I remember just a few years ago when Honda was the car company that everyone loved. Even if you didn't own one or want one, you still admired that they build great cars, great engines, and really seemed to have their game together. Honda was fun, fresh, and entertaining but still reliable and built like a swiss watch.

Over the last several months though, I cannot help but wonder if Honda has lost their way.

Turning the clock back, the fifth and sixth generation Accords were some of the best looking and performing cars in their segment. IMO, still to this day the sixth generation Accord is the best looking car they ever built. It was ranked above the redesigned Camry and Altima at one point...quite a feat. Then came the first bad omen...the 2003 redesign. A car that was so ugly that even many of the Honda faithful had to admit to it's level of monstrosity. Let's not also forget the failed Accord hybrid with a 15hp boost over the V6, and marginal (if any) improvement in gas mileage. It was universally hailed as the ugliest midsizer despite typically Honda driving dynamics. Now the 7th generation looks great, and IMO, is one of two great products in Honda's stable.

The Civic, once the small car icon has lost sales, prestige, driver appeal and really itself. It reigned as the fun to drive, compact FWD car that everyone could afford. Now the car easily prices into the low $20,000 mark with average options, has lost the driver connection it once offered, and has again been beaten with the Honda ugly stick.

The Fit arrived on scene a few months ago to fill the void left by the Civic when it alienated it's traditional buyers. Like recent Honda products, the Fit is unnecessarily expensive in comparison to it's competition but not a bad product all around.

The CRV is one that I guess I have to eat my words on. I find it to be horrendously ugly (especially from the front end) but also impeccably built and they certainly sell plenty of them. I am left to wonder though- Honda will sell their V6 to Saturn for use in their CRV competitor, but refuse to drop a 6cylinder in their own offering? The CRV, while sold mainly as a 4 cylinder, is one of the last cute utes to lack this option. All in all a successful product, but it just lacks that Honda sparkle they had not that long ago.

The Odyssey is the other great Honda product...one that I find flawless in almost every regard. The S2000 also was an icon in it's day but was discontinued and doesn't seem to have any plans for replacement. Watching the success of the Highlander and others, Honda introduced the Pilot which has so far, been a competent and well heeled crossover. The 2009...is a different story.

The 2009 Pilot is the car that really made me want to start this thread. Yeah they have made a few mistakes but so does everyone. This Pilot though...is one tick too many on the black board. Simply put, the interior looks to be the cheapest, ugliest, blandest interior that I have seen in recent years in ANY new car. Old GM has built finer interiors than this. The exterior looks like a refreshed 1997 Isuzu Trooper and is about as wrong as you could possibly ever be, Not to mention that it bears no styling cues in line with any other Honda. Honestly...What were they thinking?

The Ridgeline. Oh, the Ridgeline. I'll just drop it right there.



What is most telling though, is Acura. This brand has sat on the bench and watched Lexus gobble up market share every single year and every single product release, for the last twenty years. Now for the last five years, fellow underdog Infiniti has gladly chased Acura almost out of town and snapped up the second place Japanese luxury sector. Between Lexus "luxury" and Infiniti "sporty"...what is left for Acura? They don't have the technology or resources to out-Lexus Lexus, and with FWD platforms and 6 cylinder engines, they can never really run with Infiniti. If Audi has done it, Acura could have. If Infiniti has done it, Acura could have. If Jaguar is in the process of doing it, Acura could be too. There are just no excuses here.

The 2004 TL, 2002 TSX, and 2001 MDX seemed to signal that Acura was getting their game together. Sharper designs, nicer interiors, and solid powertains showed that this company had done their homework, sharpend up the edges (literally), and was offering its first really good product since the Legend. Then came the 2005 RL...a car that looked decidedly lower rent and lower class than even the TSX, and ended up failing miserably in the marketplace. Since then we have gotten the RDX, a cute ute with a turbo 4cylinder that drinks gas like a V8 and barely performs like a V6. The new TSX has shown it's face, and not many are pleased. Worse yet is the refreshed 2009 RL which also bears (unfortunately) the new face of Acura. A face that could be taken for a Mazda, Saturn, or Honda by any unassuming eye. And while watching their own dismal sales numbers and the booming success of it's competitors, Acura has refused to offer RWD or anything larger than 6 cylinders. The MDX is the best thing they have going right now, and yet it still cannot come close to the segment leaders in terms of sales.



This is not what I would have expected from the Honda of the 1990s













Looking at their recent track record, what has happened to Honda? What happened to the slick looking cars with top notch quality and a flair of driver appeal? Why is Acura being left with second rate products in a top notch market?


...Has Honda lost their way?

 

Ever since the NSX was dropped I stopped paying attention to Honda. I still like the mighty-mite S2K, but it is not the same kind of car, it is literally a motorcyle with 4 wheels.

 

Every car makers have a target audience. For the market that they are in, i think they are doing ok. Honda has always been about technology and being conservative as well as affordability. There isnt much wrong with their new releases, just depends on the buyers.

 

http://automobiles.honda.com/s2000/s2000-cr.aspx

 

Very interesting points, MPLexus301.

Just to mention however, Acura is still #2 in sales among Japanese luxury brands, it still outsells Infiniti by a healthy margin...this past month's results an anomaly or trend, we'll see.

I might also separate what is happening with Honda with what is happening to Acura. That said, Mr. Colliver who is a VP at Honda and Acura (shares titles). There is perhaps more conflation of what happens at Acura and Honda than say Lexus and Toyota.

I do agree that the styling of Hondas has been a bit weird lately, the last Accord IMO was too weird and the current one is better in some ways but not all. I am so far not sold on the new Acura look, the old TSX looked better.

Furthermore, as others on this board attest, the RL is a very worthy vehicle in a number of aspects. But it just doesn't stand out enough. I think some cannibalization from the TL is a factor. The MMC made things worse.

In the end I am not sure about Honda, maybe they are fine with where they are, what with the downturn and all. With Acura, I see some untapped potential...

Perhaps they should go back to the tagline, "Precision-crafted performance." Take the Acura calipers and polish them up, somehow.

 

You missed one HUGE detail in your post... the engines. Honda was always know for their engines. They never made eight cylinder engines, but their four and six cylinder engines were always the most efficient, the most powerful (hp/l), the most high revving, the most reliable and the most technologically advanced.

Look at their engines now... They are already far behind their Japanese and German competitors, and GM seems to be passing them as well. Honda's engines are now on Fords level, which is pretty pathetic.

 

I guess I could sum up my post like this.

If you asked me in 1998 where I thought Honda would be in 2008, I would tell you something like them making precise, cutting edge, good looking, quality cars. They aren't.

I also feel that as the time ticks for the Acura brand, it becomes clearer and clearer that nobody knows what to do with this company or even has a game plan for it.



Honda has become weird, Acura is a disappointment, and the blows seem to keep coming.

 

I blame sheep and resting on laurels. Honda has gotten to a point where people buy it irregardless of how good or how BAD it is and its getting worse and worse and people gobble gobble gobble. To their credit, they built their brand on quirkiness, fun, fuel economy and bland but looks that were not offensive. Today, they seem like a mini-Toyota, SUV this and that and quite frankly and possibly the ugliest vehicles around.

I don't know if Honda refuses to let Acura go or Acura executives don't have a clue but its ridiculous to think the USDM Accord is LARGER than the top of the line Acura, looks better possibly and offers pretty much 90% of what it offers for 50% of the price. That is just a bad omen for the entire brand.

Its funny for my complete 180 on Honda/Acura. Who on this forum DIDN'T want a Honda or Acura in the 1990s? I know as a teen, the Legend/NSX/Intergra appealed to me tons. I loved the first and 2nd gen Civic coupes. The Accord (before it got a V-6, not sure when gen) was one of the best cars EVER built.

Then like Toyota, they slowly ditched small fun cars for SUVs. The design studio is run by crackheads.


This is NOT the Honda/Acura I knew in the 1990s. I don't know what it is but I don't like it sans the S2000 and TL.

 

Around the time of Mr. Honda's death, Honda had departed away from their philosophy. He's probably rolling around in his grave right now.

Here is an idea: Let Honda of Japan design the vehicles. Honda of America should just focus on marketing or something. I like Honda/Acura, but not as much as I use to.

 

lol... i wouldnt be able to tell a 5/6/7th gen accord... they all look the same to me... vanilla... didnt realize ppl felt this way about a company that makes fwd cars...

 

I guess in some ways I feel like Toyota has managed to out-Honda Honda. I thought that Honda always held a slight edge with driving dynamics and engine technology but Toyota is getting back into building fun cars to drive (Camry SE and others) and quite frankly, the GR family has owned the J engines across the board.

Toyota is now getting back to building high quality mainstream cars...another area where Honda has slipped marginally. Anyone sat inside the new Highlander? Holy cow...it's flawless. The Camry and Tundra have been setbacks but I really do think that the quality and attention to detail is returning to Toyota, and that Honda's edge is gone.

 

Hmmm, Honda still has the S2000, Toyota has the FJ Cruiser Honda does have Civic Si's currently and Integra Type Rs as recently as last year overseas.

I would say I liked Honda more than Toyota growing up b/c I could see myself in a Civic or Integra. The Supra was clearly our my range, MR2 was on the way out and a 2 seater. I've seen both just turn into Japanese Fords.

On the block the 1GS and Legend were THE sedans to have.

What really separates it for me is Lexus vs Acura. Acura came out first and today is just an after thought on the luxury map, basically for Honda owners to move up to. Lexus is a global brand that has dominated the American market.

I know Honda will never go back to being that small quirky company. Profits tell it not too as do growing sales.

What puzzles me is why do they have to make them so just, ugly.

 

honda is doing good... enough said... their targeted audience likes their cars and it works...

 

They need more RWD cars.

 

Basically I agree with SICK, although the Acura RL, to some extent, makes up for being smaller-than-full-size with superb materials, assembly quality, solidness, and SH-AWD sophistication.

Though there are some small signs of cost-cutting in the plastics Honda uses in their new interiors, for the most part, their products are STILL built like Swiss Watches...I would still rate them the #1 auto company today in the level of overall quality offered for the money (in other words, how much you pay for it), though Subaru, Hyundai, and some (not all) Toyota models come close. Subaru, however, is rapidly starting to cheapen their new bodies and interiors.

My chief complaint with Acura is that they have almost totally given up warm, inviting interors with wood paneling and soft-touch surfaces for the cold, metallic, high-tech look, especially on the MDX, RDX, and the new TSX. The RL still has a superb interior....but I'm afraid to see what the next one wsill look like.