Stock breaks vs Stock breaks with ss lines etc, vs 4 piston aftermarket brakes
03-27-05, 11:00 PM
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Stock breaks vs Stock breaks with ss lines etc, vs 4 piston aftermarket brakes
Does anyone know or can approximate the breaking distances between these 3? Does OEM brakes with upgraded brembo drilled and slotted rotors with SS lines a significant difference in break feel then just OEM? Someone let me know I dont't race but I want to be able to stop if I am not paying attention and then need to stop real fast.
03-28-05, 12:39 AM
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well as of this friday ill be going with brembo rotors, axis pads and SS lines at all four corners and i'm sure i'll feel at least a firmness in the pedal and maybe a lil tighter response. Ill let you know what happens! 
03-28-05, 01:32 AM
#3
i can tell you:
- the ss lines help to firm up the braking feel. it doesn't really help much in the braking distance
- the rotors, it's mostly more durable against fading
the main thing that helps the real baking is the pads. on my ap racing, i initially had the racing pads. i can tell you that it's very touchy, i brake slightly and the car will literally choked and stopped. very hard to control, you need to re-learn braking. now i have the ebc green stuff, a lot milder and braking is definitely reduced in power, but i have much less dust
in terms of braking distance, to be honest i dont' think you should wish for too much. first of all the gs is already very good in braking distance to begin with (117ft 60-0?). and aftermarket brakes usually don't really reduce that in big margin. with more pistons, bigger rotors, and aggressive pads, maybe that will give you another foot or so advantage, but that's about it. i don't think it will bring you to 110ft. their major gains (imho) of course are look and the brake fading if you drive long distance.
so if you want the best braking power, on top of getting aftermarket brakes, get good pads. prepare to have tons of dust, and eat your rotors like crazy. but they stop better. otherwise, the ss lines firm up and give you better feel, but that's it. bbk they look good and of course has their values too
- the ss lines help to firm up the braking feel. it doesn't really help much in the braking distance
- the rotors, it's mostly more durable against fading
the main thing that helps the real baking is the pads. on my ap racing, i initially had the racing pads. i can tell you that it's very touchy, i brake slightly and the car will literally choked and stopped. very hard to control, you need to re-learn braking. now i have the ebc green stuff, a lot milder and braking is definitely reduced in power, but i have much less dust
in terms of braking distance, to be honest i dont' think you should wish for too much. first of all the gs is already very good in braking distance to begin with (117ft 60-0?). and aftermarket brakes usually don't really reduce that in big margin. with more pistons, bigger rotors, and aggressive pads, maybe that will give you another foot or so advantage, but that's about it. i don't think it will bring you to 110ft. their major gains (imho) of course are look and the brake fading if you drive long distance.
so if you want the best braking power, on top of getting aftermarket brakes, get good pads. prepare to have tons of dust, and eat your rotors like crazy. but they stop better. otherwise, the ss lines firm up and give you better feel, but that's it. bbk they look good and of course has their values too
03-28-05, 05:49 AM
#4
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Originally Posted by Cannonbear
well as of this friday ill be going with brembo rotors, axis pads and SS lines at all four corners and i'm sure i'll feel at least a firmness in the pedal and maybe a lil tighter response. Ill let you know what happens!
The ATE is hard to find, but in addition to being good fluid comes in two colors (blue and yellowish) so you can tell when you bleed brakes when you've got the fresh fluid pumping through.
Dsmart,
The only test I've ever seen like that was sponsored by a Stoptech vendor so that makes it a bit suspect. It's good reading regardless, but they did not test the 'upgraded stock components' like Cannonbear is planning, nor did they even it out by using the same tire in all their tests which definitely invalidates the results of the 355mm and 4 wheel upgrades compared to the others.
http://www.zeckhausen.com/testing_brakes.htm
03-28-05, 06:13 AM
#5
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Of course it's nice to have Brembos. I agree that they are some of the best brakes available...but tires actually play a more important role than brakes in stopping. All that brakes can do.....even the best ones like Brembos.....is either lock up the wheels or keep them rolling just short of lockup, depending on whether you have ABS or not and whether the ABS is working properly. It is the tires that actually contact the road surface and stop the car. The best tires in this regard on a dry surface are generally wide, low-profile, high-performance tires with a soft tread compound for maximum road grip and friction. In rear-engine and mid-engine cars that have most of the weight in the back, under hard braking the forward weight transfer equilizes the center of gravity in the middle of the car and all four wheels brake equally. That is why Porsches typically have such good stopping distances. Front-engine cars tend to shift more weight onto the front wheels during hard braking and therefore the rear brakes and tires don't do their share of the load.
Now...on a wet or icy surface, it's another story. The LAST thing you want on a road like that is low, wide, high-performance summer tires....they will hydroplane and spin you right into a ditch...or worse. For slippery roads or wet surfaces you need a tire and a tread compound that is designed for that. All-season tires make it relatively simple by giving OK performance year-around, but are a compromise if you want the maximum in either dry or wet-performance.
Now...on a wet or icy surface, it's another story. The LAST thing you want on a road like that is low, wide, high-performance summer tires....they will hydroplane and spin you right into a ditch...or worse. For slippery roads or wet surfaces you need a tire and a tread compound that is designed for that. All-season tires make it relatively simple by giving OK performance year-around, but are a compromise if you want the maximum in either dry or wet-performance.
03-28-05, 11:18 AM
#7
Originally Posted by mmarshall
Of course it's nice to have Brembos. I agree that they are some of the best brakes available...but tires actually play a more important role than brakes in stopping. All that brakes can do.....even the best ones like Brembos.....is either lock up the wheels or keep them rolling just short of lockup, depending on whether you have ABS or not and whether the ABS is working properly. It is the tires that actually contact the road surface and stop the car. The best tires in this regard on a dry surface are generally wide, low-profile, high-performance tires with a soft tread compound for maximum road grip and friction. In rear-engine and mid-engine cars that have most of the weight in the back, under hard braking the forward weight transfer equilizes the center of gravity in the middle of the car and all four wheels brake equally. That is why Porsches typically have such good stopping distances. Front-engine cars tend to shift more weight onto the front wheels during hard braking and therefore the rear brakes and tires don't do their share of the load.
Now...on a wet or icy surface, it's another story. The LAST thing you want on a road like that is low, wide, high-performance summer tires....they will hydroplane and spin you right into a ditch...or worse. For slippery roads or wet surfaces you need a tire and a tread compound that is designed for that. All-season tires make it relatively simple by giving OK performance year-around, but are a compromise if you want the maximum in either dry or wet-performance.
Now...on a wet or icy surface, it's another story. The LAST thing you want on a road like that is low, wide, high-performance summer tires....they will hydroplane and spin you right into a ditch...or worse. For slippery roads or wet surfaces you need a tire and a tread compound that is designed for that. All-season tires make it relatively simple by giving OK performance year-around, but are a compromise if you want the maximum in either dry or wet-performance.
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03-28-05, 04:49 PM
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Originally Posted by DaveGS4
Cannonbear, I may have mentioned this in another post too, but I'd recommend you also get upgraded brake fluid as well. I like ATE Superblue, but other good stuff is Motul 600 and even Valvoline I think has some decent synthetic.
The ATE is hard to find, but in addition to being good fluid comes in two colors (blue and yellowish) so you can tell when you bleed brakes when you've got the fresh fluid pumping through.
Dsmart,
The only test I've ever seen like that was sponsored by a Stoptech vendor so that makes it a bit suspect. It's good reading regardless, but they did not test the 'upgraded stock components' like Cannonbear is planning, nor did they even it out by using the same tire in all their tests which definitely invalidates the results of the 355mm and 4 wheel upgrades compared to the others.
http://www.zeckhausen.com/testing_brakes.htm
The ATE is hard to find, but in addition to being good fluid comes in two colors (blue and yellowish) so you can tell when you bleed brakes when you've got the fresh fluid pumping through.
Dsmart,
The only test I've ever seen like that was sponsored by a Stoptech vendor so that makes it a bit suspect. It's good reading regardless, but they did not test the 'upgraded stock components' like Cannonbear is planning, nor did they even it out by using the same tire in all their tests which definitely invalidates the results of the 355mm and 4 wheel upgrades compared to the others.
http://www.zeckhausen.com/testing_brakes.htm
We carry the Ate as well as the Motul RBF 600 fluids.
But to the main point of this post. Our testing is not intended for publishing or marketing material although occasionally it is used. Our intent in testing is to figure out which piston sizes work best for that particular platform whether it be a 350z or an Audi S4. Since our tests were not for marketing purposes, other upgrades were not included.
Amatuer tests are often unreliable due to the amount of variables. Like marshall said, tires make a big difference. If you want to lower stopping distances, stickier tires will benefit you more. Often with big brake kits, aftermarket wheels are required and often with that comes better tires. Also if someone is using a marker to measure stopping distances from, there can be large variances in stopping distances. at 60mph, a car moves at about 88ft/sec. If the driver is off by as little as .1sec, that's 8.8ft variance in the stopping distance. I haven't even mentioned different surfaces, wind conditions, etc.
Last edited by StopTech; 03-28-05 at 05:00 PM.
03-28-05, 06:37 PM
#9
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well i just did an amateur braking test from 0-60 ft. Average stopped in 121ft which i attribute to poor brakes and the amateur part and averaging over 7 runs.
i'll re do the test once i brake in the new setup and see what i come up with.
i'll re do the test once i brake in the new setup and see what i come up with.
03-28-05, 08:57 PM
#12
Originally Posted by Cannonbear
well i just did an amateur braking test from 0-60 ft. Average stopped in 121ft which i attribute to poor brakes and the amateur part and averaging over 7 runs.
i'll re do the test once i brake in the new setup and see what i come up with.
i'll re do the test once i brake in the new setup and see what i come up with.
121 isn't bad already i say for us.. the best i have done so far on stock brakes was 119
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