IS - 3rd Gen (2014-present) Discussion about the 2014+ model IS models

Sudden total brake failure

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Old Jun 15, 2021 | 05:11 AM
  #16  
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Originally Posted by intruder
...It was leaking from the tip of the bleeder valve. The dealership claims they have never seen anything like it ever. They’re sending it to Lexus for diagnosis...
So if it was coming out of the bleeder valve tip, then either the valve wasn't tight or somehow the valve itself failed.
The bleeder is just a hollow screw, capped at the bottom, with a tiny hole in the side near the bottom, and then a large hole at the top (the hole the fluid would have been coming out from).
If the issue was the caliper where the bleeder screws in, then it should have been leaking from day one.




Did the vehicle have any brake work or a brake fluid flush prior to the incident occurring?
It seems really odd that it would randomly start leaking on it's own.
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Old Jun 15, 2021 | 07:03 AM
  #17  
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Possibly used harsh chemicals to clean up the brake fluid, or the brake fluid did the damage it is very hard on paint.
Originally Posted by intruder
Just got the car back. Looks like there is some paint, wheel and tire damage. I tried all kinds of chemicals that I have to wash it off. Nothing is working.
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Old Jun 15, 2021 | 08:18 AM
  #18  
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Originally Posted by LeX2K
Possibly used harsh chemicals to clean up the brake fluid, or the brake fluid did the damage it is very hard on paint.
​​​​​​

It's damage from the brake fluid. I used wheel cleaners and iron x, but nothing happened.

Last edited by intruder; Jun 15, 2021 at 08:29 AM.
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Old Jun 15, 2021 | 08:22 AM
  #19  
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Originally Posted by Sasnuke
So if it was coming out of the bleeder valve tip, then either the valve wasn't tight or somehow the valve itself failed.
The bleeder is just a hollow screw, capped at the bottom, with a tiny hole in the side near the bottom, and then a large hole at the top (the hole the fluid would have been coming out from).
If the issue was the caliper where the bleeder screws in, then it should have been leaking from day one.




Did the vehicle have any brake work or a brake fluid flush prior to the incident occurring?
It seems really odd that it would randomly start leaking on it's own.

The dealership noted that the valve itself failed. Thats how its written up on the service record. I did see it up on the lift and the valve was tight enough.

I had the brake bleed done about 5000 miles ago. Had a complete brake inspection, front rotors machined, rear rotors and brake pads replaced about 1000 miles ago.
​​​​​​​

Last edited by intruder; Jun 15, 2021 at 08:28 AM.
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Old Jun 15, 2021 | 09:06 AM
  #20  
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Originally Posted by intruder
I had the brake bleed done about 5000 miles ago. Had a complete brake inspection, front rotors machined, rear rotors and brake pads replaced about 1000 miles ago.
Based on this comment I have my own suspicions as to what really happened.
However there is no way to prove anything really at this point.

The good news is that no one was hurt, which is ultimately the most important thing.

Personally I'd be in conversation with the dealer in regards to them footing the bill to repair the rim, paint, and tire damage from the brake fluid leak.
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Old Jun 15, 2021 | 09:55 AM
  #21  
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Wait who did the bleed? That could be it right there. Hopefully the dealer..

if the part failure is toyota or the dealer/svc center to blame, someone owes you a paint job and wheel refinish. the brake fluid will cook/toast your wheels and paint. it's done.

so whoever is to blame has to pony up. don't let them stop at refilling your brakes and swapping out a new bleeder.

if it was you who did the bleed and installed an aftermarket brake bleeder or didn't tighten it, it may be a problem (need more details as you aren't clear as to who did what work, when, with what parts etc.)

seems not touching the bleeder may have prevented this. someone went in there and touched something. question is how/what/why
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Old Jun 15, 2021 | 10:18 AM
  #22  
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Originally Posted by E46CT
Wait who did the bleed? That could be it right there. Hopefully the dealer..

if the part failure is toyota or the dealer/svc center to blame, someone owes you a paint job and wheel refinish. the brake fluid will cook/toast your wheels and paint. it's done.

so whoever is to blame has to pony up. don't let them stop at refilling your brakes and swapping out a new bleeder.

if it was you who did the bleed and installed an aftermarket brake bleeder or didn't tighten it, it may be a problem (need more details as you aren't clear as to who did what work, when, with what parts etc.)

seems not touching the bleeder may have prevented this. someone went in there and touched something. question is how/what/why

The dealer did all the brake work. Its the same dealership that fixed it yesterday as well. I am actually exploring options and evaluating if I need to speak with a lawyer as this could have been a lot worse had we been in a crash.
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Old Jun 15, 2021 | 10:20 AM
  #23  
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Originally Posted by Sasnuke
Based on this comment I have my own suspicions as to what really happened.
However there is no way to prove anything really at this point.

The good news is that no one was hurt, which is ultimately the most important thing.

Personally I'd be in conversation with the dealer in regards to them footing the bill to repair the rim, paint, and tire damage from the brake fluid leak.
What's your opinion on speaking with a lawyer about this? This could have been a lot worse and I don't think just fixing the damage would suffice. My wife is actually scared to use the car now.
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Old Jun 15, 2021 | 10:31 AM
  #24  
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Originally Posted by intruder
What's your opinion on speaking with a lawyer about this? This could have been a lot worse and I don't think just fixing the damage would suffice. My wife is actually scared to use the car now.
My general thought on bringing lawyers in is that the only one that really wins is the lawyers.

As the vehicle has already been repaired, the opportunity for a second opinion/inspection on the failure cause has passed...so really what could you prove.
I had asked the questions earlier about any brake work being done recently as this was the most reasonable explanation as to why the bleeder was leaking...and based on your answer brake work was recently done, so now we put two and two together.
Based on the work done the balance of probabilities is that the bleeder leak was caused by the work done at the dealer by the tech...I hate to say it, but it's the most logical explanation.

I would speak with the Service Manager first to see where they stand on restoring the vehicle back to a pre-incident condition.
Failing that I would speak with Lexus Corporate...and finally if that goes nowhere, then bring in the lawyers, as all other reasonable avenues to resolve it has been exhausted...which a judge would be interested in.

As you start on this journey to restore the vehicle, get as much as possible in writing, or record as much as possible in audio files so you have a record and timeline of events.
Don't trust that the dealer will do the right thing right off the hop.
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Old Jun 15, 2021 | 10:43 AM
  #25  
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Originally Posted by Sasnuke
My general thought on bringing lawyers in is that the only one that really wins is the lawyers.

As the vehicle has already been repaired, the opportunity for a second opinion/inspection on the failure cause has passed...so really what could you prove.
I had asked the questions earlier about any brake work being done recently as this was the most reasonable explanation as to why the bleeder was leaking...and based on your answer brake work was recently done, so now we put two and two together.
Based on the work done the balance of probabilities is that the bleeder leak was caused by the work done at the dealer by the tech...I hate to say it, but it's the most logical explanation.

I would speak with the Service Manager first to see where they stand on restoring the vehicle back to a pre-incident condition.
Failing that I would speak with Lexus Corporate...and finally if that goes nowhere, then bring in the lawyers, as all other reasonable avenues to resolve it has been exhausted...which a judge would be interested in.

As you start on this journey to restore the vehicle, get as much as possible in writing, or record as much as possible in audio files so you have a record and timeline of events.
Don't trust that the dealer will do the right thing right off the hop.
^^^^ Agreed on Lexus corporate and documenting everything.
Email them the whole thing (email is an excellent timestamped record of communication) and you should get some results based on my experience with them.
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Old Jun 15, 2021 | 03:09 PM
  #26  
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Personally, I still thing there is something wrong with the brake system especially, the caliber, pistons, hoses, connectors ..
The bleeder valve is very simple unit (screw with hole). Even if the mechanic who work on the brake prior didn't screw it back correctly, it would NOT fail like that within seconds. You would not notice the problem with the brake the moment you drove off from the brake service or within that 5K miles unless you don't pay much attention to how the car perform.
My odd and old habit before drive the car is step really hard on the brake when moving the gear out from PARK. This is my way of checking if the brake is work or not before the car is moving.
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Old Jun 15, 2021 | 04:02 PM
  #27  
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Google "brake failure after bleed brakes." Seems like a common issue unfortunately. I would never bleed the brakes unless I absolutely had to but what do I know. I'm just cheap.
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Old Jun 15, 2021 | 04:17 PM
  #28  
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Originally Posted by MatrixPC
Personally, I still thing there is something wrong with the brake system especially, the caliber, pistons, hoses, connectors ..
The bleeder valve is very simple unit (screw with hole). Even if the mechanic who work on the brake prior didn't screw it back correctly, it would NOT fail like that within seconds. You would not notice the problem with the brake the moment you drove off from the brake service or within that 5K miles unless you don't pay much attention to how the car perform.
My odd and old habit before drive the car is step really hard on the brake when moving the gear out from PARK. This is my way of checking if the brake is work or not before the car is moving.
The bleeder is a simple unit...once you tighten it properly. If the caliper and/or bleeder had signs of corrosion, the bleeder could appear tight when it really isn't.

Originally Posted by macmaster
Google "brake failure after bleed brakes." Seems like a common issue unfortunately. I would never bleed the brakes unless I absolutely had to but what do I know. I'm just cheap.
Nothing wrong with doing a brake fluid flush...doing it properly, like literally anything else, is the key...especially considering it's the brakes.
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Old Jun 15, 2021 | 04:38 PM
  #29  
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Originally Posted by intruder
What's your opinion on speaking with a lawyer about this? This could have been a lot worse and I don't think just fixing the damage would suffice. My wife is actually scared to use the car now.
going to chime in here if no one minds…

Years ago, I had a MAJOR dealer foul up. Short version: had my car inspected(annual by law in PA). Left for vacation 2 days later. While driving my left front wheel FELL OFF. Literally. At 70 MPH on the highway, with my wife and 2 young kids in the car. Got the car stopped, no one injured. Rotors ground to dust as well as the bumper/fender/etc.

Insurance determined the lugs were overtightened and the bolts sheered. Inspections sticker confirmed the wheel that came off, was the same wheel the dealer pulled during inspection.

Dealer paid all the repair costs—at a different dealer I should mention. I talked to my insurance company and they agreed, the dealer was at fault.

BUT—no one was injured so other than repairs, there was nothing they could do to go after the dealership. My adjuster even said, “if anyone was hurt, this is an entirely different case/scenario.”

This was not a Lexus car/dealership but I think you’re in a similar situation. It sounds like they messed something up. But no one was hurt.

I would definitely pursue them fixing the paint/wheels, however.
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Old Jun 15, 2021 | 06:14 PM
  #30  
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Originally Posted by bgross88
going to chime in here if no one minds…

Years ago, I had a MAJOR dealer foul up. Short version: had my car inspected(annual by law in PA). Left for vacation 2 days later. While driving my left front wheel FELL OFF. Literally. At 70 MPH on the highway, with my wife and 2 young kids in the car. Got the car stopped, no one injured. Rotors ground to dust as well as the bumper/fender/etc.

Insurance determined the lugs were overtightened and the bolts sheered. Inspections sticker confirmed the wheel that came off, was the same wheel the dealer pulled during inspection.

Dealer paid all the repair costs—at a different dealer I should mention. I talked to my insurance company and they agreed, the dealer was at fault.

BUT—no one was injured so other than repairs, there was nothing they could do to go after the dealership. My adjuster even said, “if anyone was hurt, this is an entirely different case/scenario.”

This was not a Lexus car/dealership but I think you’re in a similar situation. It sounds like they messed something up. But no one was hurt.

I would definitely pursue them fixing the paint/wheels, however.
Oh my!!!! Thank goodness no one was hurt. I don't go to car dealerships unless it's under warranty. I prefer a local independent shop that I know does quality work.
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