MagicP

So im looking at a 2012 LS460 with 171k miles it has really consistent service records from 2012 through 2016 then the matience history goes dark from 120k to 170k from late 2016 till December of 2018 when it showed up at this dealership.

The car looks and drives really well, their is an accident on the historyhistort.

2012 LS460 AWD with 171k and they are pretty firm at 12,200$ for the car.

This would be my first Lexus, and the reason I have so much pause is that I've only really owned domestic (American) cars in the past. I do like this car, and I feel the car has been cared for. It is a one owner for whatever that is worth.

Should I pass ? Is it a fair deal? In Chicago if that matters.

DedBirdDog

MMR on that car, adjust for mileage and region with a value-neutral CR is $7,700. Expected retail is $12,450. The mileage deduction is $9,560. Honestly, even with a perfect history, I wouldn't want to be more than $10.5k in that car at best. Buying a high mileage car is actually a smart strategy if you want to save some money as mileage is the biggest value killer in these things. And high miles don't necessarily mean a car is worn out, not by a long stretch. You just want to make sure you get into it right.

MagicP

cool how can I get an MMR printed out. I goolged it and couldn't figure out how to get a legit MMR print out since I'm not a dealer myself.

mckellyb

Honestly, at 171K miles, it's going to need a transmission in the next 40K-50K miles. I've never heard of an automagic lasting longer than 221K, and that was, very remarkably, a GM TH200 in an '84 Buick LeSabre two-door. The transmission guy who did the rebuild said it was like a cigarette which had all the ash intact from when it was first lit. The slightest anything would cause it to fall apart. I know that car's history too, and it amazes me that much more.

sha4000

iTrader: (1)

I don't agree with your statement. My 98 is sitting with 240k on the clock and when I do drive it the shifts are still pretty smooth. There are countless examples of LS models with over 250k still on the original tranny.

DedBirdDog

My 2007 Camry XLE has 231k on the clock and I've driven that car hard. I did a flush (yeah...I know) at 160k and other than a single shift flare when it's below freezing outside (and that's been there since 140k miles) that transmission operates flawlessly.

DedBirdDog

This is the maroon one at Pugi of Chicagoland right? It's for sale on OVE (a listing you can't see) for $12,500 OBO. MMR is showing in OVE on that car at $9,800 adjusted for miles and region. I'm not exactly sure what I checked in my earlier post. Expected retail is $14,100. Sorry about the mixup. The mileage deduction was the same though. Weird.

At any rate, I'm sticking with my numbers above. You might kick it out to $11k but I wouldn't go a dime more.

UZ214

DedBirdDog

MMR is Manheim Market Report. It is an average of dealer-only auction prices for specific vehicles based on mileage, region, condition, and color in the US and Canada. OVE is Online Vehicle Exchange. It is a dealer-only sales portal...kinda like cargurus for dealers. Unless you have a dealer's license (or know someone who does) none of this is accessible to the general public.

MagicP

The Red 2012 sold... for more then the 12,200 that they countered me at.

So sorta back to square one , what do you guys think of this one?
https://www.cargurus.com/Cars/invent...ting=225440644

better price to mileage although it is 2 years older. are there much differences between this one and the red one?

DedBirdDog

MMR on that one is $10,150 Assuming the car checks out with the major service issues addressed, I'd want to be no higher than $11,500.
That car is also offered on OVE.

More power to whoever bought the red car That car had a very uncertain service history and high miles. They paid too much. They're not the first to do that and won't be the last.

If you haven't yet signed up for free Lexus Drivers account to check cars out, you really need to It's really an invaluable tool.
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MagicP

I didn't get a chance to plead my case on the red LS
These dealers don't seem to be willing to budge much if any at all. The guy with the black one I listed wouldn't even consider dropping a dime from that internet price. How do I get these dealers to be more reasonable?
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DedBirdDog

You find a different car and a different dealer. Expand your search radius. These aren't rare cars in crazy demand. If a dealer is blowing you off like that when you are making a reasonable offer, I wouldn't want to do business with them anyway. Yes, it's very frustrating to deal with, especially when you've got the car fever. Patience and due diligence is the key here. You'll end up with a better car at a better price.

You could also ask the cat at Drive Motors why they have the car listed on OVE for $12,400 or make offer. They've had it 74 days and you're willing to give him $11,500. That's VERY reasonable given the MMR. Have you checked the history of that car?

mmalik

Well, honestly, price seems fair to me as long as the vehicle condition is good. I would rather be making sure that the car is in good condition. I've bought quiet a few high mileages cars and all of mine lasted over 250K. However, whenever I buy a used car - regardless of the vehicle history I do the following:

1. Inspection from a reputable dealer and get a detailed report of the inspection from the dealer (in case anything that needs fixing).
2. Change all the fluids & check belts (even if the seller says they did an oil change a week ago. I'll rather be safe than sorry)
3. Change the Wiper blades & Battery.(again regardless of the history - unless they put the new battery & wipers in front of me)
4. Alignment & Balancing
5. Tires (if needed)

Once all this is done, then i do my regular maintenance from my Indy going forward. I normally put about 40K (I don't drive for work) miles per year on my primary vehicle and never had any issue with this setup. Also my vehicle stays idle quiet often for extended period of time (averaging 6 - 8 hours at least once a month).

PS- I was once able to get 255k miles out of a Cadillac North Star engine (it was my 2005 Cadillac STS4 V8) and even after that, I gave up and donated the car. The car was still running strong with no issues.