Lexus LS650 Prototype Set for Essen Motor Show
11-28-12, 12:21 PM
#152
It will definitely be one of my top 3 choices 
It will be a very tough choice, Euros are more elegant, but Lexus is cheaper to own overall.
But I won't believe this will go into production until I see it, I am not holding my breath. It took them 5 years just to decide to produce the LFA.
Or they might sell it in the rest of the world, but not in the U.S.
It will be a very tough choice, Euros are more elegant, but Lexus is cheaper to own overall.
But I won't believe this will go into production until I see it, I am not holding my breath. It took them 5 years just to decide to produce the LFA.
Or they might sell it in the rest of the world, but not in the U.S.
Last edited by BNR34; 11-28-12 at 12:32 PM.
11-28-12, 01:21 PM
#154
Lexus Champion
BNR- Maybe you should read through the thread before making argumentative comments. The TMG performance brand is expected to be decided on by the end of this year. That was linked to previously.
This car is already one of the CONCEPTS showing their capability (The rally Yaris another, along with their GT-86). The 9000rpm wasn't a typo, it was what was from the TMG workshop, why would they make a typo on an engine spec?
But they didn't need 9000rpm to make 641hp. If the original engine can make 415+hp @6000rpm imagine what it could do with 3000 more revs to play with. That's an extra 210hp if you do the math of power per 1000rpm. That'd equal about 625hp. Then with a little engine work and some engine management software coupled with a freer exhaust you can see where 641hp @9000rpm is definitely reasonable. But I figure instead of going that route it seems they turbocharged the engine, and kept it close to where the original specification in the IS-F is to maintain the life of it. It is still a LEXUS!
This car is already one of the CONCEPTS showing their capability (The rally Yaris another, along with their GT-86). The 9000rpm wasn't a typo, it was what was from the TMG workshop, why would they make a typo on an engine spec?
But they didn't need 9000rpm to make 641hp. If the original engine can make 415+hp @6000rpm imagine what it could do with 3000 more revs to play with. That's an extra 210hp if you do the math of power per 1000rpm. That'd equal about 625hp. Then with a little engine work and some engine management software coupled with a freer exhaust you can see where 641hp @9000rpm is definitely reasonable. But I figure instead of going that route it seems they turbocharged the engine, and kept it close to where the original specification in the IS-F is to maintain the life of it. It is still a LEXUS!
11-28-12, 01:26 PM
#155
Time will tell. Don't believe everything you read, especially on the internet
Last edited by BNR34; 11-28-12 at 01:35 PM.
11-28-12, 05:25 PM
#156
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BNR- Maybe you should read through the thread before making argumentative comments. The TMG performance brand is expected to be decided on by the end of this year. That was linked to previously.
This car is already one of the CONCEPTS showing their capability (The rally Yaris another, along with their GT-86). The 9000rpm wasn't a typo, it was what was from the TMG workshop, why would they make a typo on an engine spec?
But they didn't need 9000rpm to make 641hp. If the original engine can make 415+hp @6000rpm imagine what it could do with 3000 more revs to play with. That's an extra 210hp if you do the math of power per 1000rpm. That'd equal about 625hp. Then with a little engine work and some engine management software coupled with a freer exhaust you can see where 641hp @9000rpm is definitely reasonable. But I figure instead of going that route it seems they turbocharged the engine, and kept it close to where the original specification in the IS-F is to maintain the life of it. It is still a LEXUS!
This car is already one of the CONCEPTS showing their capability (The rally Yaris another, along with their GT-86). The 9000rpm wasn't a typo, it was what was from the TMG workshop, why would they make a typo on an engine spec?
But they didn't need 9000rpm to make 641hp. If the original engine can make 415+hp @6000rpm imagine what it could do with 3000 more revs to play with. That's an extra 210hp if you do the math of power per 1000rpm. That'd equal about 625hp. Then with a little engine work and some engine management software coupled with a freer exhaust you can see where 641hp @9000rpm is definitely reasonable. But I figure instead of going that route it seems they turbocharged the engine, and kept it close to where the original specification in the IS-F is to maintain the life of it. It is still a LEXUS!
Even if the 9,000rpm was not a typo it had to be simply a meaninglessly high rev limiter as the power after 6,500rpm would be all downhill.
Last edited by ydooby; 11-28-12 at 05:30 PM.
11-28-12, 05:53 PM
#157
Lexus Champion
It is speculation and if the above is true, it is not even decided yet. The whole project and idea can be scrap at anytime. Even both TMG and TMC don't know what will happan. Did you read that as the TMG TS650 will be in the dealer's show room by the end of this year?
Maybe you should read my post before making argumentative comments, did I say it was a typo?
Maybe you should read my post before making argumentative comments, did I say it was a typo?
Sorry but you missed the most important spec in the spy pic that gives away that what we have today is exactly the same turbocharged motor that was spied a year ago--710Nm (524 lb-ft) of torque, which is simply impossible with a 5.0L NA motor, high revving or not.
Even if the 9,000rpm was not a typo it had to be simply a meaninglessly high rev limiter as the power after 6,500rpm would be all downhill.
Even if the 9,000rpm was not a typo it had to be simply a meaninglessly high rev limiter as the power after 6,500rpm would be all downhill.
11-28-12, 06:12 PM
#158
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That's your speculation, I never said the engine wasn't turbocharged before. It is possible to have a high revving turbocharged engine you know. That would account for the torque output. No one knows for certain what the specific details are. I don't claim to know, so don't act like I'm preaching it as gospel guys.
In any case I'm just pointing out what you said about this motor having "3000 more revs to play with" is unlikely. The power tops out at a reasonable 6,500rpm and the 9,000rpm figure was either a typo or from a high rev limiter just for the purpose of testing.
Last edited by ydooby; 11-28-12 at 06:17 PM.
11-29-12, 01:03 AM
#159
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Bnr how can you start a thread about a m7 that aint coming then talk about this car the way you are?
I would think as enthusiasts we all should grin and be happy with such a crazy concept instead of nitpicking things and trying to Downplay it. There sure as hell aint no other Asian luxury brand making concepts like this.
I remember when the pics leaked and when Toyota\Lexus told us TAKE THEM DOWN. Most here are not aware that did happen. We thought it was gonna just be some toy never seen again yet now here it is for the world to see.
Hopefully TMG makes one to sell or becomes more involved to influence future cars.
Glass half full.
I would think as enthusiasts we all should grin and be happy with such a crazy concept instead of nitpicking things and trying to Downplay it. There sure as hell aint no other Asian luxury brand making concepts like this.
I remember when the pics leaked and when Toyota\Lexus told us TAKE THEM DOWN. Most here are not aware that did happen. We thought it was gonna just be some toy never seen again yet now here it is for the world to see.
Hopefully TMG makes one to sell or becomes more involved to influence future cars.
Glass half full.
11-29-12, 02:38 AM
#160
Lexus Champion
Sure it's possible to have a high-revving turbocharged engine, but that requires fundamental changes to the engine block, which I don't think is what TMG is doing here (the displacement in the spy pic being identical to the that of the IS-F indicates no fundamental changes),
In any case I'm just pointing out what you said about this motor having "3000 more revs to play with" is unlikely. The power tops out at a reasonable 6,500rpm and the 9,000rpm figure was either a typo or from a high rev limiter just for the purpose of testing.
In any case I'm just pointing out what you said about this motor having "3000 more revs to play with" is unlikely. The power tops out at a reasonable 6,500rpm and the 9,000rpm figure was either a typo or from a high rev limiter just for the purpose of testing.
The original IS-F engine redlines at 6800rpm, now this same engine in the TS-650 redlines at 7450rpm. A while back an interview was conducted and asked about the revs of the IS-F V8 in comparison to the M3. I remember the man saying they could have went the same route (above 8000rpm) but cut it back for longevity of the engine. I have no confirmation, but I believe TMG may have reworked the engine for this car. We'll just have to see.
11-29-12, 09:55 AM
#161
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ok folks, time to stop the personal comments and just lighten up.
as enthusiasts we can all agree that it would be great if lexus come out with an amg-type of high end vehicle. when and exactly what that will be remains to be seen.
opinions, speculation and rumor sharing is fine, just don't attack others for doing same.
as enthusiasts we can all agree that it would be great if lexus come out with an amg-type of high end vehicle. when and exactly what that will be remains to be seen.
opinions, speculation and rumor sharing is fine, just don't attack others for doing same.
11-29-12, 08:58 PM
#164
Pole Position
Performance looks great
Aesthetically? Uhhh, no
Way too much going on, and that exhaust....too much
Maybe in black it will hide some of the gawdiness, but I don't even think black can save that garish body.
That's called "trying too hard". Less is more.
But build it anyway, because they can get the looks right on the next gen.
Aesthetically? Uhhh, no
Way too much going on, and that exhaust....too much
Maybe in black it will hide some of the gawdiness, but I don't even think black can save that garish body.
That's called "trying too hard". Less is more.
But build it anyway, because they can get the looks right on the next gen.
11-30-12, 04:05 AM
#165
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I said imagine what it could do with 3000 more revs to play with. I didn't say it had that redline now
The original IS-F engine redlines at 6800rpm, now this same engine in the TS-650 redlines at 7450rpm. A while back an interview was conducted and asked about the revs of the IS-F V8 in comparison to the M3. I remember the man saying they could have went the same route (above 8000rpm) but cut it back for longevity of the engine. I have no confirmation, but I believe TMG may have reworked the engine for this car. We'll just have to see.
The original IS-F engine redlines at 6800rpm, now this same engine in the TS-650 redlines at 7450rpm. A while back an interview was conducted and asked about the revs of the IS-F V8 in comparison to the M3. I remember the man saying they could have went the same route (above 8000rpm) but cut it back for longevity of the engine. I have no confirmation, but I believe TMG may have reworked the engine for this car. We'll just have to see.
I believe now that the power plant may be 2UR-FSE but i will have proper images tomorrow to verify
TMG official figure is Max. Power 478kW (650PS) / 6,500rpm