To rust proof or not, that is the question!
10-19-03, 10:28 AM
#31
Lexus Test Driver
I haven’t had one of these systems in any my cars and NONE have had any corrosion at all. I’m a firm believer. I also speak from experience and I am also a few dollars ahead.
04-03-04, 08:34 AM
#32
Lead Lap
Thread Starter
Dealer confirmed rust protection o.k
Was at the dealer yesterday and spoke to service manager and they said that as long as no new holes are drilled in the body Lexus would honour the rust protection warranty...
In fact on a personal note he highly recommended it.
He said have undercarriage properly washed and dry before application and then use drip-type in doors and body panels and non drip on undercarriage.
Cheers,
//Fern
In fact on a personal note he highly recommended it.
He said have undercarriage properly washed and dry before application and then use drip-type in doors and body panels and non drip on undercarriage.
Cheers,
//Fern
04-03-04, 06:06 PM
#33
Fern, check your door drain holes, mine have a waxy sealer on them seemingly like the Rusty Jones stuff I had on another car that seemed to work great. Wonder why the dealer would suggest adding more to doors if I am right? Maybe he isn't aware of the door rustproofing or I am seeing something else. All my door drains seem to have it.
Last edited by parula; 04-03-04 at 06:10 PM.
05-23-06, 09:04 AM
#34
Driver School Candidate
Join Date: May 2006
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Do It Do It Now
I have a 1987 LINCOLN CONT 170,000K and no rust. I have it sprayed with RUST CHECK once per year in spring since ownership. It is fully warrantied by them and proud to say rust free. I had it appraised and on paper it is worth $10,000 dollars and it is insured for that amount. Did I get my monies worth well I THINK SO. I read what others said in this forum and if you live out side of Canada you will have to check them out and it will be worth the drive year after year. I am providing some info from their RUST CHECK center read it and believe it. More info at www.rustcheck.com
RUST TO BE PROACTIVE OR REACTIVE IN YOUR PROTECTION AGAINST IT ?
Most people think that if you own a car, van or pick-up truck you must put up with and endure the RUST process. (Reactive Thinking). Auto-mechanics and Body-men know what harm RUST can do. (Fact). They both make
money from repairing the ravages of RUST. Once a vehicle has RUST, it is difficult to deal with so therefore costly. (Reactive Thinking). RUST repair can be an enormous expense other than body repair RUST hinders with the maintenance of all moving parts. (Fact). Is must be too late. (Reactive Thinking). It is not too late. (Fact). Whether your vehicle is new or old it is important to you. If you need your vehicle to last a little while longer or indefinitely there is always something you can do. (Fact).
One of the key words to answer this question is to ACT. Let’s take action, lets look at what you can do (Proactive Thinking). Wash your vehicle once a week (preferably by hand), rinse out wheel-wells and wash out door jams and sills weekly, wax your vehicle three times a year, touch-up with paint all stone chips and scrapes as soon as they happen. (Proactive Thinking). This is a good start. However, can you do more? Should you? Yes of course!
Now we are ready to think PROACTIVELY. Arm yourself with information and knowledge. Knowledge is power, education is a tool and use it. Educate yourself by asking questions. Knowing whom to ask is important, we all know the people in the auto industry that do repair of the after effects of RUST. This then brings us to think PREVENTION.
The next key word in Proactively thinking is PRO. Take your questions to the Professionals. Call and compare the information there are various theories on what works (tars, waxes, dripless oils, synthetic chemical sprays).
RUST CHECK CORP CANADA and their 250 plus centers can help. They are well trained and have had the pleasure of protecting every known make and model on the roads today and yesterday’s makes and models too. They have been around since 1973, their longevity is a testament to the product they use, and thorough application they do.
The test of time is too important to ignore. (Fact).
The answer to RUST protection is elementary THINK PROACTIVELY, ask questions get EDUCATION, be prepared for PERSPIRATION and take your vehicle to a PRO and ACT now!
Q. How do I stop my vehicle from being another casualty of RUSTING process?
A. Many good running vehicles are sent to the wrecking yards do to neglect of the body. Make sure that you take into consideration that regular washing of the outside surfaces and perimeter door seams, hood and truck lid seams are a must at least once a week. Regular waxing three times a year minimum. Touch-up stone chips and scrapes as soon as possible. In wintertime remember to place catch mats for the snow, salt and water your feet will come into contact with. Think annual maintenance for the whole vehicle and a year round RUST PROTECTION routine that works.
Q. What type of RUST PROTECTION is right for today’s vehicles.
A. There are many varieties of products on the market today (tar, wax, dripless oils and synthetic chemical inhibitors). Their claims on how they perform are all based on similar theories, sealing the surface or creating a barrier on the underside and inner panels of vehicles with a one-time application. These undercoating skins act as a shield from the elements that create RUST. According to their claims the elements are salt and water. However it is a documented fact that the RUSTING process is also activated and accelerated by Electro-litic reaction that happens naturally in all metals this is called electrolysis. In short what really is effective to protect your vehicle, whether it is new or old. Is a product that is a thin liquid that is actively creep into all cracks, crevices and spot welds and never hardens. The product should actually be capable of inhibiting new RUST from forming and old RUST from growing. It should displace, evaporate and emulsify water and neutralize salt. Most importantly the product should be an annual application so that a PRO can check on the condition of your vehicle and give you positive feed back yearly.
WHAT IS RUST THROUGH BY DEFINITION OF THE OEM MANUFACTURES.
Visible rust perforation must be through to the outside panel. In short, rust must provide a hole of passage from one side of the panel to the other side of the panel. This is then is considered rust through.
The manufacture’s representative relates or translates this information as such if there is passage through there must be a hole visible to their naked eye where as a finger or a screw driver must be able to pass through easily.
Are they correct in their interpretation? The answer is not as cut and dry as this, it is much more detailed than this.
Our translation is this; rust found on any panel must have an origin. Logic requires one to find the how and the why this is what must be answered. For every rust condition, the underlining reasons are abrasions or perforations. If you expose metal to the elements i.e. water and salt can accelerate the rusting process.
In every case, the rules of origins for corrosion are that the place of origin is always at least three times the size of exit. So start at the exit and go in from there.
If the painted surface is not compromised by something rubbing or chipping the painted surface, then where is it coming from?
You have found rust where did it start. Open the panel up for example a door panel and check the inside, if rust is evident then check if it is larger than the outside surface if it is then its origin is from inside to the outside surface. What if you can not take a panel off to see the backside of the rusty area, then ask the rep to provide a BORASCOPE that can pass into an access hole and reveal the backside of the rusty area?
Therefore, we must have passage a “hole caused by rust through”.
Is it a hole if the human eye can not see it, nor can a tool or a finger pass through the panel? The answer is yes just because you can see the size of the hole it does not mean that it does not exist. If proof is required it can be seen with an ELECTRON MICROSCOPE, this devise is primary used for inspection of the micro fishers found in welds to measure the thickness and ascertain the penetration and density of welds. In every weld there are micro passages that moisture can pass through as the weld is created.
Therefore, although a weld looks impervious to the naked eye we now know it has some holes of passage.
Now we have established it is rust from the inside out. During time of the manufacture’s warranty, it takes first presidents over the RUST CHECK CORP warranty. The customer will be instructed to bring the rust through area to the attention of the manufacture.
Step One: It is recommended that the affected area be first sandblasted thoroughly. If a patch needs to be welded in it will be done at this stage.
Step Two: It should then be sprayed with a good etching primer or a rust converter, to release and float any contaminants to the surface to be sanded away.
Step Three: If it is a door seam it requires seam sealer or seam seal caulking, it should be applied after the primer or converter.
Step Four: Paint the area.
Step Five: After two weeks, we require the customer to have the repaired area touched up with RUST CHECK spray.
If all steps were completed as written then the rust through area should not reappear. As a word of caution, poor bodywork shows up in eight months or less. If you see something showing up it will look like a bubble in the paint surface, it can be hard or squishy. Return to us first and we will advise you at that time.
This is what we spray,
(ALL VEHICLES)
Starting with hood, engine compartment, fire wall, front fender seams, rad support, light assembly, cowling, front fenders, top of frame rails & motor mounts, and everything that would be bolted or attached to metal in the engine compartment.
(ALL VEHICLES)
Then we would spray into the, front posts, rear fender seams of the front fenders near the front door hinges, rocker panels, doors (front & rear if it is a 4 door), and centre post if it is a 4 door.
(CARS ONLY)
Dog legs, trunk (inner panels of trunks are pulled out and sometimes the spare tire if it is in our way), from the trunk
Area we can reach the rear fenders, up and over the inner wheel humps, up into the roof pillars, trunk floor, and trunk lid.
(PICK-UP TRUCKS)
We remove sun visors for a factory axis area for above windshields & top of front posts, we drill into the top of the door jam rear pillars to get into the double panelled roof & top of cab corners. Then halfway down on the same pillar another axis hole to get into the lower cab corner (especially if the truck is an extended cab for the underside of the extended cab window). The space between the cab and the box, rear tail lights must be pulled out to get into the inside of the rear fenders, box seams are sprayed (if customer has a box liner customer should remove it for easy reach. However if this is not possible it can still be sprayed under it), tailgate.
(FULL SIZE & MINI VANS)
Some vans have sliding doors or swing out barn doors, then roof pillars (either by factory holes or by our own drill holes) rear barn doors & door jams.
(ALL VEHICLES)
Then we spray all the exterior trim of the vehicle, (around the door handles, door locks, windshield trim, etc, and any crack or crevice or exterior seam that would trap salt & moister, then we spray in the wheel wells, behind the bumpers, lower rad support, engine cradle, motor mounts, tranny mounts, oil pan tranny pan, tranny linkages, lower control arms, frame floor, cross supports in floors, above heat shields, above gas tank, gas & brake lines, gas tank and above tank, rear axle & suspension, and lower trunk floor pan, and every nook and cranny in between.
(PICK-UP TRUCKS & FULL SIZE & MINI VANS)
All cross supports in box floor & van floors, dual tanks propane tanks, hitches, etc.
THANKS FOR READING THIS IS
NO RUST..........OUT
RUST TO BE PROACTIVE OR REACTIVE IN YOUR PROTECTION AGAINST IT ?
Most people think that if you own a car, van or pick-up truck you must put up with and endure the RUST process. (Reactive Thinking). Auto-mechanics and Body-men know what harm RUST can do. (Fact). They both make
money from repairing the ravages of RUST. Once a vehicle has RUST, it is difficult to deal with so therefore costly. (Reactive Thinking). RUST repair can be an enormous expense other than body repair RUST hinders with the maintenance of all moving parts. (Fact). Is must be too late. (Reactive Thinking). It is not too late. (Fact). Whether your vehicle is new or old it is important to you. If you need your vehicle to last a little while longer or indefinitely there is always something you can do. (Fact).
One of the key words to answer this question is to ACT. Let’s take action, lets look at what you can do (Proactive Thinking). Wash your vehicle once a week (preferably by hand), rinse out wheel-wells and wash out door jams and sills weekly, wax your vehicle three times a year, touch-up with paint all stone chips and scrapes as soon as they happen. (Proactive Thinking). This is a good start. However, can you do more? Should you? Yes of course!
Now we are ready to think PROACTIVELY. Arm yourself with information and knowledge. Knowledge is power, education is a tool and use it. Educate yourself by asking questions. Knowing whom to ask is important, we all know the people in the auto industry that do repair of the after effects of RUST. This then brings us to think PREVENTION.
The next key word in Proactively thinking is PRO. Take your questions to the Professionals. Call and compare the information there are various theories on what works (tars, waxes, dripless oils, synthetic chemical sprays).
RUST CHECK CORP CANADA and their 250 plus centers can help. They are well trained and have had the pleasure of protecting every known make and model on the roads today and yesterday’s makes and models too. They have been around since 1973, their longevity is a testament to the product they use, and thorough application they do.
The test of time is too important to ignore. (Fact).
The answer to RUST protection is elementary THINK PROACTIVELY, ask questions get EDUCATION, be prepared for PERSPIRATION and take your vehicle to a PRO and ACT now!
Q. How do I stop my vehicle from being another casualty of RUSTING process?
A. Many good running vehicles are sent to the wrecking yards do to neglect of the body. Make sure that you take into consideration that regular washing of the outside surfaces and perimeter door seams, hood and truck lid seams are a must at least once a week. Regular waxing three times a year minimum. Touch-up stone chips and scrapes as soon as possible. In wintertime remember to place catch mats for the snow, salt and water your feet will come into contact with. Think annual maintenance for the whole vehicle and a year round RUST PROTECTION routine that works.
Q. What type of RUST PROTECTION is right for today’s vehicles.
A. There are many varieties of products on the market today (tar, wax, dripless oils and synthetic chemical inhibitors). Their claims on how they perform are all based on similar theories, sealing the surface or creating a barrier on the underside and inner panels of vehicles with a one-time application. These undercoating skins act as a shield from the elements that create RUST. According to their claims the elements are salt and water. However it is a documented fact that the RUSTING process is also activated and accelerated by Electro-litic reaction that happens naturally in all metals this is called electrolysis. In short what really is effective to protect your vehicle, whether it is new or old. Is a product that is a thin liquid that is actively creep into all cracks, crevices and spot welds and never hardens. The product should actually be capable of inhibiting new RUST from forming and old RUST from growing. It should displace, evaporate and emulsify water and neutralize salt. Most importantly the product should be an annual application so that a PRO can check on the condition of your vehicle and give you positive feed back yearly.
WHAT IS RUST THROUGH BY DEFINITION OF THE OEM MANUFACTURES.
Visible rust perforation must be through to the outside panel. In short, rust must provide a hole of passage from one side of the panel to the other side of the panel. This is then is considered rust through.
The manufacture’s representative relates or translates this information as such if there is passage through there must be a hole visible to their naked eye where as a finger or a screw driver must be able to pass through easily.
Are they correct in their interpretation? The answer is not as cut and dry as this, it is much more detailed than this.
Our translation is this; rust found on any panel must have an origin. Logic requires one to find the how and the why this is what must be answered. For every rust condition, the underlining reasons are abrasions or perforations. If you expose metal to the elements i.e. water and salt can accelerate the rusting process.
In every case, the rules of origins for corrosion are that the place of origin is always at least three times the size of exit. So start at the exit and go in from there.
If the painted surface is not compromised by something rubbing or chipping the painted surface, then where is it coming from?
You have found rust where did it start. Open the panel up for example a door panel and check the inside, if rust is evident then check if it is larger than the outside surface if it is then its origin is from inside to the outside surface. What if you can not take a panel off to see the backside of the rusty area, then ask the rep to provide a BORASCOPE that can pass into an access hole and reveal the backside of the rusty area?
Therefore, we must have passage a “hole caused by rust through”.
Is it a hole if the human eye can not see it, nor can a tool or a finger pass through the panel? The answer is yes just because you can see the size of the hole it does not mean that it does not exist. If proof is required it can be seen with an ELECTRON MICROSCOPE, this devise is primary used for inspection of the micro fishers found in welds to measure the thickness and ascertain the penetration and density of welds. In every weld there are micro passages that moisture can pass through as the weld is created.
Therefore, although a weld looks impervious to the naked eye we now know it has some holes of passage.
Now we have established it is rust from the inside out. During time of the manufacture’s warranty, it takes first presidents over the RUST CHECK CORP warranty. The customer will be instructed to bring the rust through area to the attention of the manufacture.
Step One: It is recommended that the affected area be first sandblasted thoroughly. If a patch needs to be welded in it will be done at this stage.
Step Two: It should then be sprayed with a good etching primer or a rust converter, to release and float any contaminants to the surface to be sanded away.
Step Three: If it is a door seam it requires seam sealer or seam seal caulking, it should be applied after the primer or converter.
Step Four: Paint the area.
Step Five: After two weeks, we require the customer to have the repaired area touched up with RUST CHECK spray.
If all steps were completed as written then the rust through area should not reappear. As a word of caution, poor bodywork shows up in eight months or less. If you see something showing up it will look like a bubble in the paint surface, it can be hard or squishy. Return to us first and we will advise you at that time.
This is what we spray,
(ALL VEHICLES)
Starting with hood, engine compartment, fire wall, front fender seams, rad support, light assembly, cowling, front fenders, top of frame rails & motor mounts, and everything that would be bolted or attached to metal in the engine compartment.
(ALL VEHICLES)
Then we would spray into the, front posts, rear fender seams of the front fenders near the front door hinges, rocker panels, doors (front & rear if it is a 4 door), and centre post if it is a 4 door.
(CARS ONLY)
Dog legs, trunk (inner panels of trunks are pulled out and sometimes the spare tire if it is in our way), from the trunk
Area we can reach the rear fenders, up and over the inner wheel humps, up into the roof pillars, trunk floor, and trunk lid.
(PICK-UP TRUCKS)
We remove sun visors for a factory axis area for above windshields & top of front posts, we drill into the top of the door jam rear pillars to get into the double panelled roof & top of cab corners. Then halfway down on the same pillar another axis hole to get into the lower cab corner (especially if the truck is an extended cab for the underside of the extended cab window). The space between the cab and the box, rear tail lights must be pulled out to get into the inside of the rear fenders, box seams are sprayed (if customer has a box liner customer should remove it for easy reach. However if this is not possible it can still be sprayed under it), tailgate.
(FULL SIZE & MINI VANS)
Some vans have sliding doors or swing out barn doors, then roof pillars (either by factory holes or by our own drill holes) rear barn doors & door jams.
(ALL VEHICLES)
Then we spray all the exterior trim of the vehicle, (around the door handles, door locks, windshield trim, etc, and any crack or crevice or exterior seam that would trap salt & moister, then we spray in the wheel wells, behind the bumpers, lower rad support, engine cradle, motor mounts, tranny mounts, oil pan tranny pan, tranny linkages, lower control arms, frame floor, cross supports in floors, above heat shields, above gas tank, gas & brake lines, gas tank and above tank, rear axle & suspension, and lower trunk floor pan, and every nook and cranny in between.
(PICK-UP TRUCKS & FULL SIZE & MINI VANS)
All cross supports in box floor & van floors, dual tanks propane tanks, hitches, etc.
THANKS FOR READING THIS IS
NO RUST..........OUT
Last edited by NO RUSTIES; 05-23-06 at 09:18 AM.
05-27-06, 09:09 AM
#36
the sheetmetals used to make the vehicle are already treated for corrosion prevention.
read the following:
"Efforts to Combat Rust
(Two-part series: 2)
In the previous issue, we introduced the history and
mechanism of metallic coating, a representative
means of protecting steel sheets from rust. This issue
highlights Nippon Steel’s efforts to combat rust by
spotlighting galvannealed steel sheets (GA). GA has
now become the standard automotive body material in
Japan. As discussed in the previous issue, GA excels
not only in rust prevention but in various other properties
as well, including stampability and weldability."
http://www0.nsc.co.jp/shinnihon_engl...9021526463.pdf
read the following:
"Efforts to Combat Rust
(Two-part series: 2)
In the previous issue, we introduced the history and
mechanism of metallic coating, a representative
means of protecting steel sheets from rust. This issue
highlights Nippon Steel’s efforts to combat rust by
spotlighting galvannealed steel sheets (GA). GA has
now become the standard automotive body material in
Japan. As discussed in the previous issue, GA excels
not only in rust prevention but in various other properties
as well, including stampability and weldability."
http://www0.nsc.co.jp/shinnihon_engl...9021526463.pdf
08-27-06, 08:31 AM
#37
3.5 Year Rust Spot Check
I took a look under my 3.5 year old car and don't see any rust on the frame or panels, though there are a few bolts into the frame that are rusty - some of these appear to be OEM attaching the rear wheel assembly. Most of the OEM bolts are really clean and rust even corrosion-free from visual inspection. So, so far so good. I did not have this vehicle after-market rustproofed (I am considering a-m rustproofing on a new vehicle that doesn't seem to have the waxy sealer in the door drain holes the Lexus has.)
What is really troubling is the severe rusting on the hitch (dealer took off of prior car, also dealer installed) I had installed at the dealer when the car was new - those bolts are really rusted - I am thinking of having someone dismount the hitch and rustproof it and try to rustproof the frame holes there. Do you think it's worth doing this? I can't see the rear bumper area as Fern had said he had some corrosion there in post #21 in 9/83.
What is really troubling is the severe rusting on the hitch (dealer took off of prior car, also dealer installed) I had installed at the dealer when the car was new - those bolts are really rusted - I am thinking of having someone dismount the hitch and rustproof it and try to rustproof the frame holes there. Do you think it's worth doing this? I can't see the rear bumper area as Fern had said he had some corrosion there in post #21 in 9/83.
08-27-06, 10:42 AM
#38
Moderator
Rust on bolts can also be due to dis-similar metals working up bi-metalic voltage potential causing oxidation. This is non environement issue and any surface coating would not help .. infact it may mask the problem.
Salim
Salim
09-14-16, 01:15 PM
#39
Driver School Candidate
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Location: ON
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Great Conversation.
I chatted with a Toyota mechanic and mentioned any rustproof that is oil-based will destroy any plastics (under the hood) or rubber in the car.
Based off this conversation things we need to watch out is big.
1. Non-reputable rust proof companies (does anyone have a list? does this include Krown?)
2. Can we ask rust proof companies not to drill holes? Or does that defeat the purpose?
3. If not oil based, what do you recommend?
I also heard, the metal used for Lexus cars designed to slow the process of rust forming. Is this true?
Thanks in advance
I chatted with a Toyota mechanic and mentioned any rustproof that is oil-based will destroy any plastics (under the hood) or rubber in the car.
Based off this conversation things we need to watch out is big.
1. Non-reputable rust proof companies (does anyone have a list? does this include Krown?)
2. Can we ask rust proof companies not to drill holes? Or does that defeat the purpose?
3. If not oil based, what do you recommend?
I also heard, the metal used for Lexus cars designed to slow the process of rust forming. Is this true?
Thanks in advance
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