"Hold" Brake catastrophic failure, HELP!
01-16-19, 08:15 AM
#16
From what I understand if the parking brake is on, isn't it supposed to show a light on the dash? Since I had never used the feature before, I was staring pretty hard at the dash and know there were no other strange lights on other than the 2 "Hold" lights. I am about to have it towed to the shop. I wonder if the feature just hadn't been used in so long that something got stuck/malfunctioned. 
As for the other strange indications, that may be related to a defective starting battery. You probably already know this, but in case you don't, the starting battery is in the trunk, under the floor. Sometimes the starting batteries have intermittent problems due to loose particles in their cells or loose connections within the battery. Flooded cell batteries that have been damaged by complete discharge events are prone to develop deposits on their plates that can break loose and cause problems.
You are wise to understand that fully discharging a battery often spells its end. However, the LS600s use an AGM battery and AGM batteries are able to suffer some complete discharges without sustaining permanent damage. I suggest that you look at your starting battery to see if it is an AGM type. The AGM batteries are much more expensive than flooded cell batteries and are often replaced, when they fail, with flooded cell types to save money.
Replacement AGM batteries for these cars can be hard to find. I hope you don't need one but if you find yourself in that unfortunate situation, one of our forum members posted some good info that may help you. I'll try to find it if you need it.
01-16-19, 08:32 AM
#17
Driver School Candidate
Thread Starter
I agree with several others that your brake problem is probably due to the HOLD defaulting to parking-brake-set. There are three conditions that come to mind that force the parking brake to be set when the car is in the HOLD mode: a) watchdog timeout, b) driver's seatbelt disconnected, or c) driver's door opened. The warning message can be difficult to see in certain light conditions. As for the smell, when you are sensitized by one of these events, the residual oder can be mistaken for a current event. I know, you were there and I wasn't.
As for the other strange indications, that may be related to a defective starting battery. You probably already know this, but in case you don't, the starting battery is in the trunk, under the floor. Sometimes the starting batteries have intermittent problems due to loose particles in their cells or loose connections within the battery. Flooded cell batteries that have been damaged by complete discharge events are prone to develop deposits on their plates that can break loose and cause problems.
You are wise to understand that fully discharging a battery often spells its end. However, the LS600s use an AGM battery and AGM batteries are able to suffer some complete discharges without sustaining permanent damage. I suggest that you look at your starting battery to see if it is an AGM type. The AGM batteries are much more expensive than flooded cell batteries and are often replaced, when they fail, with flooded cell types to save money.
Replacement AGM batteries for these cars can be hard to find. I hope you don't need one but if you find yourself in that unfortunate situation, one of our forum members posted some good info that may help you. I'll try to find it if you need it.
As for the other strange indications, that may be related to a defective starting battery. You probably already know this, but in case you don't, the starting battery is in the trunk, under the floor. Sometimes the starting batteries have intermittent problems due to loose particles in their cells or loose connections within the battery. Flooded cell batteries that have been damaged by complete discharge events are prone to develop deposits on their plates that can break loose and cause problems.
You are wise to understand that fully discharging a battery often spells its end. However, the LS600s use an AGM battery and AGM batteries are able to suffer some complete discharges without sustaining permanent damage. I suggest that you look at your starting battery to see if it is an AGM type. The AGM batteries are much more expensive than flooded cell batteries and are often replaced, when they fail, with flooded cell types to save money.
Replacement AGM batteries for these cars can be hard to find. I hope you don't need one but if you find yourself in that unfortunate situation, one of our forum members posted some good info that may help you. I'll try to find it if you need it.
When I picked up the vehicle in Florida the starter battery in the trunk was totally dead, so we had to jump it & reprogram the key via the 10 button "lock/unlock" sequence. However, driving the car 950~ miles back to Arkansas gave it a nice charge. I took it to Advanced Auto the next day to have them test the battery, and it tested "good", but I suppose giving it a few more days to drain before this "hold brake" issue may have been long enough to expose that the battery needs replacing after all. I'll bring this up with my mechanic when we talk later today. If we can resolve the brake issue, I agree the rest of the symptoms seem to have been related to electrical system, so a new starter battery may be the solution. Since the hybrid battery and fan assembly were all replaced at the dealership last May, I wouldn't expect there to be any major issues there.One thing I was concerned with is that I drained the hybrid battery down while it was in limp mode trying to get it home, until the display showed 1 purple bar, and it refused to let me drive any further with the "Check Traction Battery" notice appearing on the dash. Does anyone know if I will need to have the hybrid battery recharged? Can it be trickle charged similarly to a standard battery?
01-16-19, 03:24 PM
#18
If you need to replace the starting battery, here's the info: https://www.clublexus.com/forums/ls-...-this-one.html
01-19-19, 08:53 AM
#19
Instructor
Agreed with the parking brake engaged but yes, you should have a red P on the dash. Same happened to me when I first got my car by pushing the what I called "the drive thru" button because Id only use it in drivethrus. Went to pull forward after a long wait and nothing. Panicked for a second and saw the bring red P. Pulled the park switch and good to go.
02-02-19, 07:35 AM
#20
I would definitely replace the 12v battery no matter what. You mentioned the battery for the 12V system was dead and charged on the drive back to Arkansas. You then had it tested and it tested good. I have had that same scenario on my 2000 LS and 2003 LS and out of nowhere the car would buck and spit and random lights would activate on the dash. My 07 LS460 has not had any battery related issue yet and I don't have a hybrid but even though these battery's may test good, the car will still do some weird things once the battery goes completely dead and is recharged and presumed to be "good". I even had my hand held volt meter and my radar detector connected and both were reading above 12.6v.....the minute I replaced the battery everything went back to normal, but again....I don't have the hybrid ....I do believe the 12v batteries in these LS's play a larger role then many people think....
02-04-19, 11:31 AM
#21
So i have used the brake hold feature extensively on my LS. I now have 179K miles on my LS and every time i drive, i have the 'hold' feature turned on. A couple of things i've noticed that I want to share:
1. The feature works perfectly on the flat land.
2. If you are on the incline, the feature will work.
3. Feature will not engage if you are at a decline. A little bit, 1 or 2 degrees is fine but anything over 3 degrees, i find the feature not engaging.
4. Now this one is most important one - I believe the feature is looking for the movement in the vehicle before it engages the break. I have noticed a few times if i'm really slow, like .5 miles or 1 mile an hour, slow enough that you can't even tell the car is moving the feature will engage and brings the car to an immediate stop.
5. If sitting on a long traffic light, the car will automatically engage parking break.
6. If you are sitting with the break hold on and take off the seat belt, the car will go into parking mode.
7. If you are sitting with the break hold engaged and open the drivers door, the car will go into the parking mode (yes I did test all of these scenario when i was figuring out the break hold a few years ago - LOL)
Now the issue at hand. On the right side of your steering wheel, 'Auto Break' feature, can you try disable that feature.That feature usually is responsible to engage parking break every time when you put the vehicle in park or disengage when you put it in D or R. Once your vehicle is mobile, you may want to try the break hold after disengaging the 'Auto Break' feature. I've found LS to be very sensitive to any sensor malfunction. One time one of my air intake manifold was a little loose and the following warning lights came on:
1. Check engine
2. Caution Light
3. Cruise Not available
4. TCS Not Available
5. Break Hold Not available
Took us a few hours to diagnose the issue, but just fixing that loose manifold and letting the car computer reset fixed the issue. Therefore, it may be just a small issue and you may be seeing multiple warning signs due to it.
Please keep us posted of the outcome. I hope its something as simple as a loose air intake manifold
1. The feature works perfectly on the flat land.
2. If you are on the incline, the feature will work.
3. Feature will not engage if you are at a decline. A little bit, 1 or 2 degrees is fine but anything over 3 degrees, i find the feature not engaging.
4. Now this one is most important one - I believe the feature is looking for the movement in the vehicle before it engages the break. I have noticed a few times if i'm really slow, like .5 miles or 1 mile an hour, slow enough that you can't even tell the car is moving the feature will engage and brings the car to an immediate stop.
5. If sitting on a long traffic light, the car will automatically engage parking break.
6. If you are sitting with the break hold on and take off the seat belt, the car will go into parking mode.
7. If you are sitting with the break hold engaged and open the drivers door, the car will go into the parking mode (yes I did test all of these scenario when i was figuring out the break hold a few years ago - LOL)
Now the issue at hand. On the right side of your steering wheel, 'Auto Break' feature, can you try disable that feature.That feature usually is responsible to engage parking break every time when you put the vehicle in park or disengage when you put it in D or R. Once your vehicle is mobile, you may want to try the break hold after disengaging the 'Auto Break' feature. I've found LS to be very sensitive to any sensor malfunction. One time one of my air intake manifold was a little loose and the following warning lights came on:
1. Check engine
2. Caution Light
3. Cruise Not available
4. TCS Not Available
5. Break Hold Not available
Took us a few hours to diagnose the issue, but just fixing that loose manifold and letting the car computer reset fixed the issue. Therefore, it may be just a small issue and you may be seeing multiple warning signs due to it.
Please keep us posted of the outcome. I hope its something as simple as a loose air intake manifold
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