I was reading an ES window sticker. It says in plain English that Enform includes "dynamic" services like "dynamic navigation" and "dynamic voice recognition" that expire after 3-10 years of ownership and then require renewal by a paid subscription. My immediate reaction is the same as my reaction to Tesla or BMW subscription features: "Go to hell." I will not pay for these features and then pay for them again and again.

Therefore my question* is simply this: When you no longer have "dynamic voice recognition" or "dynamic navigation," do you still have any voice recognition or any Enform navigation at all?

*(Do not answer me that "factory navigation sucks anyway, use Apple CarPlay." I'm asking specifically whether these basic features of the Enform built-in services the original owner pays for will continue to work. Thanks to anyone who can offer enlightenment on that question.)

 

It is my understanding with the Nav that it will continue working as is, but you won’t receive any further downloaded dynamic updates. I suspect the same would be true of the voice recognition. A member named mcomer (a knowledgeable sales rep in Illinois) has provided some details on this. If you search you will find some existing threads that dig into this question, such as this one: https://www.clublexus.com/forums/es-...r-version.html

 

Not exactly "as is" - the temporary [dynamic] map update data disappears when the service expiration date is passed so you'll revert back to using the map/navigation dataset that was in permanent storage when the car was purchased (assuming no other permanent update after purchase). From the Navigation and Multimedia System Owner's Manual on page 112 of the 2019 ES 350 version:

 

Thanks very much, both of you. I did search the forum for this before posting — I've always felt it's disrespectful not to do so — but I didn't find it, so I doubly appreciate your guidance.

Sounds like Lexus is trying to straddle a middle ground between turning these features into an ongoing profit center like their competitors, and not quite sinking all the way into the naked piracy of Tesla.

My old car used DVD-based navigation and Sirius Nav Traffic. The latter cut off quickly if you didn't pay the fee (I didn't), but the former simply became outdated over time unless you paid the maker $100-$200 for a new DVD. The advantage of this setup was that you could simply wait it out a few years and update your 6-year-old maps to 2-year-old maps for $60, which usually works just fiine. I'd definltely miss that.

 

Lexus Canada does not offer the Dynamic Navigation and voice recognition (Even though you still pay for Enform), but the factory Navi still works as indented by design.

 

Thank you for that correction. I also understood from mcomer's post that you can purchase an update just like we did in previous generations. Some of us that like using the vehicle's nav would update it once every two or three years but generally not spend the money every year when the new nav data was released. So if we let the dynamic nav expire at the three year mark, we could purchase the latest version of the full nav data. We just have to balance how often we use it against the costs of periodic data updates versus the dynamic updates.

Obviously, you cannot buy "voice" updates separate from the dynamic system so I don't know what happens to that data. If they follow suit with the Nav, I suppose it disappears if the subscription isn't renewed. Probably a carrot to get you to renew. Can anyone clarify?

 

That's pretty much correct. For future reference, some references where more specific details on the cost, time periods, and data updated with the permanent update.

From the Lexus FAQ How much does a navigation update cost and where can I purchase one?

From the Lexus Drivers web page PRICING AFTER INTRODUCTORY TRIAL PERIOD, the [permanent] dynamic navigation data update is $169 (before dealer installation cost) and adds an additional 2 years for dynamic navigation data updating.

From the Lexus FAQ web page When is my Dynamic Voice Recognition active in my Lexus?

Quote:

Dynamic Voice Recognition works whenever your vehicle has cellular coverage and you maintain an active Enform services trial or subscription.

So, for Dynamic Voice Recognition to continue working you just need to keep at least one of the Lexus Enform services (i.e., Safety Connect, Service Connect, Destination Assist, Remote, and Dynamic Navigation) active. I believe Safety and Service Connect bundle is complementary and active for 10 years for all the current generation ES model years (or at least it is for my 2019 ES) so Dynamic Voice Recognition should continue to operate without additional cost for quite a few years regardless of the status of the Dynamic Navigation subscription.

While the Dynamic Voice Recognition operation details are pretty sparse, I believe Dynamic Voice Recognition related data are distinctly separate from the Dynamic Navigation temporary map update data and associated rules. Per the embedded video in the Lexus FAQ web page What is Dynamic Voice Recognition?, all the data for the dynamic part of the operation resides in cloud databases. In the absence of anything to the contrary, I'd speculate whatever dynamic data that does get downloaded from the cloud for use by this part of the system it is deleted once the "in flight" dynamic voice command process chain has passed the point where the data will (or can) never be needed for the continuation of the execution of the "in flight" command chain. For example, if you've used Dynamic Voice Recognition to obtain a list of nearby restaurants, once you've selected an item from the list, passed that item on to the dynamic navigation system, and proceeded far enough along the navigation part of the voice command chain where you can't "Go Back" to the dynamic voice obtained restaurant list then the restaurant list unused portion of the dataset will be discarded from the car's onboard temporary memory.

 

Stupid question for my smart colleagues here: What IS "dynamic voice recognition," and how does it differ from voice recognition that isn't "dynamic"?

 

I was about to asknthe same question. Is this the same voice rec i.e. Text contact1 etc? "Get directions to ..."?

 

In post #7 of this thread, grp52 posted a link to the explanation of what dynamic voice recognition is.

Here is the link.
https://lexus2.custhelp.com/app/answ...9492/related/1

 

Thanks, grp52 and lesz. So if I understand this correctly, without the "dynamic" part, voice recognition 1) can't learn over time, and 2) is more limited and stilted in the commands it recognizes?

 

grp52 and all - the trial period of Safety Connect depends on the model year. Your 2019 and also the 2018's
were the sweet spot of the program with 120 months (10 years!) complimentary. This includes the Telematic
connection for Emergencies and Roadside Assistance as well as the Remote Start from the key fob. The RS
App from your phone and the Directory Assistance were comp for 12 months and are $80/year (or $8/month)
each after that.
2020 and 2021 model Lexi now have everything, Safety Connect, fob and phone RS, Live operator Destination
Assist, Dynamic Nav and voice all comp for 36 months (3 years) after that all are available by subscription.

Lexwannabe and all - Think of how Siri and other voice assistance work, your device does not actually do much
voice recognition on its own. Try using Siri when you are out of cell tower range...nothing. The Dynamic Voice
addressed in this thread is your car relying on an cloud server to vastly expand the command understanding,
Many of the observations that our phones "are so much better than the OEM automobile systems" are because of
the interactive voice recognition connection.

 

Ah ha - this explains why many have said their fob remote start continues to function even after they cancel the subscription.

 

Thanks for adding to our knowledge, mcomer.