your car. You see, Lexus doesn't make separate bushings for the control arms. They have to replace the whole control arm which is an expensive part - I think north of $500 each. I had mine replaced on both sides and they told me it's $1600 if they charged me. Not sure if they replaced the rears or/and the fronts. but it's a pretty big deal to get those replaced.

I'd say try to push to get something out of them and settle for anything if they budge a little. Even if you have to shell out some money for the shocks and struts, you gotta pretty good deal so far. And after you have them replace, you'll be driving practically a new car (in term of the suspension)

Clutchless

I am sure struts like brakes and wipers are wear items not covered by the extended warranty unless there is obvious failure due to defect. Time to shop around but there are only a few strut/shock sources. These are OEM (which are made by Tokico or (I have heard KYB)), or aftermarket from KYB, Monroe or Sachs. Cost is similar among them and any shop can do the installation as struts are similar among the Toyota/Lexus family and any other modern vehicle.

360LexusEs

Shocks and struts don't fall into that category they are actually covered. This taken from LEXUS

"THESE ARE THE ITEMS NOT COVERED:

Accessory Drive Belts; Batteries; Body Panels; Brake Linings, Pads and Shoes, Rotors and Drums; Bumpers; Carpet; Chrome; Clutch Friction Disc and Pressure Plate; Dash Cover and Pad; Door Fabric; Door Trim; Filters; Fluids; Glass (including Windshields); Headliner; Heating Hoses, Lines
and Tubes; Hoses; Hybrid Vehicle Battery Pack; Hybrid Vehicle Battery Plug Assembly; Hybrid Vehicle Relay Assembly; Hybrid Vehicle Supply BatteryAssembly;InteriorandExteriorTrimandMoldings(includingbut not limited to: Ashtrays, Covers, Cup Holders, and Vents); Lamps, Light Assemblies/Housings, and Lightbulbs; Nuts, Bolts, Clips, Retainers, and Fasteners; Paint; Rust and Corrosion Damage; Seat Covers; Sheet Metals; Shiny Metals; Spark Plugs; Structural Framework and Welds; Tires; Vacuum Hoses, Lines and Tubes; Weather Stripping; Wheels and Rims; Windshield Wiper Blades (Rubber component); All interior and exterior cloth, leather, and stitching including convertible tops and/or vinyl tops including but not limited to: any vibration, deterioration, discoloration, disfigurement, warping, fading, staining, stretching, ripping, punctures, tearing, and/or scratches "

Just got off the phone with corporate and they told me they are in support of whatever the dealership says, very frustrating because anyone that sits in the car can feel it all over the place. So until they are leaking and or making noise I'm basically SOL unless I want to pay out of pocket ahead of time.

ukrkoz

To be honest, I am not sure how struts will cause your vehicle to be "all over". That's steering issue. Also, I have never seen leaking control arm bushings. They are solid rubber bushings. Also, torn boots on sway bar links do not manifest bad link itself. Boot is boot, it's just a cover.
Bad struts will manifest in excessive body roll in turns and very bumpy ride. That is determined by scientific method of what your butt feels. And your back. Bad struts can also be tracked via scalloped tire wear pattern, when tires bounce up down on the road. But not side to side snaking. That's steering. Tie rod ends. Inner toe rods. Both of them. You likely have EPS, that may be mulfunctioning. Bad camber easily causes weird tracking.

mjeds

you do not state what level of extended warranty you have, or where you got the information you posted.

but the HIGHEST level of the current Extended Plan, the VSA Platinum DOES NOT COVER SHOCKS OR STRUTS, and it can be found here:

https://www.sc.toyotafinancial.com/w...l_Brochure.pdf

BLACK is powertrain warranty, Blue is extended coverage, only the items listed are covered.
I worked in the industry for a long time, while Lexus has one of the best warranties and extended plans in the business, no manufacturer covers wear items. and shocks/struts are wear items.. The dealer is doing exactly as they should, sorry if you feel you should get something for nothing, but that's not how things work.

lexusrus

It sucks when the Lexus dealership will not do what you want sometimes. Believe me, I've experienced something similar in the past. But in the end I just go for the path of least resistance and avoid headaches if at all possible to stay safe.

IDK about anyone else. But for me, if I got more than 100K miles out of a set of shocks......I'm happy.

Also if I got more than 100K miles out of a set of shocks and now experiencing uncontrollable rolls and bounces which is obviously dangerous (And Lexus dealership will not replace them free of charge), THEN I WILL JUST GO AHEAD AND REPLACE THEM ON MY OWN DIME ASAP. Its not worth the few hundred dollars to argue about. Safety First!!

360LexusEs

I have the Platinum extended warranty.

I don't see where it says shocks and struts are not covered, but I do know they are 100 percent covered under this extended warranty because I had them replaced on my 05 ES 330 that had the same warranty extension. Maybe because they were leaking and making a sound? Also, the service advisor told me over the phone that if they did found them to need replacement then they will be covered under the warranty and even suggested it on the paper. Apparently the adjuster for the warranty company was the one that said no because they weren't leaking and or making noise but IMO it shouldn't get to that when the car is a hazard to drive and it's clear as day that its the suspension. Its more than just a rough ride its the steering wheel all over the place, every rough patch in the road essentially grabbing the vehicle.

salimshah

360LexusEs:

We are here to listen and give advice and share our opinions. But at the end your problem has to be solved by a shop.

1. Does the dealership agree that there is a problem even after making all the attempts to fix it?
2. Have they given up?
3. Have they checked for play in suspension and proper torque on bolts and nuts? [Once a shop did not torque the bolts down ... yes it happens]
4. Have they done an alignment? [This may not be a warranty item]

Assess the above and maybe go to a speed shop for items 3 & 4. Usually they do 3 for free, but you can pay them for the time. They will also tell you that the struts are good/bad. Take the information back to Lexus.

Salim
ps: I personally think the problem you describe can not be attributed to bad struts/shocks [I have been wrong many times, so use it as one person's opinion]

Cocal

Struts are wear items, however, if faulty they would be replaced under the warranty. Your problem is that they do not leak and thereby on visual inspection they do not appear faulty, so they must be road-tested by the dealer and declared faulty. Have they done that?