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This is my first post in the 430 forum. I am a 2015 460L owner but its recent height compressor failure horror has prompted me to move backward to a 430. Long story short, Lexus has stepped up to cover half of the part cost and the second dealer I approached was very thoughtful to offer me a loaner car. However, it is very disappointing that a Lexus part can fail while my car only has ~36120 miles under its wheels.
My parents are a proud owner of Toyota Celsior (I noticed that it is packaged as Lexus LS 430 in America) and the car has never let them down. As far as I can recall, they only need to replace the motor that locks and unlocks the driver door and oil pan (? forget what the part is called as the car leaks engine oil). Some on the 460 forum have indeed discouraged the idea to look for a 430. I am sure that there must be reasons why the 430 forum still exists (You must love something that 460 doesn't offer), right?
Anything I should look for / beware of / avoid for a car that is at least 14 years old? What should be the reasonable price? In the past month, I have found 2 but passed on both. The first one is a 2006 with 100k miles which the shop asks for $11k. It is silver in colour and drives as smooth as my 460L but the headlight is yellow (melted?). The second one is an extremely low-mile (83k miles) 2003 with a gold paint. While it doesn't have the headlamp problem as the first one, there was a triangle warning sign on the dashboard. What can that mean? Are there any parts that must have been replaced given the age / mileage?
Last week I found a 2006 in a Lexus dealer. There is no listed price on their site. That greedy sales guy wanted $14000! No way I am spending 50% of what my current car is worth on an aged car. When he first greeted me, he showed me the other 2 460s and a 500 in the inventory. I didn't say I was looking for a 430 until the end because I wanted to have a rough idea how much I can trade in mine based on how much they sold theirs. 500? Kidding right? I am not going to buy a crap again (sorry to be offensive but this what 460 is in my eyes, hence the 500 should not be different).
Some members on the same 460 forum have suggested me to move on to a Camry/Corolla. Looking at the interior alone, they do not interest me. Yes they are definitely the most reliable cars on Earth but the cabin looks 'very plastic' to me with a monochrome theme (everything is grey in colour). This is why I am thinking of giving Lexus a second chance. I apologize for such a long post but truly appreciate any inputs.
The door locks are $1000 each for the part alone,the triangle light means there is a engine or VSC error
The suspension will need replaced due to old rubber to the tune of around $2000 in parts alone, the engine also uses a timing belt that costs $1000 to have done and will require replacement from both age and mileage and will lead to total engine failure if not done, the front main and cam seals may be leaking due to age and that is a timing belt job plus extra work so probably $1500, the transmission pan and engine valve cover gaskets and possibly the engine pan(s) may also be leaking due to becoming extremely brittle from age. All fluids if never replaced will need to be and if the brake fluid was never done expect brake line failure since the fluid is hydroscopic. You also may encounter leaking rims since the 430s were usually given dealer chrome treatments that flake and lead to leaks and a set of rims is about $800 I think, tires will also likely be old and of lesser quality on a used example. The steering system also tends to develop shaking but this seems to be a limited event, the steering wheel tilt/telescope motors however usually always fail if they haven't already and are $300 each in parts. Exhaust also tends to rust out from age and the cats ($1000 each if you need to conform to emissions and need OR) also sometimes get plugged and fail. Last thing that comes to mind is the rear springs wear out and lead to tire destroying negative camber far in excess of what is helpful for handling.
That,s all that comes to mind right now, I have about $3400 in parts in my car including total suspension replacement, headlight ballasts and wet sanding to make them clear again, every seal on the engine and trans aside from the rear main and trans pump seals, all services/maintenance/filter, brakes, parking brake adjustment, and other odds and ends. Labor was free since I did it and that's about the only reason I bought a 430 vs a 460 since it's dramatically easier to work on and generally doesn't break but everything that is a wear item will need to be addressed.
If you chase it bit by bit you will never have a car that feels "right" and one thing after another will wear out from differences in loading. You are best off doing it all at once. It's not really a car one should ever look at if you have a newer 460 already or are unable to fix "minor" stuff yourself or already owned one since new and KNOW it's well sorted. The plus side is once you fix it it will stay fixed for a long time
I will gladly trade you my fully repaired and perfect 02 with nearly new premium tires for your 15 460L however if you really want a 430 that is mechanically good to go and 90% perfect cosmetics. Clearly you don't trust the car and don't want to have further issues, I would be more than happy to help you into a solid 430. I also have a 68k mike 06 in basically perfect condition I would trade you as well with many many pictures of both cars that I can link.
Last edited by Striker223; Sep 19, 2020 at 09:34 PM.
Tiffany,
There are no perfect cars. You are driving one of the most reliable cars on the market. Any car can have an issue from time to time, and Lexus helped you out with yours. Unless you are hurting for money, keeping your 460 is the better option between the two cars. Just look at the thread "how many miles do you have on your 430". You will see that even 430's can have low mileage issues.
I own a 460 and recently purchased a 430 to help keep the miles off of my 460. I have a lot of experience buying older cars and the only way to do it is searching out the diamonds! Low mileage, excellent service history etc. My 430 is pristine with 20k miles on it. I spent $20k to buy it. A lot of folks baulk at that, but I've been through the high mileage purchases and learned my lesson. It's better to pay up front. Of the 20+ old cars I've owned and driven, the diamonds never let me down.
Looking for a 70, 80, 90+ mileage car will not give you what your looking for. They need maintenance, (struts, timing belts, water pumps etc.). They will most likely cost you money to get them up to speed. Even then, you are driving a car with far more wear than the one you have.
Tiffany,
I am going to urge you to stay away from an old ls430. I just sold my 2001pearl white ls430 ultra luxury with 90k on it yesterday. While the car is lovely, at 19 years old the rubber and foam is starting to go. If you noticed in this forum most ls430 owners that have these cars for some time are now doing many little repairs to keep the car on the road and to maintain the stigma this car has. I believe that while a quality product, the ls430 is like a rock star we all loved 20 years ago and don't mind watching on TV but not willing to pay for a ticket for a concert.
tiffany,
you may want to consider
eliminating the air suspension
system, and replacing it with
Coil overs (which I think are conventional struts) cost is about $2000 ? - but not sure.
check ls460 threads.
The door locks are $1000 each for the part alone,the triangle light means there is a engine or VSC error
The suspension will need replaced due to old rubber to the tune of around $2000 in parts alone, the engine also uses a timing belt that costs $1000 to have done and will require replacement from both age and mileage and will lead to total engine failure if not done, the front main and cam seals may be leaking due to age and that is a timing belt job plus extra work so probably $1500, the transmission pan and engine valve cover gaskets and possibly the engine pan(s) may also be leaking due to becoming extremely brittle from age. All fluids if never replaced will need to be and if the brake fluid was never done expect brake line failure since the fluid is hydroscopic. You also may encounter leaking rims since the 430s were usually given dealer chrome treatments that flake and lead to leaks and a set of rims is about $800 I think, tires will also likely be old and of lesser quality on a used example. The steering system also tends to develop shaking but this seems to be a limited event, the steering wheel tilt/telescope motors however usually always fail if they haven't already and are $300 each in parts. Exhaust also tends to rust out from age and the cats ($1000 each if you need to conform to emissions and need OR) also sometimes get plugged and fail. Last thing that comes to mind is the rear springs wear out and lead to tire destroying negative camber far in excess of what is helpful for handling.
That,s all that comes to mind right now, I have about $3400 in parts in my car including total suspension replacement, headlight ballasts and wet sanding to make them clear again, every seal on the engine and trans aside from the rear main and trans pump seals, all services/maintenance/filter, brakes, parking brake adjustment, and other odds and ends. Labor was free since I did it and that's about the only reason I bought a 430 vs a 460 since it's dramatically easier to work on and generally doesn't break but everything that is a wear item will need to be addressed.
If you chase it bit by bit you will never have a car that feels "right" and one thing after another will wear out from differences in loading. You are best off doing it all at once. It's not really a car one should ever look at if you have a newer 460 already or are unable to fix "minor" stuff yourself or already owned one since new and KNOW it's well sorted. The plus side is once you fix it it will stay fixed for a long time
I will gladly trade you my fully repaired and perfect 02 with nearly new premium tires for your 15 460L however if you really want a 430 that is mechanically good to go and 90% perfect cosmetics. Clearly you don't trust the car and don't want to have further issues, I would be more than happy to help you into a solid 430. I also have a 68k mike 06 in basically perfect condition I would trade you as well with many many pictures of both cars that I can link.
Striker speaks cold, hard reality truths. LS430s are great cars, and I love mine, but it's going to take some serious coin to bring one back up to snuff.
I'll be the contrarian here and say that good LS430s are out there that don't need extensive repairs - and in fact may be in fantastic condition with many years of life left on them. When I bought my '05 at 109K about 3 years ago it needed nothing at all. Everything worked. No leaks, creaks or wierd noises of any kind. No CELs. Same is true today at 126K. I think these forums are biased in the sense that the members that have issues post about them, but those that do not don't. You don't see people posting threads like "My LS430 went another year without needing a single repair." My car can't be the only one. If you want to find a good LS 430 like I am talking about, probably want to be looking at cars with complete maintenance history, ~ 120 K miles or less, garage kept, non-UL, from a place that does not have salt on the roads.
Be prepared to pay for such a car. $10K + where I live in WA
I'll be the contrarian here and say that good LS430s are out there that don't need extensive repairs - and in fact may be in fantastic condition with many years of life left on them. When I bought my '05 at 109K about 3 years ago it needed nothing at all. Everything worked. No leaks, creaks or wierd noises of any kind. No CELs. Same is true today at 126K. I think these forums are biased in the sense that the members that have issues post about them, but those that do not don't. You don't see people posting threads like "My LS430 went another year without needing a single repair." My car can't be the only one. If you want to find a good LS 430 like I am talking about, probably want to be looking at cars with complete maintenance history, ~ 120 K miles or less, garage kept, on-UL, from a place that does not have salt on the roads.
Be prepared to pay for such a car. $10K + where I live in WA
Agree, my "trusted" indy recently reported that my LS430 is in pristine condition other than some very small and very minor hairline cracks in the front lower control arm bushings, for which indy said are not even a concern at present time and should not be for quite some time in the future.
However, the LS430 was a low mileage (80,000) one owner, garaged kept, babied, dealer maintained southern car, traded in for a new LS 500, and retailed by the Lexus dealer who took in the trade. (But, wondering whether recently inadvertently let indy blow smoke up my axe when indy blowing smoke better suited for such as finding EVAP/vacuum leaks and/or etc.)
The only reason I mentioned the cost is since they always break and most people do not have the time/skill/patience to do that repair and in the case of the OPs prior thread on 460 compressor failure it was fairly clear that the OP was not able to locate alternatives that "enthusiasts" were able to relatively quickly identify that would have massively cut costs to repair the car.
In the case of the actuators I didn't want her to be shocked at the repair quote she would be confronted with. I doubt the OP would follow the motor DIY when they didn't rebuild the air compressor themselves......
The problem with this thread is not the car but the OP to a point. The original poster would have to look extensively and maybe go out of their zip code to find one of those gems where they could get in and drive many happy miles. Plus if she did find one they would be asking for a premium most assuredly but who knows. They have already stated that they would not be willing to pay that premium since it might be too close to the value of their present car.
The other option is to find A GOOD condition 430 that you might have to put a couple of dollars into which I would have no problem doing if it was me. This would mean that you would have to maybe DIY some things which to be honest like striker already said the OP probably is not equipped or willing to do.
I've owned my 460L for 3 years with no problem other than having to replace my heater core but that was because the PO had a leak in the radiator and thought it would be good to put some stop leak in the system. While the 430 earned it's reputation rightfully so I like the analogy that an earlier poster used about our favorite rock star that we would not be willing to pay to go see.
Lastly, what happens if the OP finds that diamond in the rough and then something goes wrong. Most repairs on these cars can cost a lot if you roll up to the dealership or even an Indy. Just saying.... Just because your parents had a good example doesn't mean you will get one especially now that these cars are older.
I'll be the contrarian here and say that good LS430s are out there that don't need extensive repairs - and in fact may be in fantastic condition with many years of life left on them. When I bought my '05 at 109K about 3 years ago it needed nothing at all. Everything worked. No leaks, creaks or wierd noises of any kind. No CELs. Same is true today at 126K. I think these forums are biased in the sense that the members that have issues post about them, but those that do not don't. You don't see people posting threads like "My LS430 went another year without needing a single repair." My car can't be the only one. If you want to find a good LS 430 like I am talking about, probably want to be looking at cars with complete maintenance history, ~ 120 K miles or less, garage kept, non-UL, from a place that does not have salt on the roads.
Be prepared to pay for such a car. $10K + where I live in WA
'05 ML 126K miles
This, everything this guy said. Take your time and buy the best example.
I recently purchased an 05 ML with 70k miles, perfect condition, one owner (older lady), serviced at Lexus every 5k miles. Got it from a Lexus dealer for 13k. 3 hours away in Charleston, SC. Dealer was talking to buyers around the country who wanted it. The interior and exterior are perfect. I have owned several LS models over the years. I am quite confident this car will provide many years of trouble free driving. So they are out there, you just have to be patient and ready to buy as soon as you find the right one.
No car is perfect but if you can find a cream puff LS430 buy it. I have a 2006 LS430 and have owned it since 2009 and personally put 122k miles (of total 135k miles) on it. In 11 years of ownership and 122k miles it had the drivers mirror replaced, and new front shocks (one was leaking), and the LCAs replaced. And that's it other than brake pads, one TB service, usual fluids and filter changes. Everything on the car still operates like new.
I have owned some very nice reliable cars over the years but nothing comes close to the LS430 for reliability and durability.
The only exception, we have had two first gen Toyota Highlander's and they even more bulletproof. In 15 years of owning first gen Highlanders (an 06 limited and then an 07 limited) there have been exactly one repair on the 07 - a new power steering belt was required because old one started squeaking, other than that zero repairs, just normal maintenance.
Looking for a 430 (from 460)
