Hifiman1

Hi, has anyone compared the two cars? Has the ES closed the gap for NVH and quietness?

DerrickM

I posted a while back on this--I have a '15 LS and I drove my sister's 2017 ES for a whole day last December. Love both cars, but very different. ES was for me a great peppy FWD car with a lot of road feel, vs my LS which is more of a large luxury freeway cruiser. I also recently drove a 2019 ES hybrid and while I was impressed with the hybrid technology, I didn't find it as fun to drive as the regular ES.

SW17LS

I've driven a couple 2019 ESs. Its the nicest best driving ES ever, but it has not "closed the gap" with the LS460 in NVH or quietness. The LS is just built to a much higher standard and you feel that everywhere in the car, the ES feels light by comparison, and it will never have the same refinement in the ride just by the nature of its suspension which is much less sophisticated than the LS.

The only reason to choose a 2019 ES over a 2015 LS is if you love the new technology, or you need/want a new car vs a used car.

UDel

A ES may be about as quiet as a LS but a entry level 40K sedan based on a Camry or Avalon is never going to drive, feel, have the same build quality, attention to detail, as a flagship sedan costing 25K or 35K+ more.

sha4000

iTrader: (1)

I had 2018 ES300h and 2019 ES350 loaners for a couple of weeks and while both were very nice I still was very happy to be back in my car. I don't believe if your shopping LS that you would cross shop the ES. Now if your just looking for the Lexus that fits YOU I can see looking at both and then figuring out which is more economical.

SW17LS

Its also not as quiet as the LS. They just dont have as much sound deadening, and especially on coarse pavement the ES is considerably louder. It also just doesnt feel as well sealed up.

If you look at the back of an LS door panel and the back of an ES door panel its pretty obvious.

LS door panel (this is an early ones, later ones have a larger Styrofoam noise inhibitor also:



ES door panel:

SW17LS

I think many people who buy a new ES consider a CPO LS. It makes perfect sense, similar type of cars, a 3 year old LS is about what a new ES costs. I bought the ES twice, in 2003 and in 2010 and each time I seriously considered a 3 year old LS.

I chose the ES both times because it was new, and I lease for business. I prefer new cars. Choosing between a 2015 LS and a 2019 ES, even knowing the LS is superior I would likely choose the 2019 ES.

SW17LS

From a driving perspective...you're going to prefer the LS. Both cars have the same general mission, and if you like the ES you'll love the LS. It takes everything the ES is good at and does it better.

The area where the new ES shines is technology.

Searosis

I had a 19’ es loaner for 4 days and really missed my 13’ LS460L. I am 6’3” 255lbs and I have 3 year old twins.

Aside from rom the extra refinement and overall more luxurious experience of the LS the sheer size difference is huge. In the es I could not have my drivers seat in a normal position and have my son or daughter sit behind me in their car seat. In the LS they can’t even kick the back of the seat. The new LS killed this though as the backseat is tiny in volume compared to old LS. My next car will unfortunately have to be an A8L or an S class as the new LS is a botch job in my opinion.

I will say that the new ES blows it out of the water in infotainment tech and it’s ridiculous that most ls don’t have dynamic cruise.

Thomasin

I have never owned an ES but have driven one 2019 loaner.

In Houston where roads are subpar, you would have noted the difference immediately. Not only does a LS offers the driver complete isolation from the road (this is what makes LS and ML a perfect match), it also absorbs shock much better IMHO. It is not fair to compare with my 2015 LWB loaded with air suspension. Pardon my ignorance, yet I have not found any other cars that can out-compete my LS 430 (without air suspension) in offering a silk-smooth ride!

Don't get me wrong I am not saying ES is not a good car. I have to admit the spindle grill in the loaner is wowwwww wonderful!

SW17LS

The ES is very large in the back, not as large in the back as an LS460L, but as large or larger legroom wise as a SWB LS460. More room than an LS500 too.

Cool about your twins Searosis! I have 4 year old twins. Mine cant kick the seatbacks either. Thats actually the primary reason why I traded my 15 SWB LS460 in on the 17 LWB one.

Dolph1

I also have 4 year old twins and that is what made the LWB a complete no brainer. I seem to be the exception since mine can reach the back of the front seats with full extension so am in the market for seat protectors. Going to embark on a NY to Maryland trip with the little ones soon and will possibly need to find out if one of those little potty's can be used in the back of the LWB - fingers crossed the Weathertech’s do their job! Recently had a 2019 Avalon loaner and the twins kept complaining how small it was in the back - it really was. The back seats of the Avalon used to be much bigger if I’m not mistaken.

KYLS

Agreed. This is the same advice I gave my parents a few months back. They had a LS400, and were well past needing an upgrade. I suggested a Tesla, but they seemed set on an older LS for ride and comfort. Ultimately after driving an CPO low mile 2015 ES300h, they decided that was the car they wanted. I'm not close by to help with repairs, so having a newer car with warranty was the right decision for them and although it may not have the same ride as an LS, or the cool factor of the Tesla, its ride and technology is night and day over their LS400. It all comes down to perspective and weighing out what you value. However if the choice had been an 2019 ES or lightly used Tesla, I suspect the Tesla would have won.

SW17LS

They can reach the backs of my seats with full extension too, but its not so close that they can rest their feet on them comfortably and when they kick they dont hit them. A lot of it depends on how big your carseats are too.

Portably potty works fine in the back floorboard

We take it on trips every once and a while instead of the van, much nicer to drive.

Searosis

Ha! You have a van too huh? My wife has this 15’ Sienna limited premium and we use the heck out of it. This was yesterday towing my little boat across the state. She’s low in the rear due to the crazy amount of stuff in the cargo area. Did 18mpg at 65-70