Tec80

Let me chime in here, since I have a 2011 Sport with air suspension and 19" wheels and a 2012 AWD without air suspension and 18" wheels, and I drive both back-to-back on any given day:

The non-air car rides better than the air car, even when the air car is set to "Comfort" mode. I think this is because the 19" tires more than negate any benefit gained by the air suspension, but I can't try the 18" wheels on the Sport to verify this because they won't bolt-on...they hit the gigantic Brembo calipers.

One of the things that attracted me to the 2012 AWD was that it did NOT have air suspension. Nobody (not even Lexus!) has figured out how to make a reliable air spring that lives beyond 50,000 miles with a low failure rate. Air springs are not inherently expensive, but when combined with an electronically-variable shock absorber, their replacement cost is amplified. And having adjustable shock damping on an LS is of questionable value - so there is really no reason to order the option.

For me, the ultimate ride quality of an LS460 is affected more by tire choice and sidewall height than by air vs. non-air suspension option. Having an air-suspended car, I wouldn't buy one again if I had the choice - the Sport has already failed one front air strut, replaced under warranty.

dlbuckls10

For me, the ultimate ride quality of an LS460 is affected more by tire choice and sidewall height than by air vs. non-air suspension option. Having an air-suspended car, I wouldn't buy one again if I had the choice - the Sport has already failed one front air strut, replaced under warranty.[/QUOTE]

Tire choice can definitely affect the ride quality and noise level of any vehicle. I've experience it. The optional air suspension was designed for a smoother ride vs the non air. I could tell the difference when I test drove both prior to buying. I looked at the LS Sports and the salesman informed me that the ride wouldn't be as smooth as the 460 L. I have a '10 460 L with the air suspension and my co-worker an '12 without. He thinks my LS rides much smoother and he wants the air suspension in his next car. The air suspensions is one option I prefer although it can be pricy to repair.

Devh

I had a great opportunity to test drive both before purchasing. I felt that the air suspension was a lot more gimmicky. I could not feel much of a difference if any and in a way preferred the non air because it felt more nimble but that could also be the difference between RWD vs AWD. The Air suspension is not a deal breaker. I think the long wheel base cars will make the greatest difference in the ride quality.

dal20402

I too test drove cars with both. I did notice differences between the settings on the air suspension car. I could see the appeal of the air suspension on Sport when trying to drive with a bit more pace, but I had little use for Comfort -- too floaty and bobby. The non-air suspension is somewhere between the Normal and Sport settings on the air, and in my opinion just right for luxury without boatiness. It may seem firmer than expected, though, if you're used to very soft cars. As a bonus you get $200 (OEM) struts instead of $1000 ones.

GregCon

OK.....

I changed out the two rear struts with new, OEM air struts today. The job went well with no snags.

Now, the problem is when I finished the job and started the engine, the rear struts are not inflating. In fact, my impression is the air pump/compressor is not running at all. I tried using the 'high height' button to jog the system into action, but it appears to be doing nothing. I tried disconnecting and reconnecting the battery to no avail. I pulled and checked the 20 amp fuse in the passenger footwell; it was fine. No warning lights in the dash. It just isn't working. Any ideas? Is there some sort of of reset procedure I need to do for the pump?

Speaking of the pump...does anyone know where it is located? I can't even find it, and Google has been no help.


P.S. Suncore might have ebay auctions and a website but if you make any attempt to contact them they are unreachable. I even had a distributor of theirs (one located in Florida as are they) try to call them with no success.

Chuckwagon

Did you also change out the control modules? I don't know if there is a difference in the actual part or not, but there is a new control module part number, just as the part number for the strut changed. Perhaps the new strut needs the new controller? The dealer quoted me both parts as part of the repair, so I assumed they went together, and bought both. Just a guess though.

Lexuslsguy

Considering there are many examples of air-shocks lasting to well over 150k mile on both the 400 and 430 your statement is about longevity is fundamentally incorrect. I think you should be asking why are they failing at such a high rate on the 460 vs previous generations. But overall, the entire suspension on the 460 has proven to be less reliable then previous designs.

GregCon

By 'control module' do you mean the actuator that sits on top of each strut? No, I did not change those. They simply rotate off/on and I can't see any reason they could not re-used. They worked well on the morning of Sept. 25th so they should work well at lunch time. I did re-check them to make sure I had installed them properly, which I had.

The real bind I'm in is the paucity of information available on these cars. It seems like no one works on them and even the dealer mechanics fumble their way through repairs. I'd like to do more troubleshooting but don't even know where to start.

dlbuckls10

That might be the case for a small numbers of LS's. From what I've read, research, and talked with Lexus service advisors the air shocks failed notoriously on both the 400 and 430. The 460 air suspension and control arms is an issue that needs correcting. Regardless Lexus needs to remedy the problem with the next TOP SECRET generation LS.

Chuckwagon

Yes, the actuator. I agree that they should not NEED replacing if not bad. But I wouldn't put it past a manufacturer to link the one updated part to another updated part requiring both. More parts revenue.

My rear shocks were replaced by an independent, and nothing special was required for them to work. But I had both parts, the shock and the actuator, because I was told by the dealer that both were required for the repair. So that's the only thing I could think of. My repair wasn't just worn out shocks though, there was also a rattle like sound as well, and perhaps that was caused by the actuator and was why the dealer said both parts were required. So it'd be worth verifying that the new actuator is not required. If it is, import it direct from Japan, it'll save you a bunch. Two actuators, delivered, with import duties, are less than one from the dealer.

Hope you figure it out. Good luck.

GregCon

OK...I'll confess. I was the cause of the problem as I had a phone call come in mid-way through the installation of the right strut and did not get the air line fully engaged. It was allowing enough leakage that the compressor did not pump up the struts. So now it is (easily) fixed and working well. Thankfully.

I'll mention that on my car, at least, the air system has been fine. It's been the hydraulic portion of the struts that have failed (leaked). The left side even somehow was leaking oil into the air bags, which can't be good. The real issue I have with Lexus is not that the struts fail (though they shouldn't) but rather how expensive they are to replace. Through some careful shopping and doing the work myself, I managed to replace both rear struts for $1700 - still a lot of money. But on the whole, the average Lexus owner paying for this work at a dealership would be in the hole for $4,000 or so. That's a heavy hit every 50,000 miles. And that's only half the car.

'Quality' is a term that includes good body panel fit and status, but it also includes reliability and cost of ownership.

1BlinkGone

One thing you can do to prolong the life of the air shock bladders (and CV boots, for that matter) is to spray them with a rubber conditioning spray every 5-10k miles...or anytime you have the car up on the hoist. This will keep the rubber supple and more resistant to cracking from drying-out. Once I learned this trick, I would never, ever fail to treat those two areas again as it prevents premature failure...makes such a difference!

gte819s

Do you have a suggested product that works for the conditioning?

aypues

The Air suspension is just the way it is. All manufacturers have this. It's more complicated.
The control arms, however, DO need to be revised for longevity and simplicity.
SPEAKING of the NEXT GEN LS....it's rumored the concept will be released at the Tokyo Motor Show at the end of the month!!! And then released for 2017 Model Year!!

retlex

I use Aerospace 303 on all the CV boots, control arm bushings and air shock bladder. For the air shock bladder, I jack up the car to fully extend the air shock exposing the maximum area of the shock bladder, then spray it. It is a little time consuming cleaning and spraying, but I enjoy working on my car. Also nice to keep an eye on the suspension too.