Still Bullish on Hybrids, Will Toyota Leapfrog EV Tech with Solid State?
we've heard "wait until toyota stuns the world and takes over the ev industry with solid state batteries" for many years now. so far, nada. even your thread title suggests toyota can possibly 'leapfrog ev tech with solid state'. 
just like "wait for the onslaught of amazing toyota hydrogen vehicles". still waiting.
just like "wait for the onslaught of amazing toyota hydrogen vehicles". still waiting.
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one battery electric car can make 90 Toyota hydrogen cars. Very smart use of resources
Last edited by Toys4RJill; Mar 31, 2023 at 11:30 AM.
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The only omission I'm seeing is about solid state batteries going into production anytime soon in the OP article, being the clickbait misinformation that it is. Hyping up something that doesn't exist doesn't earn brownie points.
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The article says two key things. One, Toyota is building a factory that will not produce solid state batteries. Two, Toyota showed a concept SSB car that had nothing under the hood. READ the article.
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I have no bad feelings toward Toyota. But if we are being honest here, Toyota has nothing to offer the world today that's even remotely exciting or compelling. If people want to prop Toyota up for things they talk about but never do or are 10 years away, more power to those people. Saying they are going to SSB is only an excuse to buy time, because they are so far behind. God, they are even behind Hyundai/Kia. I used to strongly believe in SSB's until I came to the very realization that it's a pipedream at this point. Maybe in 10 years it will benefit smartphones, but it sure ain't going into BEV's or PHEV's anytime soon. If I'm wrong, I'll be the first one to admit it and apologize
Anyway, that's all I gotta say on this subject
Anyway, that's all I gotta say on this subject
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. I used to strongly believe in SSB's until I came to the very realization that it's a pipedream at this point. Mt
Toyota was reportedly planning to reveal working solid-state prototypes at the 2020 Tokyo Olympics, until the sporting event was interrupted by the COVID-19 pandemic.
“It’s something that we continue to invest in significantly for our future, and we think it will be the key to unlocking more range from a battery,” said Jack Hollis, executive vice president of Toyota Motor North America and president of Toyota Motor Sales. Toyota is investing a lot of money into the technology, he said
Hmmm,,,,,,,
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This is the only mention of 2025 in the article
Meanwhile, Toyota is building a $5.6 billion battery factory for hybrids and for EVs in North Carolina, scheduled to begin production in 2025—focusing on lithium-ion rather than solid-state batteries.
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I thought members on here were claiming Toyota was like Theranos and lying about SSBs coming in 2025. They are coming in the hybrids. Just like the engineer from Toyota said (on the record)
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What hybrid? What vehicle? What plant? The article itself literally says that Toyota is building a factory to focus on lithium ion batteries, not SSB's.
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Solid state batteries need far more rare metals
By that time conventional batteries are going to be so cheap I doubt anyone will need SSBs except for specialized applications.
Although the internal constituents of batteries vary based on construction, lithium is a key factor in most. Globally, lithium prices have tripled in the past year alone, and that's despite global lithium production tripling in just the past five years. There is, quite simply, a global shortage of the stuff.
The problem is that solid-state batteries could actually use even more lithium than today's lithium-ion packs. Remember those higher-density anodes mentioned above? They'll likely be made of pure lithium metal. "Now, lithium metal can increase the specific energy of your battery by up to three times but it comes as pure lithium, which means the lithium intensity is also increased," McNulty said, noting this will exacerbate the lithium shortage.
"It's going to be between five and 10 times the amount of lithium for the same battery," said Dr. Jordan Lindsay, research and innovation manager at Minviro, a U.K. consulting firm that quantifies the environmental impacts of raw material production.
"So if we're talking about mass production, I would say 2030 is an optimistic suggestion for when the first solid-state batteries will begin to be purchasable on scale by consumers," McNulty said. "And those first vehicles really will be testbed systems that will be really expensive. They'll be high-performance, but I think the idea of those vehicles would be to get used to the technology, and I don't think there'll be wanting to build significant quantities of those until they're sort of mastered what the technology is like in the natural EV application."
McNulty says 2032 to 2035 is a more realistic estimate for when we might see solid-state-battery EVs in mass production.
source
The problem is that solid-state batteries could actually use even more lithium than today's lithium-ion packs. Remember those higher-density anodes mentioned above? They'll likely be made of pure lithium metal. "Now, lithium metal can increase the specific energy of your battery by up to three times but it comes as pure lithium, which means the lithium intensity is also increased," McNulty said, noting this will exacerbate the lithium shortage.
"It's going to be between five and 10 times the amount of lithium for the same battery," said Dr. Jordan Lindsay, research and innovation manager at Minviro, a U.K. consulting firm that quantifies the environmental impacts of raw material production.
"So if we're talking about mass production, I would say 2030 is an optimistic suggestion for when the first solid-state batteries will begin to be purchasable on scale by consumers," McNulty said. "And those first vehicles really will be testbed systems that will be really expensive. They'll be high-performance, but I think the idea of those vehicles would be to get used to the technology, and I don't think there'll be wanting to build significant quantities of those until they're sort of mastered what the technology is like in the natural EV application."
McNulty says 2032 to 2035 is a more realistic estimate for when we might see solid-state-battery EVs in mass production.
source
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