reducing the weight of our cars
12-05-06, 11:10 AM
#31
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Yeah but the luxury would be lost and you would be driving a shell of a car with noises, rattles, etc...... However, if you able to drop 1000 pounds a bone stock SC4 would fly....That is a tall order to full fill.
The doors and the steel subframe is where the huge weight is....
The doors and the steel subframe is where the huge weight is....
12-05-06, 01:19 PM
#32
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maybe we should also include $/lbs
for example if the new carbon fiber hood is $500 and you only save ~25lbs thats 20 $/lb.
or a Ti exhaust is $1000 and it saves ~20lbs thats 50 $/lb
i think weight saving should dafinatly be rated in effectivness per cost because some of these ideas while not bad, just arent paractical on paper. or like always money is just better spen elsewhere.
for example if the new carbon fiber hood is $500 and you only save ~25lbs thats 20 $/lb.
or a Ti exhaust is $1000 and it saves ~20lbs thats 50 $/lb
i think weight saving should dafinatly be rated in effectivness per cost because some of these ideas while not bad, just arent paractical on paper. or like always money is just better spen elsewhere.
12-05-06, 04:19 PM
#33
Lexus Test Driver
This reminds me of a funny weight reduction writeup-- These guys took a stock SR20 sentra and made it a 13 second car-- Here
I think ideally that an even and cost effective mod vs. weight reduction schedule should be implemented by calculating cost/effectiveness of mod, as well as the effectiveness of weight reduction taking into acct. the "overall effect" on daily driveability, As you know an all aluminum skinned interior with 1 seat and no carpet wouldn't be considered luxury, but compared to a horse and buggy on a dirt road, it's livin it up..
Cost effective weight reduction does not include burning off all the sound deadening material, but chiseling a good bit of it off is certainly doable, --
A fuel cell is also doable-- but careful attention to the fuel level sender should be in order-- Even a 5 gal fuel cell could get you to work and back a few days before a fillup, as well as 120+ miles on a trip-- An 8 gallon cell would get you 200 miles-- and would be a huge weight reduction over stock tank..
Cutting the rear steel panel out would not only help weight, but would allow your subs to be heard in the cab much easier...
Tubular control arms wouldn't be that hard to do with a little sourcing and research skill...... Maybe some trial and error......
I think ideally that an even and cost effective mod vs. weight reduction schedule should be implemented by calculating cost/effectiveness of mod, as well as the effectiveness of weight reduction taking into acct. the "overall effect" on daily driveability, As you know an all aluminum skinned interior with 1 seat and no carpet wouldn't be considered luxury, but compared to a horse and buggy on a dirt road, it's livin it up..
Cost effective weight reduction does not include burning off all the sound deadening material, but chiseling a good bit of it off is certainly doable, --
A fuel cell is also doable-- but careful attention to the fuel level sender should be in order-- Even a 5 gal fuel cell could get you to work and back a few days before a fillup, as well as 120+ miles on a trip-- An 8 gallon cell would get you 200 miles-- and would be a huge weight reduction over stock tank..
Cutting the rear steel panel out would not only help weight, but would allow your subs to be heard in the cab much easier...
Tubular control arms wouldn't be that hard to do with a little sourcing and research skill...... Maybe some trial and error......
12-05-06, 08:39 PM
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What people don't understand is that reducing weight on the cars actually helps make them last longer and get better gas mileage.. Lighter car makes for less stress on the drivetrain, and all other moving parts...So not only are you making the car faster you are making it last longer and saving money at the pumps......
How much weight can you really remove from the car with Carbon fiber body parts...I hear 45 lbs for the hood, and then 25 pounds on the hood, 15lbs on the trunk, etc...What are the real numbers?
How much weight can you really remove from the car with Carbon fiber body parts...I hear 45 lbs for the hood, and then 25 pounds on the hood, 15lbs on the trunk, etc...What are the real numbers?
12-05-06, 10:42 PM
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i have a carbon fiber hood and trunk. i believe when i weighed the trunk, it came in around 25 lbs, the cf one was about 11lbs
the hood i havent weighed yet, but id have to say it shaved off around 25 lbs or more, plus the hood struts were removed.
the car noticeably felt different, and i had other people drive it who also noted the same. i would say no more than 50 lbs of weight loss total.
the hood i havent weighed yet, but id have to say it shaved off around 25 lbs or more, plus the hood struts were removed.
the car noticeably felt different, and i had other people drive it who also noted the same. i would say no more than 50 lbs of weight loss total.
12-06-06, 08:41 AM
#37
Lexus Test Driver
Just removing the inner door skins, or gutting a good bit of the steel and replacing it with one tubular aluminum cross brace and doing the same thing to the entire steel wall behind back seat should drop nearly 100 lbs-- which I think = nearly 10 hp... All the factory amps and cd changer plus head unit should drop nearly 50 lbs too-- and just replace with a high power head unit and a really small sub amp for the free air sub in the rear deck-- which may need a fiberglass enclosure after removing the rear panel behind the seats- But will be easy to build after removing the steel--
That would get you better sound quality by a mile, and with lighter wheels/tires should be nearly a 200 lb reduction in weight-- Add racing seats to the mix and you should drop nearly 250 lbs... Add cf panels, nearly 300 lbs...
That is only 300 lbs shy of my G20 assuming we started at 3600 lbs..
The effect is that of 30 hp, and only cost you the price of wheels which you would do anyway, buy the seats, and the cf panels, as well as minimal materials for aluminum bracing --- and most people can hopefully handle a fiberglass sub enclosure, if not a shop can do it... Or you could hit up the installer and get him to do it on the side for a lot less cash... While he's installing your cd player...
300 lb drop in weight, + racy look
Add 30 hp with headers and full custom exhaust + BFI
Makes for the equivalent of a 60 hp increase for things you wanted to do anyway....
Tune it on a dyno with a piggyback of some sort= 20 more hp.....
And the spare tire is still in the trunk...
All this equals nearly the equivalent of a 80hp gain...... You WILL feel a difference... Add an exhaust cam and it will equal about a 100 hp gain....
That with a t/c and a shift kit will knock over a second off your 1/4 time..
But an ATI procharger is STILL half the price of all that combined.... And will make your car faster than all those mods combined--
BUT, if you got the money-- a procharger on top of all that-- WHEW....
That would be closer to a 175 hp gain...
Basically double the power...
All for a measley $7000 .....................................
That would get you better sound quality by a mile, and with lighter wheels/tires should be nearly a 200 lb reduction in weight-- Add racing seats to the mix and you should drop nearly 250 lbs... Add cf panels, nearly 300 lbs...
That is only 300 lbs shy of my G20 assuming we started at 3600 lbs..
The effect is that of 30 hp, and only cost you the price of wheels which you would do anyway, buy the seats, and the cf panels, as well as minimal materials for aluminum bracing --- and most people can hopefully handle a fiberglass sub enclosure, if not a shop can do it... Or you could hit up the installer and get him to do it on the side for a lot less cash... While he's installing your cd player...
300 lb drop in weight, + racy look
Add 30 hp with headers and full custom exhaust + BFI
Makes for the equivalent of a 60 hp increase for things you wanted to do anyway....
Tune it on a dyno with a piggyback of some sort= 20 more hp.....
And the spare tire is still in the trunk...
All this equals nearly the equivalent of a 80hp gain...... You WILL feel a difference... Add an exhaust cam and it will equal about a 100 hp gain....
That with a t/c and a shift kit will knock over a second off your 1/4 time..
But an ATI procharger is STILL half the price of all that combined.... And will make your car faster than all those mods combined--
BUT, if you got the money-- a procharger on top of all that-- WHEW....
That would be closer to a 175 hp gain...
Basically double the power...
All for a measley $7000 .....................................
12-12-06, 07:24 PM
#39
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Just having carbon fiber parts dose not mean that you will lose weight. The weight will be decided on the material, the method used, and the quality of the workmanship. Most of the carbon fiber hoods you see out there are hand layed with globs of resin making it maybe 3lb less than fiberglass which is allmost allways hand layed. If you really want to lose weight, go get INFUSED carbon fiber parts and expect to pay alot more.
12-20-06, 01:38 AM
#41
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dont forget your goals here too, are you going for quarter mile time, drifting, autocrossing? if your going just for quartermile time then go for anything and everything, if handling is key becareful of unbalancing the car even more by taking weight off the rear and not the front. like just taking out the spare tire and trunk stuff wouldnt increase the handling. youd probably want to start with the lightweight battery and electric fan stuff first.
12-20-06, 12:49 PM
#43
Look under the door panels-- The whole inside of the door is cased in solid sheet metal, except for one hole to get the regulator out--
You could safely gut 5 lbs of steel or more from each door alone---
If you stripped the car down bare, with absolutely nothing, I mean nothing-- no panels, doors interior, trunk lid, hood, engine, wiring, NOTHING but a bare chassis--
You would find nearly 200 lbs of sound deadening-- burn it off like the btcc guys do, and you'll drop 200 lbs without changing a thing--
Fire retardant mat under the hood-- trunk linings, two trunk mats, amps, cd chgr, trunk struts, hood struts, spare, jack, etc....
OH, the panel seperating the fuel tank from the backseat is solid as well-- you could completely cut that out and replace the structure with an aluminum tubed cross-brace and drop significant weight.
Gas tank= heavy, change the 40+ lb unit out for a 7 lb 20 gal fuel cell that fits where the stock unit does.
Subframes are heavy, and could be rebuilt in tubular chromoly to reduce significant weight--
LCA is cast aluminum, a custom tubular chromoly unit with a bolt-in ball joint would be cheaper in the long run vs. stock non-replaceable ball joint unit, and much lighter too..
Almost all the suspension components are cast aluminum with non replaceable ball joints, which could be easily modelled in cad and rebuilt with bolt-in ball joint setups in tube chromoly--
I think air suspension is lighter vs. struts also... maybe --
Ti exhaust--
Light wheels-- Light tires-- light brakes/rotors-- lighter seats-- light steering wheel-- no carpet-- no backseat-- no dash except gauges-- light shifter--
Manual swap should drop significant weight, while a lightened flywheel would increase throttle response--
Headers are lighter than cast factory units-- no cats......... no mufflers--
CF hood/trunk...
Replace trunk floor with aluminum sheet .....
Lexan windows--
All that should knock off 1000 lbs...
Then it would be a fast race car--
You could safely gut 5 lbs of steel or more from each door alone---
If you stripped the car down bare, with absolutely nothing, I mean nothing-- no panels, doors interior, trunk lid, hood, engine, wiring, NOTHING but a bare chassis--
You would find nearly 200 lbs of sound deadening-- burn it off like the btcc guys do, and you'll drop 200 lbs without changing a thing--
Fire retardant mat under the hood-- trunk linings, two trunk mats, amps, cd chgr, trunk struts, hood struts, spare, jack, etc....
OH, the panel seperating the fuel tank from the backseat is solid as well-- you could completely cut that out and replace the structure with an aluminum tubed cross-brace and drop significant weight.
Gas tank= heavy, change the 40+ lb unit out for a 7 lb 20 gal fuel cell that fits where the stock unit does.
Subframes are heavy, and could be rebuilt in tubular chromoly to reduce significant weight--
LCA is cast aluminum, a custom tubular chromoly unit with a bolt-in ball joint would be cheaper in the long run vs. stock non-replaceable ball joint unit, and much lighter too..
Almost all the suspension components are cast aluminum with non replaceable ball joints, which could be easily modelled in cad and rebuilt with bolt-in ball joint setups in tube chromoly--
I think air suspension is lighter vs. struts also... maybe --
Ti exhaust--
Light wheels-- Light tires-- light brakes/rotors-- lighter seats-- light steering wheel-- no carpet-- no backseat-- no dash except gauges-- light shifter--
Manual swap should drop significant weight, while a lightened flywheel would increase throttle response--
Headers are lighter than cast factory units-- no cats......... no mufflers--
CF hood/trunk...
Replace trunk floor with aluminum sheet .....
Lexan windows--
All that should knock off 1000 lbs...
Then it would be a fast race car--
Yes it would be, but who would want to drive it at that point???The car would be so loud and obnoxious, you would hate it within a matter of days...The luxury is a big part of the appeal of the car...The interior parts deaden sound and add comfort to the ride. if you want this to be a race car, then go for it. But I I wanted a pure, off-road race car, I would start with a C6, or C7 Vette, or a NSX, or some other light weight car that is smaller....
Just make the SC faster...You'll love it for the street...
trust me, I know... 
Ryan
12-20-06, 01:37 PM
#44
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Everyone has a diffrent Goal. I use to drive my track ae86 daily. That sucked 1 seat no interior no heater 5 pts
(hassle to do errands). Well when i switched to the Sc Big diffrence in handling and weight. Number one factor is Balance and handling. then power to weight ratio. so with those 2 concepts we already know that its not gonna be the best drag car or the best road corse car but it will be good enough to compete in both and great to drive around all day.
1. Driver Racing Seat, Remove Passenger seat completely.
if people wanan ride in your car have em sit in the back its more comfortable.
2. Carbon Fiber Hood
its like night and day all i can say? i didnt get a trunk because i wanna use a giant GT SPOILER and it needs a strong base to bolt to.
3. Electrical Fans
it works i used 2 12" fans from a junkyard car then bought a wiring kit from PEP GIRLS
4. Single Exhaust mine goes down the passenger side straight back hsk muffler custom piping bolted up to the cat that is touching the manifold.
5. 5 speed
its lighter than auto.
6. i race on a 1/4 tank of gas das 5 gallons any less and u lose balance in the rear any more and the water floats around too much.
7. now work on power to weight wtih all this i got around 3300lb with me in it. to be competitive u need to have 400+HP with that kind of weight.
the only thing i plan on doing after all this is remove the traction control and changing out the back and rear glass with lexen. that is what i figure would leave a comfortable car to drive in and still be competitive.
(hassle to do errands). Well when i switched to the Sc Big diffrence in handling and weight. Number one factor is Balance and handling. then power to weight ratio. so with those 2 concepts we already know that its not gonna be the best drag car or the best road corse car but it will be good enough to compete in both and great to drive around all day.
1. Driver Racing Seat, Remove Passenger seat completely.
if people wanan ride in your car have em sit in the back its more comfortable.
2. Carbon Fiber Hood
its like night and day all i can say? i didnt get a trunk because i wanna use a giant GT SPOILER and it needs a strong base to bolt to.
3. Electrical Fans
it works i used 2 12" fans from a junkyard car then bought a wiring kit from PEP GIRLS
4. Single Exhaust mine goes down the passenger side straight back hsk muffler custom piping bolted up to the cat that is touching the manifold.
5. 5 speed
its lighter than auto.
6. i race on a 1/4 tank of gas das 5 gallons any less and u lose balance in the rear any more and the water floats around too much.
7. now work on power to weight wtih all this i got around 3300lb with me in it. to be competitive u need to have 400+HP with that kind of weight.
the only thing i plan on doing after all this is remove the traction control and changing out the back and rear glass with lexen. that is what i figure would leave a comfortable car to drive in and still be competitive.
