ISF Track build
Last edited by ljdsong; Mar 3, 2021 at 10:46 PM.
There are lots of places in the Bay Area for suspension tuning and testing who could easily check your spring rates to ensure you have what you think you have. Here are two the Porsche guys seem to like:
www.customalignment.com
2599 Wyandotte St, Unit A
Mountain View, CA 94043
(650) 961-5311
http://www.tcdesignfab.com/
885 S McGlincy Ln
Campbell, CA 95008
(408) 377-7707
Might be a hike if you're in the East Bay though.
www.customalignment.com
2599 Wyandotte St, Unit A
Mountain View, CA 94043
(650) 961-5311
http://www.tcdesignfab.com/
885 S McGlincy Ln
Campbell, CA 95008
(408) 377-7707
Might be a hike if you're in the East Bay though.
Moderator
Joined: Apr 2017
Posts: 3,069
Likes: 978
From: Indiana
Have you considered stepping up to the Penskes or Ohlins TTX? You really have a race car build with street car coilovers. Your moving a lot of weight at pretty high speeds with your power levels.
It’s not necessary, but your suspension is holding you back if you have the RR Road and track single adjustment setup.
It’s not necessary, but your suspension is holding you back if you have the RR Road and track single adjustment setup.
Have you considered stepping up to the Penskes or Ohlins TTX? You really have a race car build with street car coilovers. Your moving a lot of weight at pretty high speeds with your power levels.
It’s not necessary, but your suspension is holding you back if you have the RR Road and track single adjustment setup.
It’s not necessary, but your suspension is holding you back if you have the RR Road and track single adjustment setup.
I'm not sure if I saw but why are you running two different rotors, via the Girodiscs and the Figs? Wouldn't you be better off running the same brand for both front and rear?
Another question is out of the two which do you like/prefer and why? Any cons to one brand over the other?
Thanks,
-Nigel
Another question is out of the two which do you like/prefer and why? Any cons to one brand over the other?
Thanks,
-Nigel
I'm not sure if I saw but why are you running two different rotors, via the Girodiscs and the Figs? Wouldn't you be better off running the same brand for both front and rear?
Another question is out of the two which do you like/prefer and why? Any cons to one brand over the other?
Thanks,
-Nigel
Another question is out of the two which do you like/prefer and why? Any cons to one brand over the other?
Thanks,
-Nigel
I consider that upgrade, i talk to rafi about penske if there is a SIGNIFICANT advantage over the R/T , and he said not much. I have a discount for that ohlins ttx but there is no support to tune the system on there end, and i dont know anybody here in my area who is professionally capable to do it. If this R/T give in thats the time i will upgrage to penske coz some components can be use in there system.
To be fair, I'm planning on Ohlins TTX, but I know there is only one "right" solution, and that can be solved by either the AFCO or the Ohlins/Penske. I prefer to have the ability to fine tune and that's what I get with Penske/Ohlins.
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Moderator
Joined: Apr 2017
Posts: 3,069
Likes: 978
From: Indiana
The painful truth is, if your shocks and your springs are properly matched, the only difference is service life. An AFCO shock with the appropriate damping for the springs you are running will work just as well as the crazy adjustable shock (Penske or Ohlins) for a certain period of time. You have to decide if the service life of an AFCO matches your needs vs. the adjustability of a Penske or Ohlins solution.
To be fair, I'm planning on Ohlins TTX, but I know there is only one "right" solution, and that can be solved by either the AFCO or the Ohlins/Penske. I prefer to have the ability to fine tune and that's what I get with Penske/Ohlins.
To be fair, I'm planning on Ohlins TTX, but I know there is only one "right" solution, and that can be solved by either the AFCO or the Ohlins/Penske. I prefer to have the ability to fine tune and that's what I get with Penske/Ohlins.
If there were only minor differences, then the 5k cost increase wouldn’t be well founded. I am not experienced here, but my research indicates there is much more than a minor difference between a low and high grade shock. Feel free to educate me, because I’m open to learning and myself have changed my mind multiple times on suspension.
We simply don’t see 1500 dollar coilovers in serious racing. I keep coming back to that. If they were just as good, we wouldn’t have 6500 coilover sets.
I’ve jumped down the research rabbit hole on this. It seems like there would be more to it. Are AFCOs used in sanctioned racing? A shocks ability to change flow, separate slow and fast functions, etc., come in the design and quality of materials from what I understand. You can tune a cheap shock and spring setup for a platform, but they still can’t function as well as a tuned higher end setup, correct?
If there were only minor differences, then the 5k cost increase wouldn’t be well founded. I am not experienced here, but my research indicates there is much more than a minor difference between a low and high grade shock. Feel free to educate me, because I’m open to learning and myself have changed my mind multiple times on suspension.
We simply don’t see 1500 dollar coilovers in serious racing. I keep coming back to that. If they were just as good, we wouldn’t have 6500 coilover sets.
If there were only minor differences, then the 5k cost increase wouldn’t be well founded. I am not experienced here, but my research indicates there is much more than a minor difference between a low and high grade shock. Feel free to educate me, because I’m open to learning and myself have changed my mind multiple times on suspension.
We simply don’t see 1500 dollar coilovers in serious racing. I keep coming back to that. If they were just as good, we wouldn’t have 6500 coilover sets.
The biggest thing you get with the more exotic units is adjustability, serviceability, and reliability. So pick your poison. The mini-sprint team I worked with had 40 shocks in the trailer. Grab the one you need, install it (pretty easy on a mini-sprint) and go racing. They weren't exotic at all, but they did the job just fine.
Perfect example right here: https://pitstopusa.com/b-4602-132916...in-shocks.html
Last edited by lobuxracer; Mar 11, 2021 at 03:39 PM.
Moderator
Joined: Apr 2017
Posts: 3,069
Likes: 978
From: Indiana
A significant part of the cost is adjustability. This is a convenience. There are alternatives - buy a multitude of fixed rate dampers with quality internals to cover the range of adjustment you expect, and buy springs to match those dampers so you can install them as units and go racing. NASCAR runs pretty pedestrian looking Bilstein shocks. They have them built/rebuilt routinely, and they work just fine. They don't have remote reservoirs, they don't have adjustable spring perches, they have zero external damping adjustments. They work just fine.
The biggest thing you get with the more exotic units is adjustability, serviceability, and reliability. So pick your poison. The mini-sprint team I worked with had 40 shocks in the trailer. Grab the one you need, install it (pretty easy on a mini-sprint) and go racing. They weren't exotic at all, but they did the job just fine.
Perfect example right here: https://pitstopusa.com/b-4602-132916...in-shocks.html
The biggest thing you get with the more exotic units is adjustability, serviceability, and reliability. So pick your poison. The mini-sprint team I worked with had 40 shocks in the trailer. Grab the one you need, install it (pretty easy on a mini-sprint) and go racing. They weren't exotic at all, but they did the job just fine.
Perfect example right here: https://pitstopusa.com/b-4602-132916...in-shocks.html
Driver
Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 165
Likes: 23
From: IN
A significant part of the cost is adjustability. This is a convenience. There are alternatives - buy a multitude of fixed rate dampers with quality internals to cover the range of adjustment you expect, and buy springs to match those dampers so you can install them as units and go racing. NASCAR runs pretty pedestrian looking Bilstein shocks. They have them built/rebuilt routinely, and they work just fine. They don't have remote reservoirs, they don't have adjustable spring perches, they have zero external damping adjustments. They work just fine.
The biggest thing you get with the more exotic units is adjustability, serviceability, and reliability. So pick your poison. The mini-sprint team I worked with had 40 shocks in the trailer. Grab the one you need, install it (pretty easy on a mini-sprint) and go racing. They weren't exotic at all, but they did the job just fine.
Perfect example right here: https://pitstopusa.com/b-4602-132916...in-shocks.html
The biggest thing you get with the more exotic units is adjustability, serviceability, and reliability. So pick your poison. The mini-sprint team I worked with had 40 shocks in the trailer. Grab the one you need, install it (pretty easy on a mini-sprint) and go racing. They weren't exotic at all, but they did the job just fine.
Perfect example right here: https://pitstopusa.com/b-4602-132916...in-shocks.html
There’s also cost in the quality of materials used to increase longevity (cheap coil overs use crap coatings and materials that wear and the shock performance drops off).
But you’re also paying for valves that are more capable. I will agree it’s a case of diminishing returns for the cost.
I’ve run fantastic shocks and been thoroughly impressed. I’ve also had my butt handed to me by someone driving the daylights out of a car on burned out Gabriel’s.
This brings to mind a conversation with a very good friend of mine - here I was at the Modesto dirt track, on a bike I had spent untold hours preparing that was running away from all my friends, and this annoying kid passed me on his Yamaha crap bike and won the race. Of course, you shouldn't be pissed off when Kenny Roberts beats you, but that was my last day of seriously competing in motorcycle racing. This is why you can see what I say in my signature...
Pit Crew
Joined: Apr 2019
Posts: 230
Likes: 456
From: ca
I notice that you got the FST with the integrated fuel pressure regulator, If I remember correctly this system is only supposed to be used with a 'deadhead' return-less system as there are only 3 ports. ISF's are set up as return type from both the engines Direct & Port injection. How were you planning to plumb this in? The only way I see this working would be less than ideal, but suppose you can cap one of the 3 ports on the surge tank and have the OEM fuel rail return line going back to the OEM fuel tank like normal. Then one of the remaining ports would be going out to the rails and the other would be getting fed from the OEM fuel pump. Like I was saying though, this wouldn't be ideal from a couple reasons.
1. your going to create high a pressure situation inside the sump canister becasue there will be no relief path for the fuel to travel out of the sump tank other than to the rails (which will only works when the car is running and under load) You can quickly kill the pump or have a line/gasket failure. (yikes)
2. you wont have the benefit of refilling the sump tank with fuel return as it will be going directly back into the OEM tank instead.
Am i missing something here? Did you install it yet?