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Damage on block mating surface

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Old 12-04-17, 07:55 PM   #1
suprasoup
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Default Damage on block mating surface

I'm currently in the process of doing a head gasket change and im cleaning the mating surface and I notice these areas that look like possible corosion or something.

Is this normal and is it ok to proceed with the head gasket change or should i send it to the machine shop?

thanks
Damage on block mating surface-20171204_192937.jpgDamage on block mating surface-20171204_192944.jpg
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Old 12-05-17, 03:54 AM   #2
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you will need to get that surface decked / milled if measurements still allow it.

corrosion looks like is on the ring of fire looking at the first picture and won't have a perfect seal

coolant may sip into the combustion chamber or exhaust gasses into the coolant/
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Old 12-05-17, 07:46 AM   #3
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Originally Posted by gerrb View Post
you will need to get that surface decked / milled if measurements still allow it.

corrosion looks like is on the ring of fire looking at the first picture and won't have a perfect seal

coolant may sip into the combustion chamber or exhaust gasses into the coolant/
Thanks thats what i was thinking, it sucks cuz I only see it around the first piston and others look good. Since I'm going to have to dissasemble the block now what bearings do you guys recommend. I guess I should have the crank polished while Im at it haha.
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Old 12-05-17, 01:30 PM   #4
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I found a Machine shop here in Phoenix by the name of Akina Motorsportz. Looks like they specialize on 2jz's and other imports so that's a plus. They quoted me about $400 to deck the head and the block, hone the cylinder walls and polish the crank does this seem like a good deal? I have never had machine work done before.

Thanks.
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Old 12-05-17, 02:05 PM   #5
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The combustion chamber sealing ring looks pretty borderline. Was the head equally eaten?

Your best bet is to deck the block and mill the head but honestly $400 is a bit steep.
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Old 12-05-17, 03:40 PM   #6
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Originally Posted by 2013FSport View Post
The combustion chamber sealing ring looks pretty borderline. Was the head equally eaten?

Your best bet is to deck the block and mill the head but honestly $400 is a bit steep.
Yeah I'm pretty sure I'm going to have both machined I haven't checked the head as of yet. I will do that tonight and will update. The $400 is with me rounding it up, it comes out to about $375 before tax and that's for the decking the block, milling the head, honing the cylinder walls and polishing the crank. Does this still seem steep? What would you say is an average price for the same work done? I will probably check a few other places just liked the idea that Akina Motorsportz seems familiar with our motors.

Is polishing the crank worth it if the motor did not have any bearing issues and it all looks good?
Should I hone the cylinder walls even if the cross hatching is still visible?
Don't want to cut corners but I do want to make sure I'm getting my money worth in the things I'm doing for this build. I am going NA-T by the way.

Thanks for the reply.
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Old 12-06-17, 04:08 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by suprasoup View Post
Yeah I'm pretty sure I'm going to have both machined I haven't checked the head as of yet. I will do that tonight and will update. The $400 is with me rounding it up, it comes out to about $375 before tax and that's for the decking the block, milling the head, honing the cylinder walls and polishing the crank. Does this still seem steep? What would you say is an average price for the same work done? I will probably check a few other places just liked the idea that Akina Motorsportz seems familiar with our motors.

Is polishing the crank worth it if the motor did not have any bearing issues and it all looks good?
Should I hone the cylinder walls even if the cross hatching is still visible?
Don't want to cut corners but I do want to make sure I'm getting my money worth in the things I'm doing for this build. I am going NA-T by the way.

Thanks for the reply.
I have put them back together looking like what yours does, that is if this is for an NA motor, turbo motor no way do the machining. It isn't optimum, as others have said you would be better off to do the machining work, but it will work. It kind of depends on what you are going to do with the car. If you are going to put it back together, take a wood block and scotchbrite pad and clean it as best you can. If you are going to tear it the rest of the way down, I would say the quote you have sounds decent.
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Old 12-06-17, 09:17 AM   #8
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1. Leave the crank alone.
2. Don't hone the cylinders unless you're replacing the rings.
3. If you are replacing the rings or pistons ask "do you have a torque plate for this?" If the answer is "No" or "What?" go somewhere else.
4. Milling the block or head affects the position of the camshafts shortening the distance to the crank pulley. I don't know how much (in degrees) but since the cam pulleys are not adjustable the cams will no longer be in stock position.
5. for a turbo install replace the pistons to lower compression.
6. if this is a VVTi replace the rods.
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Old 12-06-17, 11:04 AM   #9
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1. Leave the crank alone. Any reason you suggest not getting it polished?
2. Don't hone the cylinders unless you're replacing the rings. I plan on getting new rings if I hone it.
3. If you are replacing the rings or pistons ask "do you have a torque plate for this?" If the answer is "No" or "What?" go somewhere else. Will do, thanks for the heads up
4. Milling the block or head affects the position of the camshafts shortening the distance to the crank pulley. I don't know how much (in degrees) but since the cam pulleys are not adjustable the cams will no longer be in stock position. Will keep this in mind.
5. for a turbo install replace the pistons to lower compression. I plan on doing NA-T with stock internals since it will be able to handle my power goals of about 500whp. However I will lower compression with a different HG.
6. if this is a VVTi replace the rods. It is non VVTI
Ok so you think I should leave the crank as is if all looks good and I figured I would go ahead and have it honed and replace the rings for good measure since it will already be bare block. So sounds like crank polishing isn't really worth it would you agree anyone else want to comment on this. Is honing not really necessary since cylinders still have cross hatching and good compression or would it be worth going ahead and doing it since it will be there. I still have not checked the head yet but if its free of pitting/corrosion and straight I probably shouldn't touch it either then would you agree. If all in all checks out you think I should just deck the block and just put new bearings in?
Like I said I want it to be done right and not cut corners however I want my moneys worth.

Thanks for the reply.
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Old 12-06-17, 03:07 PM   #10
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Your GE 10:1 pistons are strong enough for 500 hp (JM2).
However, you will develop knock at a lower boost, lower spark, and richer mixture than the GTE 8.5:1, and these setting are your safety margin. The head gasket change alone is better but isn't enough since the GE dome volume is larger.
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Old 12-07-17, 03:57 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kitabel View Post
Your GE 10:1 pistons are strong enough for 500 hp (JM2).
However, you will develop knock at a lower boost, lower spark, and richer mixture than the GTE 8.5:1, and these setting are your safety margin. The head gasket change alone is better but isn't enough since the GE dome volume is larger.
Actually ge pistons and GTE are made of exact same castings inclusive of rangelands. Toyota 2jz OEM pistons can handle upwards of 800 hp . Its the rods and rod bolts that need attention especially when these newer small frame turbo are being used with e85 as they are making torque alot quicker which the OEM rods would be on borrowed time .

I have been at 600rwhp on 93oct since 2010 and still on original block and I use ge block with GTE head gasket and my measured compression ratio is around 9:4:1. Comes down to supporting parts , quality of ECU and most important, tuner abilities ...your tuner can make or break any setup
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Old 12-07-17, 07:35 AM   #12
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Actually ge pistons and GTE are made of exact same castings

Compare photographs
Compare part numbers
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Old 12-07-17, 08:57 AM   #13
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Originally Posted by lexforlife View Post
Actually ge pistons and GTE are made of exact same castings inclusive of rangelands. Toyota 2jz OEM pistons can handle upwards of 800 hp . Its the rods and rod bolts that need attention especially when these newer small frame turbo are being used with e85 as they are making torque alot quicker which the OEM rods would be on borrowed time .

I have been at 600rwhp on 93oct since 2010 and still on original block and I use ge block with GTE head gasket and my measured compression ratio is around 9:4:1. Comes down to supporting parts , quality of ECU and most important, tuner abilities ...your tuner can make or break any setup
Wow that's impressive to be running 600whp for that long. Do you have a build thread? I would love to be around those numbers reliably for that long. Do you have any input on the machine work I should have done? From what I know the motor has not had any issues prior to me buying it head gasket looked like it was not leaking, compression test was good, still have cross hatching and the head is super clean not really oil stained on the inside at all. I still have not checked the mating surface but will update once I do. Here are some pictures of the head I have currently.
Damage on block mating surface-engine.jpg
Damage on block mating surface-engine2.jpg
Damage on block mating surface-engine3.jpg
Damage on block mating surface-engine4.jpg
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Old 12-07-17, 09:41 AM   #14
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NA or boost?
New rings equals hone job and you need to remove that ridge up top before yanking the pistons out.
Crank polish is cheap like $30... Likely worth it. It may cost more if they mag it and clean it.

Some of your fees are cleaning and inspection if done in a better shop. But still $400 seems steep compared to these parts.

What do you intend to do with the head? Was this a core motor or DD that needs freshened? How many miles on it? What is your goal?
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Old 12-07-17, 10:08 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 2013FSport View Post
NA or boost?
New rings equals hone job and you need to remove that ridge up top before yanking the pistons out.
Crank polish is cheap like $30... Likely worth it. It may cost more if they mag it and clean it.

Some of your fees are cleaning and inspection if done in a better shop. But still $400 seems steep compared to these parts.

What do you intend to do with the head? Was this a core motor or DD that needs freshened? How many miles on it? What is your goal?
Looking to boost the car shooting for 500-600whp
How do you recommend removing the ridge on the top is it just carbon build up?
Do I need to hone it if it stills has cross hatching and good compression or worth it since I already have it torn down?
It's was a DD with 65k miles on it. I just want it done right since I'm this far into the motor but want to keep stock pistons and rods but plan on doing ARP hardware and updating head with new springs, valve seals. I already got a new oil pump, water pump and gaskets/seals.
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