dizmo

I'm looking into getting an RX330, or RX400H as the RX platform seems to be pretty much exactly what I'm looking for in terms of size, cost and build quality.

I've done a fair bit of reading on these guys, but figured I'd ask here since I'm assuming most of you own one!

I'll be driving the vehicle 95% of the time in the city. It's a pretty temperate climate.
Would getting the 400H save me a great deal in fuel? The 400H would cost me about $4.5k more than the 330. I've read that the batteries don't need servicing or anything of that nature, so that's good from a cost perspective. They're also a lot easier on the brake pads, so servicing would cost less.

I don't imagine I'd be driving very far, I'd estimate about 10,000 miles a year. Almost all of that will be in stop and go city traffic.

I've checked out the www.fueleconomy.gov site, put in my personalized data and the hybrid only saves me about $450 a year. Is that right? Between hybrid and non hybrid owners that might have driven both, which would you pick?

Lastly, how's the stock GPS system? In the 330 I'd be getting a version sans GPS and installing a double din deck, but I might aim for a NAV equipped hybrid unit as it shows the status of the system.
How are the stereo controls? I'd be adding a custom subwoofer enclosure, and I'm hoping it would be pretty easy to tweak the settings; I'm aware it won't be anywhere near as in depth as a dual din unit.

Thanks for any advice!

RX330inFL

Welcome to Club Lexus, dizmo.

Stop and go traffic is where a hybrid will see its best benefit. On the highway the numbers are a wash. Cold kills hybrid mileage. So, looks like that if you are wanting a hybrid it might be your best best overall if you can find one you like. Repairs can be expensive when things go wrong so consider a CPO if available. There is a whole separate hybrid section here for discussions:

https://www.clublexus.com/forums/hybrid-technology-187/

The stock GPS is just OK. Cellphones, TomTom, Garmin and others have a leg up on them as they can be newer with better displays. Best you can do with the RX is update the maps. Going double-DIN is the best. Many here are converting to that. Whether you purchase with or without the NAV before you do you update should not matter. It would give you the backup camera as well which might be nice in the city.

https://www.clublexus.com/forums/rx-...a-dnx6960.html

Use the search features here of the forum. Many of the questions you might have on a variety of topics have already been asked and answered. Such as mods others are doing such as the upgrade you asked about:

https://www.clublexus.com/forums/rx-...ay-thread.html

jfelbab

I looked at this same decision and could find no way that there would be an economic payback during the life of the vehicle so I went with the gasoline model. According to your own evaluation you would need to own the vehicle about 10 years to break even assuming the batteries would last that long. They are only warrantied for 8 years IIRC. There is little question that the gasoline model could last 10 or more years given proper maintenance.

I have the NAV equipped model and it is ok. I also use my iPhone for turn by turn driving directions in other vehicles and it works just fine as well and I don't need to buy DVD upgrades.

I'd consider updating the entire head unit, if it is non-NAV. Check out Crutchfield.com for some ideas.

glassmanj

since you are doing city driving my guess is you'll get 28-29+ mph with hybrid and 20 without. additionally, hybrid is guaranteed for 150,000 miles in some states so if yours goes bad beforehand i've read where lexus will grandfather the parts and you only pay for labor, $500. 400h is AWD, is the 300 you're looking at the same? the AWD is worth it. on wet surface you can floor gas pedal and no tire spin. and 400h is faster of the line than 300 i believe. personally, we bought a used 400h with 78,000 and all the options in may and we paid $19,000k in columbus, oh. i say shop wisely, pay the extra, and get a 400h. and finally, it's so quiet.

jfelbab

I ran the numbers for a 2013 RX350 AWD and a 2013 RX450 AWD assuming. I drive around 10,000 miles a year and 80/20 highway/city, and got this. The cost of the RX450 AWD was $6,600 more than the RX350 AWD. The gas savings amounted to $300 a year according to the fueleconomy.gov site.
$6,600 ÷ $300 = 22 years to break even.

I then ran the same numbers only using 20/80 highway/city and the gas savings was a $500 a year with the RX 450 AWD.
$6,600 ÷ 500 = 13.2 years to break even.

Not even close to making sense economically.
____________Annual $ in gas savings 2013 RX450AWD vs. RX350AWD
______________80/20 Highway/City_________20/80 Highway/City
Annual Miles_____$ gas savings_____________$ gas savings
10,000_____________$300____________________$500
15,000_____________$400____________________$800
20,000_____________$450___________________$1,050

Even if you drive 20k a year and mostly in the city the payback doesn't occur until 6 years in to the ownership and by then you'd have amassed 120,000 miles on the vehicle.

IMO, this hybrid just does not deliver the needed mileage improvement to make this an affordable alternative to gas.

Carver

Your own numbers tell the tale, ten years to break even on purchase costs and owning an aging hybrid is far to scary to contemplate. Will it go ten years without one of those 10,000 dollar inverters or whatever?

If you live in a mild climate I would recommend the FWD simply because of the long term maintenance costs, fewer parts to break compared to AWD. I would not enjoy crawling in that aging hybrid everyday wondering when the expensive stuff will break.

jtaylor3

I bought the hybrid for three reasons. One is that it made me feel better since it got better gas mileage than pretty much any sport-ute out there. I also like the fact that it is quicker than the standard RX. It's highway passing power is especially impressive. There is no waiting for the downshift, just instant electric torque. Thirdly, as an engineer, I appreciated the technology involved and found it more interesting to drive than a standard RX.

From a pure cost standpoint, you'd probably be better off getting the standard model. One additional savings (but nowhere near $4.5k) is that your brakes wear much more slowly since the hybrid system can handle a lot of the light to moderate braking.

Good luck with your decision.

Jeff

takeshi74

Probably not but it really depends on how you drive it (as with any vehicle). I can leadfoot my 400h and drain the tank, I can hypermile and get more MPG and there's a wide range in between.

I'd go with the hybrid for the ondemand torque from the electric motors. I've read comments from others who would go for the conventional RX. Regardless, you need to consider your needs/wants instead of attempting to base your decision on comments from others who may have differing priorities.

You really should check out the options for yourself to answer your questions. A lot of them are subjective matters and without knowing you or your preferences it's impossible for anyone to tell you what you'll think.

Better than nothing. We use our iPhones.

Not all are. Ours is FWD.

Subjective, as worth is on any topic.

Adamjeeps

If you are going to get the 330, why not pay a little extra for the 350, it's got more power and a tick better mileage, plus better Nav if you want it.

dizmo

Great, thanks for all the posts. Originally I was leaning towards the hybrid, but now I think I'll just go with the 330.

As for the 350, they're considerably more than the equivalent 330's. For, what I've read, is not a lot of gain.

draco

The gain on an RX350 is that seats in feeling get up and go feeling when you accelerate in a 350. The 330's tend to be a bit held back especially when accelerating and don't feel as "loose" as the RX350 (which really shines when accelerating). It has the better and upgraded NAV screen, bluetooth and the Lexus Personalised Settings that you don't get on the 330.

Carver

One more consideration, the '04 has the older version of nav with no blue tooth.

jfelbab

Lexus Personalized Settings do exist on the RX330.

The electronics are improved in the 350 and as mentioned a bit more responsive engine and fuel economy. I personally feel the ride comfort has been degraded in the 350. All the 350 RX's I've driven seem to feel much more bouncy or nervous over slight bumps while the 330 seem more subdued and smoother. The quietness in the 350 cabin is much improved. The newer 350's (Gen3) have made it very difficult to see out the back as the new rear seat headrest design now blocks much of the view to the rear.

joedaddy1

iTrader: (1)

i would go with a 350 or a 07+ hybrid...
if you travel bumper to bumper city with many traffic lights and idle more than average.. the difference in gas saving might be more...

but i would definitely not pay a premium for a hybrid only due to gas..

think about the environment, parking, and tax benefits.. and the acceleration.. if you take these into account.. the hybrid wins... if you don't care.. get the 350.. (personally i would skip the 330)

RX330inFL

They are called CBEST Settings.