riknchar

So I had an hour to kill yesterday and I was near my local Lexus dealership, so I decided to swing by to test drive a new 2017 LS460. I have owned my 2008 LS600hL for nearly 3 years, and still totally love the car, but I've been wondering if I'd like the features to be had in the updated LS (BSM, new interior style, updated exterior style, etc.). I also admit that I have some slight concerns about the possibility of my hybrid batteries dying now that my 8-year warranty is up (REF: CJITTY's terrible experience), and I wanted to see how the non-hybrid LS compared to my 600.

Impressions: The car I test drove was a SWB LS460 fairly loaded up (had Radar Cruise, but no semi-annaline leather). I do like the updated interior of the updated LS; it seems quite a bit more up-to-date and modern compared to my LS600. However, I'm not really sold on the mouse interface. I did like the nice large/wide screen in the 2017, but I'm so used to my touchscreen that the mouse seemed way more cumbersome to actually use. I'm also still not that much of a fan of the spindle grill -- I think the 2007-12 front end is more understated and elegant, which I like.

In terms of how the car drove, I could definitely notice a bit more engine noise compared to my nearly silent LS600, and I did notice the transmission shifting gears (something I haven't experience for 3 years). The shifts were smooth and the car drove very well, but not quite as smooth and quiet as my LS600. I can say for certain the LS600 feels more substantial and powerful than the 460, although I do know the 0-60 times are nearly the same. It's just the smooth, quiet torque of the hybrid motors that make the difference.

I did really like the addition of Blind Spot Monitoring, and wish that my car had it. Not a make-or-break kind of thing, but a nice safety feature.

While I was driving around in the 2017, I had the Lexus guys take a look at my LS600 to see what they could offer in trade-in. They came back with a cash offer of $19,400. While this low number didn't surprise me too much, I admit I was a bit disappointed that my dealer didn't try harder to take care of me (I had bought the 600 from him for $43K less than 3 years ago, and only put 20K miles on the car).

My Lexus Dealer (Lexus of Omaha) is one of the new Plus (+) Stores, which means they no longer haggle. Their "no-haggle" price on their 2017 LS460 was $80K (sticker was $82K). I was not impressed...

So, in the end, I enjoyed some free Lexus coffee, drove around for an hour in a new LS460, and was reassured that I'm driving the perfect car for me (my LS600). There was definitely no way the 2017 LS460 was worth 4 times the value of my LS600, and with my "Extended CPO" warranty covering me for the next 3 years, it just makes zero sense for me to upgrade now.

I went home and washed and waxed my 600, and thought I'd post a few current photos here. She's holding up pretty well for 9 year old car with 79K miles! I do think the 2008 body style does have a certain "presence" that you don't really get from the newer "spindle-grill" versions (just my humble opinion).

roadfrog

Great post Rick! Glad to hear that the grass isn't greener.....and she's a beauty.

dlbuckls10

I test drove a 2010 600hL and its just hard to describe how it's so much nicer, smoother, and quieter than the 2010 460 I own. The 600hL is awesome and a car you would have to drive to appreciate. Beautiful pictures and a beautiful 600hL.

SW17LS

It ought to be better for as much money as they cost new lol

comotiger

Hi Rick, your 600hL is gorgeous. I agree the 2007-12 front end has a certain gravitas that the spindle grille takes away. The 600hL has an especially mean look because of the array of three projector headlights. The BSM and RCTA are good features in the 2013+, along with better thigh support for driver, larger Nav screen and infotainment upgrades. But that cannot justify trading in your car at this time. You may be ready for the LS500 in a few years!

tlk2megoos

There is no such thing as no-haggle pricing unless you're looking at a Chevy dealership. Keep in mind the 460 fully loaded with the exception of executive package is invoiced at $66k or so. There's much more room to give than the $2k they tried to force you into.

greg3852

Actually its the new thing Lexus is doing in some of the dealerships where they don't haggle over the price. The price you see is what you pay. They are testing it all over the country.

That 600 is a beauty. I too love the older style over the 13+. It is classier looking.

SW17LS

Correct, "Lexus plus" dealers are no haggle, they will not discount past their set price.

And the invoice on that LS460 is way higher than $66k.

DJWLDW

Rick

Is the bald headed guy still the new car sales Mgr at Lexus of Omaha?

Dennis

riknchar

Dennis - I think you're referring to "Freddie," who I dealt with several times on purchases over the past 2-3 years (great guy!). He's actually moved on (back to Colorado I heard), and there's a new Sales Manager now who seems quite a bit less aggressive on making deals than Freddie was.

I don't know if the whole "Lexus Plus" thing has tied his hands, or if he's just way more conservative, but the great deals of the past seem to have dried up, at least at this Lexus dealership. I also have noted fairly large price increases on services (oil changes, etc.) under the new Lexus Plus concept. I'm a person who likes to negotiate face-to-face with a reasonable Sales Manager--it just seems un-American to not be able to negotiate--so this Lexus Plus thing is a huge turn-off to me.

riknchar

I totally agree! But the price differential really shrinks fast on the used models (the 600s depreciate way faster than the 460s), to the point that I believe the LS600 does offer a pretty respectable value if you're looking for a 4-8 year old model. You of course need to factor in the potential expense of new Hybrid Batteries (around $5K), but in the grand scheme of things, I don't think that's so bad. Consider that replacing all 4 air ride shocks will set you back around $6-7K (even at an Indie shop), and the knowledge that those shocks almost always do fail in the first 100K miles, and the hybrid battery doesn't seem quick so ominous.

I like to check the Lexus histories of some of the LS600s I see advertised on AutoTrader with 100K+ miles to see how many have had the Hybrid batteries replaced. I find very few that have had this repair, which tells me that the failure is still fairly rare even over 100K miles on the LS600...

SW17LS

It's tied his hands. We had a huge discussion about this in the CarChat forum, several people thought I was nuts for thinking this was a bad thing lol. $2k off an LS460, I can get $15k off right now with one phone call.

riknchar

It does remind me a bit of the Saturn "one-price" experiment that died in the 90s. It was initially a kind of cool concept, but it just doesn't work unless the deals being offered are very competitive in the first place.

Steve's point that other Lexus dealers will happily knock $15K off of a LS460 today to make a deal clearly show that this Lexus Plus experiment is also doomed to fail. I just hope corporate Lexus sees what a turn-off it is and shuts it down before it becomes company-wide policy. As for me, if I were going to buy a new LS460 now, I'd be traveling to another state to negotiate with a non-Lexus Plus dealership...

hfahmy

If you hybrid battery fails and Lexus pays absolutely nothing, for $7K investment you still have a gorgeous car that will serve you in style and comfort for 10 more years to come. Sounds like a much better deal than netting $60K+ for a 2017 that will be old style in 6 months...

hfahmy

Also, seems that Lexus stopped the production of LS600hl??? There is no 2017...If so, you already have a collectable...