Almost 2 years... where's the aftermarket.... really? RANT
How do you know these mods are worthless? Have you tested the torsional and longitudinal rigidity of the IS chassis with and without these braces?
I agree that some people may have misconceptions as to what some mods actually do. Many people think BBK's provide shorter braking distances. They usually don't but they do provide other inarguable performance benefits such as heat capacity/resistance to fade. They also add some serious bling to the car. I wouldn't call that 'worthless.'
I agree that some people may have misconceptions as to what some mods actually do. Many people think BBK's provide shorter braking distances. They usually don't but they do provide other inarguable performance benefits such as heat capacity/resistance to fade. They also add some serious bling to the car. I wouldn't call that 'worthless.'
I don't expect to have ANY problem with brake fade, and no BBK can reduce stopping distance UNLESS there is a problem with fade. The braces are a joke because they are bracing things that don't need bracing. We don't have struts, so why have strut tower braces? We have double wishbone suspensions with shocks.
What we really need is caster / camber kits and an adjustable rear sway bar. Why do you think nobody is making these? I think it's because they require R&D, and all these chassis braces DON'T. The brace manufacturers are just stamping out pieces of metal that they know will be purchased whether they are needed or not.
^^ I couldn't agree more.
I'm dead serious about devising a kit for advanced fabricators to install that will allow camber and caster adjustments on the front and camber adjustment in the rear. I NEED it for my car. My outer tread blocks are gone in the front and I still have lots of tread in the center. The rear is OK, but I haven't lowered the car at all and I know there is a lot of negative camber out back (there always is to ensure understeer.) Oh, yeah, I just got a job again, so I might even have some money to fund the project.
I'm dead serious about devising a kit for advanced fabricators to install that will allow camber and caster adjustments on the front and camber adjustment in the rear. I NEED it for my car. My outer tread blocks are gone in the front and I still have lots of tread in the center. The rear is OK, but I haven't lowered the car at all and I know there is a lot of negative camber out back (there always is to ensure understeer.) Oh, yeah, I just got a job again, so I might even have some money to fund the project.
if they do, to tell you the truth. I am pretty sure they will maybe sell 4-5 kits this year. max
Think about it..... we don't even have performance/sport/adjustable shock options other than coilovers, and what about 3 spring manufacturers? That's pretty pathetic, especially considering the biggest gripe of the mags, and in general is suspension/handling related.
Sure tom's has a bunch of braces, and from pictures it looks like maybe control arms? but who has any experience with any of it? What happened to the days of being able to do springs/shocks as a great bang for the buck setup? Now we are stuck with $1000+ coilovers. Or we can get some springs, that don't do anyhting more than drop the car for aesthetics.
Sure tom's has a bunch of braces, and from pictures it looks like maybe control arms? but who has any experience with any of it? What happened to the days of being able to do springs/shocks as a great bang for the buck setup? Now we are stuck with $1000+ coilovers. Or we can get some springs, that don't do anyhting more than drop the car for aesthetics.
don't give into the latest fads because styles change EVERY year and no matter how much money you spend, you will have outdated parts as time goes by. by fads i mean stuff like altezza tail lights, wildly colored bulbs, and chrome pieces that can be put just about anywhere. keep it classy.
thats why we'll buy $600 iphones even thou ppl in japan/korea wont even touch such a LOW TECH fone.hehe come to hawaii, mens clothing styles are, tshirts/surf shorts/slippers
if you dress like mainland aZn's and not a local asian (theres a diff) you will be looked at funny here
err buy the guys that is... girls might look at you different thou
i sure there's no rush since its pretty much the fastest production car in its class (all of its own).
but i definitely cant wait for some serious upgrades since all the current ones are more 4 SHO than GO.
but i definitely cant wait for some serious upgrades since all the current ones are more 4 SHO than GO.
Lobuxracer and Apex84 have hit the nail on the head.
There are a variety of reasons why the 2IS doesn't have a huge aftermarket (yet):
- As mentioned, a lot of companies and tuners don't have the know-how/experience in dealing with such a complex engine like the 2GR-FSE or even 4GR-FSE. As lobux mentioned, they don't understand the engineering that went into the engine. Gasoline direct injection engines are a very new thing for North America. They've been around longer in Japan, and the companies and tuners in Japan understand those engines more. Also complicating the matter is that Toyota's D4-S dual port/direct injection system is unique in the marketplace. The fact that the IS350 has 12 fuel injectors makes for a huge problem for aftermarket makers and tuners, since as of yet no standalone engine management system can effectively run and manage those 12 fuel injectors in stages.
- Also as mentioned, some of you are comparing the HUGE aftermarket of the JZ engine, or the 1IS to this. The 1IS is built on an older platform, and is running a JZ engine which has been around for a LONG time. A lot of problems and limitations of the JZ have been solved, and simply due to the sheer age of the platform that is why there is a ton of stuff available out there for it. Toyota's JZ engine has almost become the small block of Japanese engines; a cheap reliable engine with tons of aftermarket support that can make huge power on a cheap budget.
The 2IS is a new platform compared with the 1IS, and uses a brand new engine design. When the MK4 Supra came out, do you think there was a huge aftermarket right away for it? Or even 2 years later? Of course not. It took a bunch of years for a decent aftermarket to show up for it.
- Due to all the complexity and lack of understanding/experience about the GR engines and 2IS platform, any current or future products will be expensive due to the amount of R & D put into them. And since nobody is racing a 2IS yet as lobux pointed out, companies and tuners really do not have a lot of data (none at all) to work with in regards to the engine and platform. It's true that Team Lexus did build 2 IS350 GT2 cars for American LeMans, and it's also true the modded 2GR engines they had were pushing over 470HP and over 350 lb-ft torque naturally aspirated. But unfortunately Team Lexus never got to race them. There are rumours the IS-F will be raced, but we will see.
Also add to the fact that there aren't that many 2GR-FSE engines out there yet, and that it's not shared across many platforms raises the R & D cost for aftermarket makers.
In Japan, there is a bigger 2IS aftermarket then we have here, but again that is thanks to better experience/understanding of GDI engines over there, and the geographical proximity and insider knowledge that some of the aftermarket makers have of the 2IS platform and engines (for example Tom's having close ties with Toyota).
Some of you no doubt have seen the prototype Blitz F/I kit that pushes the IS350 to over 400HP. There are whispers HKS is developing their own kit as well. There are also a range of Tom's parts for the 2IS in Japan.
With the "F" division from Lexus, and specifically the IS-F enthusiast interest will definitely increase for the 2IS, and for Lexus in general. This will lead to greater demand, and thus more motivation for the 2IS aftermarket to grow. Also, with time and patience, the aftermarket will gradually begin to understand and eventually master the GR engines and the D4-S injection system, which will lead to some wonderful aftermarket parts.
Perhaps even Lexus may offer some official tuner and performance parts for their F cars.
There are a variety of reasons why the 2IS doesn't have a huge aftermarket (yet):
- As mentioned, a lot of companies and tuners don't have the know-how/experience in dealing with such a complex engine like the 2GR-FSE or even 4GR-FSE. As lobux mentioned, they don't understand the engineering that went into the engine. Gasoline direct injection engines are a very new thing for North America. They've been around longer in Japan, and the companies and tuners in Japan understand those engines more. Also complicating the matter is that Toyota's D4-S dual port/direct injection system is unique in the marketplace. The fact that the IS350 has 12 fuel injectors makes for a huge problem for aftermarket makers and tuners, since as of yet no standalone engine management system can effectively run and manage those 12 fuel injectors in stages.
- Also as mentioned, some of you are comparing the HUGE aftermarket of the JZ engine, or the 1IS to this. The 1IS is built on an older platform, and is running a JZ engine which has been around for a LONG time. A lot of problems and limitations of the JZ have been solved, and simply due to the sheer age of the platform that is why there is a ton of stuff available out there for it. Toyota's JZ engine has almost become the small block of Japanese engines; a cheap reliable engine with tons of aftermarket support that can make huge power on a cheap budget.
The 2IS is a new platform compared with the 1IS, and uses a brand new engine design. When the MK4 Supra came out, do you think there was a huge aftermarket right away for it? Or even 2 years later? Of course not. It took a bunch of years for a decent aftermarket to show up for it.
- Due to all the complexity and lack of understanding/experience about the GR engines and 2IS platform, any current or future products will be expensive due to the amount of R & D put into them. And since nobody is racing a 2IS yet as lobux pointed out, companies and tuners really do not have a lot of data (none at all) to work with in regards to the engine and platform. It's true that Team Lexus did build 2 IS350 GT2 cars for American LeMans, and it's also true the modded 2GR engines they had were pushing over 470HP and over 350 lb-ft torque naturally aspirated. But unfortunately Team Lexus never got to race them. There are rumours the IS-F will be raced, but we will see.
Also add to the fact that there aren't that many 2GR-FSE engines out there yet, and that it's not shared across many platforms raises the R & D cost for aftermarket makers.
In Japan, there is a bigger 2IS aftermarket then we have here, but again that is thanks to better experience/understanding of GDI engines over there, and the geographical proximity and insider knowledge that some of the aftermarket makers have of the 2IS platform and engines (for example Tom's having close ties with Toyota).
Some of you no doubt have seen the prototype Blitz F/I kit that pushes the IS350 to over 400HP. There are whispers HKS is developing their own kit as well. There are also a range of Tom's parts for the 2IS in Japan.
With the "F" division from Lexus, and specifically the IS-F enthusiast interest will definitely increase for the 2IS, and for Lexus in general. This will lead to greater demand, and thus more motivation for the 2IS aftermarket to grow. Also, with time and patience, the aftermarket will gradually begin to understand and eventually master the GR engines and the D4-S injection system, which will lead to some wonderful aftermarket parts.
Perhaps even Lexus may offer some official tuner and performance parts for their F cars.
Last edited by TRDFantasy; Jul 20, 2007 at 12:08 PM.
Everyone has made good points and I maybe ignorant in this subject matter. But what about the fact that everyone's 2IS is still under factory warranty, I for one won't even think about putting in a turbo or any heavy modifications until after my warranty runs out...I don't plan on doing anything that will void my warranty. maybe that is just me but I'm sure there are a lot of 2IS owners like myself. Which in turns really goes with supply and demand.








