That could be because in previous model years it was necessary to spend substantially more than $78K to get even close to the range and performance you are getting. Tesla has dramatically reduced Model S prices for 2020 by making previously optional features standard and reducing the number of drive train variations. There has been considerable displeasure expressed on Tesla forums about how this has affected resale prices - especially in Europe. Model S sales plummeted after the Model 3 was introduced and sales of both the Model S and Model 3 are expected to be hit hard by sales of the upcoming Model Y which is expected to become the biggest seller by far.

Musk recently stated that the Model S will not get a redesign which makes me wonder if it going be allowed to fade away and eventually be replaced by a more SUV-like model that's larger than the Model Y and less expensive than the Model X. It's not helping that the Model S is in it's 9th model year visually unchanged as people continue to turn away from 4-door sedans.

 

Thanks for sharing riknchar on your transition to the latest Model S '20 version. You're right on how Tesla has come along way in refining this car. Congratulations and enjoy it !! Life is too short for ordinary stuff. Tesla owners are seeking a long term ownership experience aka the 'forever' car and it seems to fit you well. It's not for everyone for sure. I am sure you will spoil it and take excellent care so that it can have a life well into 300-500k miles. 20k/year means at least 15-25 more years of having tire-replacements an a one time battery upgrade as your major expenses. Not bad of a long term experience lies ahead of you.

Model S being visually unchanged with the exception of some styling changes and front of car look does not bother me one bit. It is a signature look that is unmistakable and may very well stand the test of time. Thank goodness it does not have an ugly "I AM AN EV VEHICLE" distinguishing tramp-stamping feature, color, or trim or eggshell/lean body shape. The future Tesla shape could easily evolve to not have side mirrors when legally permitted by the governing vehicle authorities.

Keep us all posted on your experience and what's cool and working well for you.

 

I think this is tongue-in-cheek but I am not sure. Tesla's record of reliability is not stellar. Most owners report at least one or multiple drive unit changes not to mention all the other cosmetic and structural defects. To expect a Model S to last 15-25 years and 300-500K miles with only "having tire-replacements and a one time battery upgrade as your major expenses" is beyond unrealistic. In fact I think Rick knows enough to dump it before the bumper to bumper warranty runs out as most sane owners do. Better yet I hope he is leasing it so he can get out with no hassle.

We have all been there before. Tesla is like the smoking hot and of course crazy as a bat girl. You know it will end with you crashing and burning up in flames but you hope the thrill of the ride will be worth it, which in this case I think it is.

 

What's the supercharger availability where you live?

 

It didn't cost $100K. He paid $78K.

 

The post where he said he paid $78k came after the post from me you quoted. As I don't have a time machine I didn't see it before I posted that. My comment stands though, $78k is a lot to pay for a vehicle I can't just hop into and take on a trip wherever I want to go.

 

"'Wind noise" has been widely reported about the S. What is your take on that?

 

How would you compare the comfort and "plushness" of the ride in the two cars?

 

Great post!!! Your point that if you bought a Tesla for the track you've bought the wrong car reminds me that these cars are a paradigm shift for everyone. We used to buy ICE cars that were do it all Swiss army knives but these EV's give us more options to have specific cars for specific roles. The Tesla is perhaps the finest commute vehicle available. However, for cross country travel I"ll take my Yukon Denali XL. My Denali is a **** poor commuter car and yet that is what I use it for 99% of the time because I only have the one car for myself. If I wanted to track a car I'd have a separate car like a Porsche for that specific purpose. The availability of an EV like a Tesla is allowing each of us to reevaluate our specific mix of cars in our households and the old rules of having one car that's a jack of all trades is quickly becoming a thing of the past.

 

A luxury vehicle should be something that enhances your lifestyle and allows you to do what you normally do with as little obstruction and as much comfort and ease as possible. A car that you have to constantly mind where it can be charged, have to plan trips around, is limited in function sorely misses that point in my mind.

Heck I honestly will go as far as to say even a really nice LS460 is still not quite as luxurious as a LX570 since the latter simply allows you even more versatility and blunt ability to do what you want when you want to and conditions/requirements be damned.

Im still trying to really get used to a car car, never had something that couldn't off road/tow/haul/disregard basically anything that I'm now learning aren't easy to do in a car if at all. Really interesting how limited I feel when using it, I have a slight unease since I always know I basically only have a vehicle that is for moving me around on good roads and nothing more than that. Nothing at all like my old daily that I used as a tent, shooting rest, off road atv chase rig, engine hauler, mobile quick repair tool box, etc.

Then again I'm soon not going to have really any time for anything other than my advanced degree so I guess all those fun things will be less frequent.

 

Thanks for everyone's inputs! This really has been a very respectful sharing of thoughts regarding Tesla Model S vs Lexus LS460, and I truly LOVE this forum!

So I've had a day and a half with my new 2020 Tesla Model S, and am getting to understand it better and learning to appreciate it's capabilities more and more. Here are some observations from my experience with Tesla so far:

The overall dealership experience was significantly less "luxurious" than what I've grown accustomed to at Lexus. The showroom was spartan and brightly lit (perhaps trying for more of an "Apple vibe?"). The advisors were actually very knowledgeable about their products, and were clearly Tesla "fan-boys." They were able to answer all my questions quickly and easily, and demo'd the technology with ease. I had ordered my car on-line and had made an appointment to pick it up at Noon on Tuesday. When I arrived, promptly at noon, the car was sitting outside, but looked like crap (but "ready to deliver" according to the advisor). It had apparently been washed (sort of), but had swirl marks in the paint, dirt all over the lower portion of the front, and just generally turned me WAY off. When I looked under the front of the car, I could see the plastic underbody panel was hanging loose and had a big scratch from a curb... When I pointed these things out, the advisor said, "oh yeah, I see what you're saying," and took the car back to have it "re-detailed." At that point, I pretty much had decided that I was going to be driving back to Omaha (3 hours) with no Tesla. However, the second detailer was WAY better than the first detailer, and spent an hour really cleaning the car and buffing out the light swirl marks from the first guy. They were also able to quickly replace the plastic under-body panel. In the end, the car did meet my (admittedly very high) standards, and I finalized the transaction and headed out. Overall, a pretty bad experience to start this "experiment..."

When I got back to Omaha, I gave the car an even more thorough detailing (to MY standards), and this allowed me to get a close-up view of every external and internal part of the car. There's definitely a lower-quality feel to many of the materials and fit-and-finish compared to my LS600hL. The doors aren't as heavy, everything has a bit more of a tinny feel to it, the carpet isn't as plush, the paint quality isn't nearly as good, etc.

But the Tech! WOW! I'm still on the fence as to whether giving up the luxury features I've been accustomed to in my LS600 can/will be overcome by the amazing Tesla tech, but my experience so far with the actual car has been very good.

I spent a couple of hours reading the owners manual and tinkering with the settings, and discovered several things I didn't know were even options on the Tesla.

So here's what I love about the car so far:

1. The enormous touch-screen. It has amazing resolution and really is the heart of the car. All options work instantly and are incredibly intuitive. The number of customizable settings is very extensive.

2. The white and black interior (I wasn't sure I'd like this). The ultra-white seats and black trim I find to be extremely unique, super-modern, and very comfortable. These seats have terrific side bolsters that fit my body perfectly, and seem to "hug" me as I drive. My Lexus LS seats were the best I had ever experienced, and I don't know if the Tesla seats are going to end up being my new "best seats," but I do like them a lot. The "vegan leather" is super soft, and the seats just fit me like a glove.

3. The sleek exterior design. This car feels WAY more youthful and current than my LS (which of course it is). I don't really think the exterior design is "flashy" in the way I think the new LS500 is over-the-top gaudy, and I know this design has been around since 2012, but I still find it extremely appealing.

​​​​​​​4. The "surprise" features:
a. I was able to program my garage door opener to the car (no biggie), but then I was able to hit a setting that will automatically open my garage door when I drive up my (long) driveway when I get to 50 feet from my garage. I find this to be very cool for some reason ;-)

b. I received a text while driving, and a chime sounded and the car asked me if I wanted to hear the text. When the car read me the text, it gave me the option to respond verbally. That's very useful to me, as I get a huge number of texts all day long, and admit to being very distracted by them when driving.

c. The autopilot works amazingly well! The 8-camera system captures everything around me, and there's a visualization feature on the main dash that shows all of the cars around me that the Tesla sees. The car stays perfectly centered in the lane and goes around curves extremely well with no steering input from me.

d. The built in internet connection allows me to play virtually any song/album I can think of by just asking for it. At no charge...

e. The wicked acceleration. Everyone already knows this, but I had never personally experienced the g-forces that happen when launching from 0-60 in the mid-3-second range. Holy Sheeeet!!! I don't think I'll do this very often, but it really does take my breath away!

f. The composed ride. I've left the car in "Comfort Mode" like I always did in my LS600, and have found the suspension to be actually really smooth (probably not quite as disconnected from the road as my LS), but extremely "taut." There's a series of 3 big speed bumps to get off the Air Force base that I work at, and my LS would always take these just fine, but would be a bit "bouncy" if I went too fast. The Tesla went over them WAY better. And the car definitely corners better (the weight is so evenly distributed and the center of gravity is so low due to the battery weight). The new Raven Air Ride Suspension in the Tesla is one of the reasons I made the switch, and I have not been disappointed.

g. The overall quietness. The Tesla is admittedly not as quiet as my Lexus at highway speed, with a bit more tire noise, wind noise, etc. But I have found it to be "quiet enough" to satisfy me, and in some instances seems a bit quieter than my LS. It is probably quieter than 95% of the cars being made today, which is good enough.

h. The way the car greets me when I walk up to it. Lights turn on inside the car, the handles pop out invitingly, the music automatically restarts where it left off, and there's no "Start button" to push. It's just ready to go.
​​​​​​​
i. The iPhone Tesla App. Simply amazing, and quite useful. I can open my car, honk the horn, lock the car, turn on the climate system, check the charge status, etc. from my smart phone. Today at lunch I picked up some things at the grocery store and then went back to my office. A while later, someone came in and commented on how warm it had gotten outside. I thought "oh no! my refrigerated stuff is going to be too warm." So I pulled out my phone and sure enough, the cockpit of my car was sitting at 86 degrees! I hit a button and activated my climate system and set it to 70 degrees. When I checked 3 minutes later, it had gotten the car cooled to 70. I left it that way for roughly 2 hours while I finished up my work. In that time, I used up approximately 4 miles of range (I went from 305 miles to 301 miles of range). And my stuff didn't get too hot!

So overall, I can definitely "Get" how owning a Tesla can be so addictive, and why people are such fans. It won't take long before all of the features become second nature to me, and any car that doesn't have the same features will seem hopelessly dated.

I will likely only put 7-8k miles per year on this car, and will keep it fully charged in my garage (220v connection for both me and my wife). I don't know that I would ever take it on a trip, but can see how that would not be so tough, with 373 miles of range and the ability to recharge quickly (and for free) at the many Tesla Super-Chargers along the interstate in all directions.

This car won't be for everybody, but for my specific use case, it hits all the high marks and I think it's a keeper!

Here are a few photos from tonight (not the best, but I do like the sunset). I'll get some better photos when I have time and the light is right.

​​​​​​​If anyone has any specific questions for me, please shoot them my way. And thanks for keeping this discussion so respectful!








I tend to baby my cars so the extreme, and I will likely never drive my Model S in snow (or even rain), and I will keep a coat of wax on everything and will hand-wash frequently, so this car will likely last a LONG time if I continue to enjoy it. I only put around 7-8k miles per year on my LS600hL, and will probably be about the same for my Model S.

 

Congratulations again, Rick! Great photos and I was especially keen on hearing your thoughts on the Raven air suspension. The LS still has the edge in ride quality and quietness but the divide is not that great. I think I notice more of a difference in noise levels whereas the Raven S rides remarkably close to the LS over the same roads and with the same Pirelli P7+ tires. I agree that the car is plenty quiet enough.

I had a similar experience taking advantage of the phone app control to keep the AC on at 72 degrees a few days ago. I had returned from Costco with some water bottles and didn't want to leave them in a hot interior at work. I knew the Cabin Overheat Protection feature would keep the interior below 105 degrees automatically but I wanted it way cooler. It was great leaving the AC on for two hours while I was in meetings and I only lost a total of 6 miles of range.

I think it is great that you're coming from prior EV experience. It also sounds like the Model S has impressed you over those earlier EVs. Admittedly, the Leaf and Bolt didn't go all-in to set themselves apart from ICE cars. I think that is a failing of many EV competitors, they're just half-hearted conversions of ICE designs.

As for @TANORWAY 's experience of 55 problems, that is shocking and I feel sorry about that. At the same time, the very early years were definitely plagued with problems and why I only considered 2015-and-newer when I was looking at used Model S. The newer ones since MCU 2 (March 2018 and newer) have been very reliable with faulty door handles and leaky moonroof fixed, as well as larger capacity eMMC to negate the memory-write concern. A friend's 2018 P100D still developed the yellowing border around the large screen 10-months after he bought it. It is cosmetic and doesn't affect functionality. Still, it sucks to see it. Tesla uses a UV box to re-cure the adhesive and that seems to resolve the yellowing. People have also used their own $10 UV light to DIY. We initially looked at the Model X but were disappointed by the build quality and ride quality (better now with the Raven X). With the Model S, the build quality has dramatically improved over earlier years. The panel gaps are still inconsistent but it's really only a topic you discuss in forums. In person, I never think of the panel gaps when I glance back at the car. The S design has aged very well and is still one of the best looking cars on the road, IMHO.

After six months I notice two intermittent rattles, one in the driver's door and one behind the dash, when going over rough bumps. I have also had the two front half-shafts replaced in December 2019 to remedy the ticking/shudder sound during hard acceleration. Unfortunately, Tesla only used the latest 'D' revision for one of the half-shafts and the ticking/shudder has re-emerged. I have an appointment on Monday and requested the latest version of parts and hoping this solves the issue for good -- reports from Tesla Motor Club forum members suggest the proper fix does solve the issue. Despite all this, I still love the car. Oh, I also needed the A-pillar repainted due to a paint defect. Tesla service has been excellent the four times I had to bring the car in and have absolutely no regrets. The OTA (over-the-air) updates are awesome and the car keeps getting better and better over time. I love the LS and I love the Model S, both for different reasons -- each car plays to their strengths.

I wish a $78K Long Range was available at the time we bought our Model S. Ours was $72K and I would gladly pay the extra $6K for almost 100 more miles of range, faster acceleration, and faster charge rate. I think you definitely made the right call between the 2019 Standard Range vs 2020 Long Range.

@Kansas , I just want to touch on the fact that although it can take over an hour to charge from 5% to 100%, almost nobody does this on a road trip because charging tapers off and slows down as you get closer to full. You save more time by Supercharging to 80%, which will easily get you to the next Supercharger or two. I am not suggesting an EV is right for everyone but there are folks that traveled coast-to-coast in early Teslas with smaller batteries and when the Supercharger network was much smaller than it is today. On our 285-mile rated Model S, I have driven 250 miles on the freeway (Sacramento to Bakersfield) before charging, and I actually exceed the EPA estimates (getting over 300 miles) when driving around town where regen comes into play -- this is during the current winter in California (not subzero temperatures, but neither is it ideal EV weather). The first two weeks of ownership I was barely getting 200 miles total, but I turned on every conceivable feature (preventing the car from sleeping) and I drove it like a new toy. Now that I've settled down and drive it like I drove the LS, it is easy for me to beat EPA ratings.

 

"Another Lexus owner bites the dust".
I've owned a 2001 LS430, 2004 LS 430, 2007 LS460, 2010 LS460, 2012 LS600h - amazing cars. However, I found the misalignment of the prop shaft (at the gearbox coupling) on the LS460 to be quite disconcerting, but forgave that because of my utter loyalty to the brand.
Then when I got a 2015 LS460 with the same issue I was quite alarmed. Whatever happened to the "relentless pursuit of perfection"? This is a very basic design element.
I then got a 2015 NX200t (bought without test-driving, as I thought the tenets/basics of Lexus design would have informed the design of this model as well), and nearly died of shock. Noise levels that harked back to base model cars from the 70s (which had very little sound-proofing), a constant extremely high-pitched whine from the turbo, torque-steer that nearly got me killed a few times, etc. I must be quite a fool as I then traded this in on a 2016 RX450h Limited (again without test-driving, as I didn't think this very popular model would be anything less than perfect). Another mistake. NVH levels that took me back to the 60s - constant vibration through the floor pan, steering wheel, driver's seat, etc.; a constant droning sound that made riding quite unpleasant as the ECU keeps the car travelling around 1000-1500 rpm virtually all of the time, which is exactly when the car drones/vibrates most. There's another thread that has covered this issue extensively.

I have to conclude that the design brief at Lexus has changed completely. I have sourced a pristine LS430 (amazing car), and am changing the RX for a Mazda CX 9. And I'm very sad about it.

 

I can't get past the part that I can't easily wrench on my own vehicles. If I made more money though, I would absolutely lease one of these (buying an electric vehicle at this time of technology doesn't make sense at all). Owning my 2004 ES330 and 2003 Pontiac Vibe with zero issues and not having a car payment is amazing. Electric vehicles are without a doubt the future though. Burning a non renewable resource for fuel to get from point A to point B will be laughed at in the future.

 

I don't think the ICE is going away anytime soon. I totally agree that the EV is the best option as a commute vehicle. But people will still prefer ICE for long distance trips, SUV's and sports cars.

Our short trips and commutes will probably end up being a subscription service or Uber type service with drivers initially and eventually driverless. It'll change everything. No need for a garage if most people won't have their own car. No need for malls with tons of parking spaces if cars are a shared ride that pick up and drop off curbside.

Cost will go down as well. Less accidents means lower insurance.