I have my mind set (basically very close to pulling the trigger) on one with a clean carfax and a healthy Lexus service history (every 5k service done on time or before it was due, even the 60k one, car is currently at 62k). You think this is pretty much enough proof that the car is in great shape? Someone told me a story on here about their step-daughter who ran into everything, but never had any sort of accidents show up on carfax.

 

Carfax (and Autocheck, you should actually run both because they have both have access to some different databases) is only half of the story.

Yes it is absolutely possible that a car can have a so called "clean 1 owner carfax" with no accidents, and be a complete pile of garbage. CF and Autocheck can only report so much as gets *reported to them*, and there's plenty of ways to get things done without anything being reported. The number one way I have found to determine a car's overall condition is simply to check for paintwork on whatever I buy. There's a few ways to do this, but if you don't want to deal with that then your options are to have someone qualified check out the vehicle for you, or to buy it from a Lexus dealer since it is much less likely they would stock anything that would mar the reputation of the dealership (though this is not a guarantee, and especially in the Northeast you have to be careful with what shows up at franchise dealers).

Paintwork in itself is not an indicator of severe damage, or any damage at all to a vehicle. However, if you couple any paintwork you find with other tell-tale signs of a poorly cared for or accident vehicle, you have a much better overall picture of the car than a simple piece of documentation. Our car for example has spotless Carfax AND Autocheck histories, but due to a hasty inspection when I first looked it over, I missed paintwork on the rear quarter. It was such a fantastic paint job that it got by my simple "finger swipe" test (feeling the edges of every single door, hood and fender checking for ANY paint roughness that is not absolutely smooth to the touch). So whatever happened to it was likely (hopefully) not major, but pissed me off a little nonetheless. The car's meticulous service history, completed timing service and nearly new tires, and the fact it was entirely local go along way to make up for that though. With these high end cars you really have to keep an eye out for anything suspicious because it can be EXTREMELY expensive if not damn near impossible to put right issues resulting from a collision, or worse, improper collision repair AFTER the fact. The bottom line is, my rule is NO CARS with paintwork, period. By finding a car that is virgin and paintwork free, you automatically eliminate 80 percent of the mysteries of the car's past. You are left with the less likely possibilities of flood damage etc., and then you can move on to a proper mechanical assessment with service records and the like.

Another scary thing about Carfax and Autocheck is that they aren't magical instant services. It takes time, sometimes weeks for new data to be added to the report. My brother once purchased a Volvo S40 that had a perfect Carfax and a month later when he had to leave the country and wanted to sell it, he found out that just before he purchased it, the dealer had bought the car at an auction with a "frame" disclosure and it had been involved in a frame altering accident. They bought it and flipped it fast so it wouldn't be caught by a less savvy consumer.

Carfax should always be part of your "digital toolbelt" because you need to know whether there are any brands on the title, and as much ownership history as you can get... but the way Carfax is marketed is such as to lead people to believe that its the end all be all when looking at a car, and that is FAR from the truth.

Get someone experienced to help you look any potential car not coming from a Lexus dealer over thoroughly, but on the same token don't discount a car simply because it shows a higher than average number of owners or other minor detail. Carfax and Autocheck have a habit of picking up dealer turnovers occasionally as ownership history and its wrong (you'll know because it may say a particular owner had the car for 5, 10, 20 days).

 

Avoid cars from the Northeast if at all possible. Go to the midwest or the south if you have to fan out from your current location, but avoid anything from the NE. They are driven hard and put up wet, and dealers up there as a result have more tolerance for things dealers in other parts of the country wouldn't even touch.

 

Thanks for that very thorough writeup playdrv4me! Really do appreciate it man! I am definitely going to run my hand through the paint, probably take it to a body shop to have it inspected for potential frame damage.

I should probably add that the car I'm looking for is being sold by the dealer as a cpo which is why I haven't stressed too much over potential damage. However, like you said you can never be too safe (I uncovered a bunch cpo cars with past damage by using car fax and Lexus service records). Judging from the closeup pics I got from the dealer, paint looks to be superb with a shiny consistent finish. Other than a small ding in the front pass door (guy said it will be fixed) and rock chips in the front bumper it definitely looked great. Interior was very clean as well, no stains or tears in the leather.

Oh and btw I finalized my deal for selling my 328i. Guy said the car was immaculate and bought it for my asking price of 22k!!
Basically at this point the 430 has to happen as I no longer will have a car. Next thurs can't come soon enough

 

No problem and congrats on the 328i sale!

 

I would love to buy from the southern states. However time does not really permit me to. That and I would need to have my parents come so they can give their final approval. Next time (in like 10 yrs probably) when I'm searching for a car I will definitely go down south just to pick it up.

I do realize the rust potential nothern cars have. I had the salesman take pics of the bottom edge of each door (common starting point for body rust). They were clean as can be, no issues there. I also requested an undercarriage shot, but didn't get one (I'm probably asking too much at that point lol).

 

I wouldn't be too worried about cars from your neck of the woods to be honest (though you are doing a great job keeping an eye out for rust, which would be my only concern there). It really is cars specifically in that small Northeastern sub-sect of New Jersey, New York, Connecticut, Mass. and sometimes Rhode Island that I try to avoid if at all possible. Maine and Vermont for example, wouldn't bug me much.

 

What are your feelings about Indiana? Dealer got some good reviews and the salesguy is really cool and makes great effort to meet my picky demands

 

As long as you look it over good for the things you already know to look for, I have no problem with a car from there, especially one from a Lexus dealer. Other than the states I mentioned, the only other geographic region that makes ME wary is South Florida. That place for many reasons is like the NY/NJ of the South and as such, the same caution has to be exercised as with the northeast stuff.

 

Yeah I stayed away from all those 3rd party groups, especially those that advertised a warranty that sounded too good to be true. I have never had a bad experience with buying from a dealer so I don't see a need to look elsewhere. I must thank you again for pulling up that dirt cheap black 430 I posted a few days ago. I was pretty seriously considering it. I thought it might be one of those crazy deals ppl always talk about on here. I'm basically foregoing any ridiculous deals at this point and just playing it safe with a dealer car. Thanks again for your wealth of knowledge and experience playdrv!

 

My experience is that if you ask the right questions the Lexus dealer will tell you exactly what they know about the car and what they had top do to make it CPO - in fact its usually in the service record. Make them have the body shop inspect and ask for a brief written evaluation from the body shop on paint and frame.

In terms of condition you are almost always gonna have some paint chips especially up front. LS paint just seems soft and front end just seems to catch rocks - I bought mine with 14k miles and it have several front end paint chips.

I suggest you insist that the dealer (make it a condition of sale) have the car waxed and detailed before delivery and that you expect to inspect the car for defects (inside and out) and insist that they have it inside and under lights so you can perform the careful inspection before taking delivery. Lexus Woodfield did that for me when I picked my LS up - no questions asked. If your dealer balks at that request - I suggest you walk away and see if they come back to you.

Years ago I almost bought a one year old 99 Jeep Grand Cherokee - I had agreed to the deal and sales price but refused to sign contract and take delivery before the dealer washed and waxed the car and brought it inside for delivery inspection. Guess what? the car had 10-12 small dings on it spread over top surfaces, particularly in roof area - the dings were very small and were invisible when the car had dust and was a little dirty - but they stood out when the car had been washed and waxed. If I had taken delivery, I would have been screwed. The dealer of course acted like they did not know the car had minor hail damage,. I tore up my check and walked.

 

I'll bet they wished they could tape that check back together.

SMART MOVE!

 

Yeah definitely a smart move there Jabber. I will definitely have them do that. I am already making a list of things that must me done before we sign anything and wash/detail is at the top of it.

 

No more love for my thread, no one has posted anything for a few days

Anyways, for those who have helped me so much, I just ran an autocheck and it came out clean. I am a bit appalled at how little I get for my $44 unlimited report (I'm down to just 3 cars, 1 is the one in IN I keep posting about, 1 is priced too high at 28.5k, other is an alternate without warranty), but it's still dirt cheap considering the cost of a car.

At this point, everything looks good on paper. I have looked at car fax and autocheck (no accident, lemon, buyback report) and have checked the Lexus service site (all maint done at 5k intervals). I have received additional photos which look great, with the exception of bumper rock chips (it's a used car, so w/e), small ding on the front passenger door (only visible in 1 pic), and the left side of the bumper doesn't line up as perfectly with the fender as the right one (again, not noticeable at a distance, but definitely see it in photos). I plan on going to IN for a look at this point. If the ding and the slight bumper alignment issue can be fixed (and a verification from a body shop that car has not been crashed), then I will most likely pull the trigger. Thoughts?

 

I've honestly lost track of which cars you are looking at LOL. But the silver one at Lexus of Merrillville had a couple of small things that you want to examine if you go see it in person. The straight on front end photo seems to show a slight difference in the hood to fender gaps from the driver to the passenger side. Its not a big issue, but there really shouldn't be a difference in those gaps on these cars. Also, from some of the rear angles, the trunk looks to be slightly off color from the right rear quarter. This indicates to me that A. something has been repainted or repaired on the front and back of that car, or B. as per usual, silver is the most difficult color to view at a distance without spotting SOME color difference regardless of brand.

So when you go look at it pay particular attention to those areas, if that's still at the top of your list.