Notices
LS - 4th Gen (2007-2017) Discussion topics related to the current flagship models LS460, LS460L and LS600H

Steering Rack Problem

Thread Tools
 
Search this Thread
 
Old May 8, 2023 | 09:26 AM
  #1  
Tec80's Avatar
Tec80
Thread Starter
Advanced
10 Year Member
Liked
Loved
Community Favorite
 
Joined: Sep 2014
Posts: 618
Likes: 135
From: IL
Default Steering Rack Problem

My car has been giving me the power steering failure warning intermittently for about 2 years. Usually I turn the car off and restart and it clears up. I discovered this is due to a connector issue on the right side of the engine compartment. I found this video
At 2:48 describing the issue, and I unplugged the connector and sprayed contact cleaner in it - presto, no more steering warning!

However, maybe due to steering the car without power steering, the rack now makes a noise when turning the steering wheel back & forth. Sounds like a bad bearing in a roller skate wheel. No play in the steering, and the power steering still functions perfectly. SO I searched for more information on this, and found this video showing the rack motor disassembled:
At about the 30 second mark, you can see the motor armature that spins at a high speed when the steering shaft is turned, and my rack's bearing noise corresponds to this armature speed. So likely I need a new rack.

I have the USF40-AEZQH SZ sport model, which uses a unique rack (44200-50290). The Sport supposedly has the different rack to give sharper turn-in, but I've never noticed any difference vs. our other LS460. Also, the racks are different between air suspension cars, vs coil spring cars (not sure what air suspension has to do with the rack).

I'm planning on sourcing a used rack from ebay since the price is around $400 and it's relatively easy to replace. Does anyone know why the racks are different on air suspension LS460s?

Thanks!
Reply
Old May 10, 2023 | 03:06 PM
  #2  
V8ski's Avatar
V8ski
10th Gear
 
Joined: Dec 2022
Posts: 10
Likes: 3
From: WY
Default

Do you hear this bad bearing sound from the steering rack all the time? or just when the motor is off?
While diagnosing a front end clunk related to steering I tested the rack and noticed there is a bearing like noise when it moves without assist / engine power. I didn't really hear the noise with the engine running. Since the steering functions perfectly, I'm thinking this noise is totally normal and not worth replacing the rack until it fully declares itself.
Reply
Old May 10, 2023 | 07:08 PM
  #3  
Tec80's Avatar
Tec80
Thread Starter
Advanced
10 Year Member
Liked
Loved
Community Favorite
 
Joined: Sep 2014
Posts: 618
Likes: 135
From: IL
Default

It's only when electric power is on. I press the start button twice without pushing the brake pedal and it powers up the rack, then the noise is easy to hear. It's definitely different from how it used to be.
Reply
Old May 11, 2023 | 02:53 PM
  #4  
V8ski's Avatar
V8ski
10th Gear
 
Joined: Dec 2022
Posts: 10
Likes: 3
From: WY
Default

One would hope the rack could be rebuilt or the culprit bearing could be replaced, though my google search turned up nothing. If you do swap out the rack it would be great to get more info on how the original failed.
Reply
Old May 12, 2023 | 06:24 PM
  #5  
caha14's Avatar
caha14
Racer
20 Year Member
Liked
Loved
 
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 1,717
Likes: 89
From: FL
Default

Originally Posted by Tec80
Does anyone know why the racks are different on air suspension LS460s?

Thanks!
Excellent research and findings! Air suspension cars have AVS and VGRS, the latter being the reason.
Reply
Old May 18, 2023 | 05:39 AM
  #6  
Tec80's Avatar
Tec80
Thread Starter
Advanced
10 Year Member
Liked
Loved
Community Favorite
 
Joined: Sep 2014
Posts: 618
Likes: 135
From: IL
Default

Good point! I need to disconnect the steering shaft from the rack and see if the noise is in the VGRS unit or the rack itself. I've been bitten before by the Parts Cannon approach, when just a bit of labor would have shown me the exact offending part. I drove it today and the steering is a bit "sticky" off center, so it's very likely a failed bearing somewhere.
Reply
Old May 19, 2023 | 06:39 AM
  #7  
Tec80's Avatar
Tec80
Thread Starter
Advanced
10 Year Member
Liked
Loved
Community Favorite
 
Joined: Sep 2014
Posts: 618
Likes: 135
From: IL
Default

Wow, I drove it on the freeway at high speed and it's "sticky" over center, making the car feel very unstable and darty. Definitely the rack itself, as VGRS would disable itself and lock the input to the output and set a code if it malfunctioned.

Now to find a replacement rack for less than $2100, ugh.
Reply
Old May 24, 2023 | 12:10 PM
  #8  
Tec80's Avatar
Tec80
Thread Starter
Advanced
10 Year Member
Liked
Loved
Community Favorite
 
Joined: Sep 2014
Posts: 618
Likes: 135
From: IL
Default

I contacted Lexus customer service, and got the standard "it's out of warranty" response. So when they sent a follow-up survey, I let them have it. I mentioned that this is a safety issue, that my car has never seen salt or winter weather, and that this is the first time I've ever had a car fail a steering rack. I thought they might be interested in a fault like this, because it could result in a crash and even if it's an isolated failure, it should not have happened.

I'm also a bit annoyed that the list price for the rack is $2800 and they don't sell any component parts (like the bearing that failed in my rack). I found one at a junkyard in TX, but they don't ship. It's a specific part only used on the 2010 until 8/2011, so it's a relative unicorn.

Since I have nothing to lose, I'll take the rack apart to see if I can replace the bearing. Evidently the Honda S2000 used a nearly-identical EPAS design, and there are people who rebuild those. Related link: https://www.s2ki.com/forums/s2000-mo...pinion-885422/

I'll share what I find inside my rack, likely it's one of the armature bearings.
Reply
Old May 26, 2023 | 09:53 PM
  #9  
Sherl's Avatar
Sherl
Advanced
 
Joined: May 2018
Posts: 652
Likes: 67
From: TX
Default

Originally Posted by Tec80
I contacted Lexus customer service, and got the standard "it's out of warranty" response. So when they sent a follow-up survey, I let them have it. I mentioned that this is a safety issue, that my car has never seen salt or winter weather, and that this is the first time I've ever had a car fail a steering rack. I thought they might be interested in a fault like this, because it could result in a crash and even if it's an isolated failure, it should not have happened.

I'm also a bit annoyed that the list price for the rack is $2800 and they don't sell any component parts (like the bearing that failed in my rack). I found one at a junkyard in TX, but they don't ship. It's a specific part only used on the 2010 until 8/2011, so it's a relative unicorn.

Since I have nothing to lose, I'll take the rack apart to see if I can replace the bearing. Evidently the Honda S2000 used a nearly-identical EPAS design, and there are people who rebuild those. Related link: https://www.s2ki.com/forums/s2000-mo...pinion-885422/

I'll share what I find inside my rack, likely it's one of the armature bearings.

Where in Texas? If it's Austin, prolly I can help
Reply
Old May 29, 2023 | 08:54 AM
  #10  
Tec80's Avatar
Tec80
Thread Starter
Advanced
10 Year Member
Liked
Loved
Community Favorite
 
Joined: Sep 2014
Posts: 618
Likes: 135
From: IL
Default

It's in Kennedale, just SW of Fort Worth.
Reply
Old Jul 2, 2023 | 12:12 PM
  #11  
Tec80's Avatar
Tec80
Thread Starter
Advanced
10 Year Member
Liked
Loved
Community Favorite
 
Joined: Sep 2014
Posts: 618
Likes: 135
From: IL
Default

I found out that the rack part number has been superseded, from 44200-50290 to 44200-50430. A bit of web searching reveals the armature bearing part number, which is BDZ45-3.

I started removing the rack, and got everything disconnected except the tie rods. For those, I had to buy 29mm and 34mm open-end spanner wrenches to unscrew the inner tie rod ends from the rack shaft. The reason for doing this was that I can preserve the alignment by leaving the entire R&L tie rods untouched (the inner tie rod ends swivel). I'll then take the rack apart to see what bearing failed. If it is indeed the BDZ45-3, and I can remove it carefully without damaging anything, I'll buy a new bearing and rebuild the rack.

Some labor and a $100 bearing, vs. $3400 (list, ouch) for a complete new rack. Yeah, I'll give it a shot.BDZ45-3DZ45-3
Reply
Old Jul 2, 2023 | 12:42 PM
  #12  
swfla's Avatar
swfla
Lead Lap
iTrader: (1)
 
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 4,488
Likes: 1,328
From: San Diego, CA
Default

Keep us posted and hope you succeed.
Reply
Old Jul 2, 2023 | 01:35 PM
  #13  
Anfanger's Avatar
Anfanger
Pole Position
5 Year Member
Liked
Loved
Community Favorite
 
Joined: Aug 2020
Posts: 2,843
Likes: 998
From: NH
Default

44200-50290 is likely a sub-assembly part number. However, 44200-50430 is an actual part number and it only superseeds 4420050270 and 4420050271. Can you provide a reference to support your findings regarding steering rack part numbers?
Reply
Old Jul 2, 2023 | 05:03 PM
  #14  
Tec80's Avatar
Tec80
Thread Starter
Advanced
10 Year Member
Liked
Loved
Community Favorite
 
Joined: Sep 2014
Posts: 618
Likes: 135
From: IL
Default

Second line:
http://jp-carparts.com/lexus/partlis...ype=3&fig=4505
Reply
Old Jul 3, 2023 | 03:50 AM
  #15  
Anfanger's Avatar
Anfanger
Pole Position
5 Year Member
Liked
Loved
Community Favorite
 
Joined: Aug 2020
Posts: 2,843
Likes: 998
From: NH
Default

Thanks, where does it provide information about superseeding?
Reply



All times are GMT -7. The time now is 01:36 AM.