Yesterday I killed the battery, again! Not sure how, pulled the car from the garage into the driveway to wash it. 1.5 hours later it would not start. I must have left it in a mode that turned everything on but didn't notice. Called CAA for a boost. When the guy came, he connected his booster and away we went.

In speaking with him briefly, he says he owns a rustproofing shop and is hyper leary of hybrids. Here is the point of this post. He stated that I should be able to boost the car with a simple 9V battery, ya know the square ones. Suggests attaching a couple of wires long enough to contact the boost point +ve terminal in the fuse box and a ground. I'm not about to kill the battery to try it. His point was that all the car needs its a bit more juice and it should start. No starter motor, not much current draw so in his opinion it should work. I didn't ask if he actually did that (should have). So, over to the experts here; whaddaya think?

Me, I think it's crap, but I could be wrong.

 

Been there done that! I think just having the key fob in close proximity to car makes it think 'I gotta get ready to start'. Washed my car in the driveway earlier this winter when we had a warm spell. Kept key fob in my pants pocket. Never donned on me that the car was thinking 'oh my owner is going to open the door and start me up. I better get ready for him .... and drain the battery while I'm waiting'. Wasn't until I was washing around the door handles and the thing started locking and unlocking that it donned on me, oh ***** here we go again. Put the fob into a faraday pouch I have so that the car would 'go to sleep'. Now I make it a habit, especially since I just got my battery replaced under warranty, and unlock the car, put key in the faraday pouch, wash the car, then take key out and put car back in garage.

Just googled your 9 volt battery 'suggestion' and it looks like it's bogus. There's hardly any amperage in the first place in a small 9 volt and our computers won't see it register close to 12 volts which is the threshold it's looking for to say 'Houston we have ignition'.

 

Funny story, I almost killed my batter the first time at maybe 30 miles while putting the wind deflectors on the windows, I had to roll them down, so I turned the key to start position (there is no key, but what I am saying is you push the button once for accessory, and second time to start position without pressing on the breaks), so second press without starting the vehicle, anyway maybe 10 minutes later I started getting all kinds of errors so switched the car off and walked away. The next thing I was trying to open the doors and they would not open, I am like what the heck, nothing works, and the manual door handle only opened the door half way, but I could not open it all the way... So I walked away and maybe half an hour later I came back and the doors opened just fine this time, the car started, and the next thing I see the check engine light I am like great I did not even drive this thing and already messed things up. So I cleared a bunch of codes myself and a few days later decided to go to the dealership, so they can check codes and everything with their fancy scan tool, and make sure everything still OK. Well, what do you know, they could not find a single code and nothing was wrong with a car. Only later on I realized that all that mess happened because I almost killed the battery and then I erased all the codes myself that were result of that almost drained battery. So crisis averted right... wrooong. I am working on the car again probably at 60 miles now, once again I need some power, so once again I turn the key to start position, but do not start the vehicle thinking I will be done really quick and I do not want to start is just for a few minutes and then guess what... battery completely dies this time around. I have a Noco booster which is like 1000A that I use all the time to start my other gasoline car, guess what, I was not able to start my hybrid Lexus with it, I think hybrid Lexus needs a really powerful jump starter or I was doing something wrong or it really needs a loooot of juice to get ready to start, anyway I jump start with my other car, cleared all the codes and I finally realize that if I need to power something ever again, and I need to put the key in start position, no matter if I need it for a minute, I better start the car, because seems like the hybrid uses that tiny 12v for everything and it just sucks all the juice out of is in the matter or minutes, especially when I did not drive my car for a while, so the battery was weak. So yeah I am learning it a hard way that I got to be very careful with these hybrid vehicles and what I thought would be a norm with any other ICE vehicles, hybrids are very sensitive Anyway, back to your question, if you do not want to end up in the same situation, instead of just 9v boost battery, which may works or may not, consider just getting yourself a powerful jump starter, that are made to jump start dead vehicles.

 

the post is somewhat confusing, but , i think what you are trying to say is that depending on the state of battery capacity or draw down, a Noco booster will not work. That is concerning and I think I read that at least one other person here had a Rav4 Prime who also needed a much larger charger/booster to start the vehicle. If you dont have access to a home charger or trickle charger .that is concerning if you are out and about....
Does anyone have any ideas on why the NOCO did not work?
If the only needs of the 12v battery is to power the computer and sensors....this does not make sense...

I can tell you that when I read the battery CCA capacity w my diagnostic tool, the CCA measured in the hybrid engine compartment location, the CCA value was much less than measured at the battery itself.....
To be continued.

 

There are several Noco jump starters with different power ratings from 500A to 3000A, all I was saying is that the one I have that works fine for regular vehicle 1000A seems like does not provide enough juice for the hybrid and all you would need is to get a more powerful jump starter like maybe 2000A, or go big or go home 3000A, maybe an overkill, but that last one should start a bus probably. By the way that 12v battery was powering all the lights, sensors, computers, AC fan, heat car, heat seats etc etc.

 

Hi. 450h+ F-Sport here.
I have had to use Rescue Service once for flat battery and have used an old NOCO starter that I had for my Volvo twice. It is quite difficult to get a good connection to the Positive in the fuse box and a negative close to the box, because the leads are too short and there is some kind of plating on the positive terminal. Once contact is made, the car wakes up immediately. The booster does not need to be "powerful", but it does need a good connection, so longer leads might be the answer for me, at least.

That said, I went for a battery capacity check and charge, the result was the battery was completely OK. I am however skeptical about the battery charging over time because many short runs seems to discharge the battery. I am getting the impression that the batteery charges properly whendriving all-electric, but not so well when driving on the ICE. I have a small cheap usb charger/voltmeter that I can check voltages with as I drive, so I will continue to check this and see what I can find out.

 

I've used my non-Noco booster on a traditional Toyota V8 engine system and it had no problem starting the very dead battery, but the instructions specifically indicate that when using the booster you should only keep it connected for a very short period of time, just to power the starter motor.

I brought this topic up in a Rav4 forum and there was mention that the Battery booster may not have been connected long enough to provide a good charige to a dead battery. Would you please share how long you had the NOCO booster connected to your battery before you decided it was not going to work and then disconnected it?

 

Traditional engines I believe work somewhat different from hybrids, and I believe hybrids do not even have the starter or it works somewhat differently and the car uses the battery instead of a starter. At least when I hooked up my battery tester, I could not test the starter at all, the tester just could not see the starter at all. I mean the message was "Waiting for engine to start..." till it times out. I tried to use my 1000A Noco several times, one time I kept it for a minute or so, just while trying to start the car... nothing, waited a few seconds, tried to start the car again... nothing, waited a few seconds then tried to start the car again... nothing, well then I just gave up. The other time I kept it for a while to the point when my Noco jump starter battery fully drained to like 25% or whatever it is till the first bar basically started to blink. Also the problem could be this, since the clamps on the jump starter are short, the way I connect the jump starter is I connected my Noco to the 8' jumper cable, then that jumper cable was connected to the post in the fuse box and the other end to the metal frame on the passenger side as it says in the user manual.

 

I have the Noco jumper pack also, but so far I had not had to used, since I have a trickle charger cable off the rear battery and just let it charge the battery for awhile. But this is a concern, since I see it under the read seat for access.

I am kind of surprised the NOCO will not jump the hybrid, since all the 12v battery is doing at the time is just running the ECM to engage the hybrid system- as I understand. That implies it had to be supplied power until at least the "Ready" light is on, I suspect. On my 350H, it is usually just a few seconds, but I had noticed a few odd "starts" that seem to take a lot longer for some reason.
I
Here something to try next time. The NOCO jumpers have more safety standards than most. They will not supply power unlesss all safety check are met and it uses the current battery voltage as one of these checks. I have seen UT videos where a battery was so dead, one has to use the NOCO override function to just start even an ICsE. But if you do use it, just make sure you have the connections correct before using it. One you use the override, you just a much safety checks as a set of jumper cables - none.

Here is the clip from the NOCO of my GBX45:
Low Voltage Batteries & Manual Override.
The GBX45 is designed to jump start 12-volt lead-acid batteries down to 3-volts. If your battery is below 3-volts, the Boost LED will be «off». This is an indication
that the GBX45 can not detect a battery. If you need to jump start a battery below 3-volts there is a manual override feature, which allows you to force «on» the
jump start function.
CAUTION.
USE THIS MODE WITH EXTREME CARE. THIS MODE IS FOR 12-VOLT LEAD-ACID BATTERIES ONLY. BOTH THE SPARK PROOF AND REVERSE POLARITY
PROTECTION FEATURES ARE DISABLED. PAY VERY CLOSE ATTENTION TO THE POLARITY OF THE BATTERY BEFORE USING THIS MODE. DO NOT ALLOW THE
POSITIVE AND NEGATIVE BATTERY CLAMPS TO TOUCH OR CONNECT TO EACH OTHER AS THE PRODUCT WILL GENERATE SPARKS. THIS MODE USES VERY
HIGH CURRENT (UP TO 1250 AMPS) THAT CAN CAUSE SPARKS AND HIGH HEAT IF NOT USED PROPERLY. IF YOU ARE UNSURE ABOUT USING THIS MODE, DO
NOT ATTEMPT AND SEEK PROFESSIONAL HELP."

 

To answer "How long was it connected?"
I have noticed that when I connect my NOCO boost it takes some seconds (30, 40?) to work, making some clicking sounds, then the car wakes up and I can push the Start Button to bring in the main battery. What I think it is doing is providing enough charge so that the 12v battery can switch on the electronics properly. The NOCO is charging, not trying to crank the motor, so the amount of charge doesn't need to "start a bus". I have no idea why the electronics is so sensitive to a lower 12v battery voltage.

I'm talking about the 450h+ only, because it is the only version I know, but I assume all of the hybrids are more or less the same. The starter button always starts the car in electric mode and then the traction battery (355 volt) begins to operate the voltage converter in the back to provide 14.4 volts to the battery bus, and I assume it starts to charge the 12v battery and runs all the electronics. To start the 2.5 l engine, the traction battery runs the high voltage generator as an electric motor to turn over the motor and start it. The gas engine is an Atkinson cycle motor and does not need a huge cranking current. The same happens in the older RX with a 3.5 liter v6 my friend has and he also has the 12v battery problem.

 

Hi, thanks for all the information.
Please read the answer I sent to Lexicon 1

 

That woud be assumption too. One may even have to cycle the NOCO jumper maybe a few time on a really low voltage battery, since I think it times out relatively quickly for an ICE.

I am expecting at some point, we might see jumpers for at least a Toyota hybrid system. Or at least a hybrid vs ICE option on jumpers. Hybrids don't need a lot high of amp surge, but more the ability to stablize a 12 dead battery hybrid system to allow the hybrid system to engerize to "Ready" status. I would also assume they could be smaller and a few "charger" timer options to allow some battery charging if big enough capacity to allow a start.

 

Oreon333
Here is the video I referenced in another post above.(from the rav4world.com site )
There is a Noco booster override function if the 12v battery is too low.
Given the potential not so good connection of having an additional cable referenced in your original post which was connected to the booster to bridge the distance to the correct negative terminal on the engine. And that the battery may have been too depleted. This may explain why your booster didnt get the job done

see video
(note: some folks have permanently extended the negative cable on their battery booster by either using the appropriate crimp connector or soldered new extension cable to improve the connection of the added wire length)

I have so far not needed to "jump" my hybrid but hope my booster works when the time comes.

 

Per the manual, when using the Overdide function, it disables the 60 seconds timeout function also. That should give the 12 battery some time to charge a bt, if needed, and some extra time for the hybrid system to start.

I also had not used the jumper yet, so this thread has given us aheads up if we get a jumper failure. But like others, I have ran the battery down just leaving the door opens to low or pushing the time in accessory mode to far.

 

Yeah thanks everybody for all the information, maybe in the future I will just find some bolt or something for the ground next to the positive terminal in a fuse box, so I do not have to makeshift something to get to the ground on the other side of a vehicle, and just use the original cable clamps.