My new toy has arrived....hehe
Thread Starter
Pole Position
Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 346
Likes: 6
From: Los Angeles, California
My new toy has arrived....hehe
Well...for those of you who what this is, drool on....
This will be run free-air in the rear deck of my LS400. It will not be installed for another couple of months. What do you think. Should I mount it under the rear deck or enlarge the rear deck and drop it in there?
Anton
This will be run free-air in the rear deck of my LS400. It will not be installed for another couple of months. What do you think. Should I mount it under the rear deck or enlarge the rear deck and drop it in there?
Anton
Last edited by SWEETSOUND2001; Feb 16, 2002 at 11:32 PM.
Driver
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 153
Likes: 1
From: New Orleans, LA
Put her in a bandpass box. 
Why wait so long to install it? At least use it in a home audio app. If my memory's functioning after spending the past week and a half drunk from Mardi Gras, Velo's are made for home usage anyway, so that should give you something to hold you off until you put her in the Lex. Yum.
Why wait so long to install it? At least use it in a home audio app. If my memory's functioning after spending the past week and a half drunk from Mardi Gras, Velo's are made for home usage anyway, so that should give you something to hold you off until you put her in the Lex. Yum.
Moderator - Electronics Forum
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 3,985
Likes: 12
From: Illinois
Home usage? Nah. Just get the ones that are made for home. Use the DF10sc for the CAR!!! Second TO NONE for accuracy! Congrats on finding the sub...that's 99 percent of the battle!
Why does the sub pictured have a 9 pin serial port? Looks like it was modded to have a "quick" plug in for the left hand side of the controller box.
Doing some mods on my controller box. Replacing 6 parts, maybe more. The op amps are general purpose 741 based stuff. Slew rates are VERY VERY low, which means it won't act very fast to transients. Dropping in some high end stuff (not surprising) and will let you know how it sounds.
Already modded my C90 and had it's "burn in" time. Absolutely wonderful and it'll blow away a XES Z50 AND the Alpine F#1 Status 7990. Guaranteed and by a WIDE margin. (I've listened to both so I know how they sound)
How soon before you install that bad boy in? YOU'LL LOVE THE BASS.
You should be able to drop it in and you can run it passively off the stock amp (just sub only...be sure to insulate controller wires) until you get a chance to drop in a more powerful amp. That's how I'm running mine right now. Absolutely no time for installations for me...working 3 jobs right now but they're all pretty cool.
Percy
Why does the sub pictured have a 9 pin serial port? Looks like it was modded to have a "quick" plug in for the left hand side of the controller box.
Doing some mods on my controller box. Replacing 6 parts, maybe more. The op amps are general purpose 741 based stuff. Slew rates are VERY VERY low, which means it won't act very fast to transients. Dropping in some high end stuff (not surprising) and will let you know how it sounds.
Already modded my C90 and had it's "burn in" time. Absolutely wonderful and it'll blow away a XES Z50 AND the Alpine F#1 Status 7990. Guaranteed and by a WIDE margin. (I've listened to both so I know how they sound)
How soon before you install that bad boy in? YOU'LL LOVE THE BASS.
You should be able to drop it in and you can run it passively off the stock amp (just sub only...be sure to insulate controller wires) until you get a chance to drop in a more powerful amp. That's how I'm running mine right now. Absolutely no time for installations for me...working 3 jobs right now but they're all pretty cool. Percy
Last edited by Percy; Feb 17, 2002 at 08:21 PM.
Thread Starter
Pole Position
Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 346
Likes: 6
From: Los Angeles, California
Percy, it'll be a while since I have to get all my components together and make time for installation.
Here is the basic layout.
Pioneer DEX-P1r source unit with all active crossovers, variable slopes, time alignment, 13 band eq, auto in-car eq, and much more.
A/D/S 336im coaxial speakers in the stock locations.
Velo running free air in the rear deck.
Two MTX Thunder 8302 amps for the A/D/S set. One amp running tweeters and one running mids.
JL Audio 500/1 monoblock for the sub.
Raam mat throughout the car.
There will be only 3 speakers total in the car with a lot of power behind them. I may also add a second set of A/D/S tweeters in stock tweeter locations to raise soundstage and get better on-axis high freq. response. I may also do 6.5" KEF midbass drivers with maybe Morel tweeters instead of A/D/S. Everything will be time aligned and eq'd.
My main questions are:
What is the best way to secure the subwoofer in the rear deck. I'm going to either bolt it underneath and fire it through the stock 8" opening on a 3/4" mdf baffle or drop it in from the top and figure out to make my rear deck look decent. This subwoofer actually belonged to Rob Hephner himself. He even shipped me two servo controllers with it. One was also modified by Roger Miller at Velodyne but it does not work. I'm going to talk to Roger and see if it can be repaired. How much is your modifications to the servo costing you? What size sub are you running and do you have pictures of the whole thing. Also, there was a thread on sounddomain and a Velodyne owner said that the sub sometimes makes a "Wham!" noise when you hit a bump. He said this was servo correcting for what it thought was distortion. Can you tell me your thoughts on this?
Anton
Here is the basic layout.
Pioneer DEX-P1r source unit with all active crossovers, variable slopes, time alignment, 13 band eq, auto in-car eq, and much more.
A/D/S 336im coaxial speakers in the stock locations.
Velo running free air in the rear deck.
Two MTX Thunder 8302 amps for the A/D/S set. One amp running tweeters and one running mids.
JL Audio 500/1 monoblock for the sub.
Raam mat throughout the car.
There will be only 3 speakers total in the car with a lot of power behind them. I may also add a second set of A/D/S tweeters in stock tweeter locations to raise soundstage and get better on-axis high freq. response. I may also do 6.5" KEF midbass drivers with maybe Morel tweeters instead of A/D/S. Everything will be time aligned and eq'd.
My main questions are:
What is the best way to secure the subwoofer in the rear deck. I'm going to either bolt it underneath and fire it through the stock 8" opening on a 3/4" mdf baffle or drop it in from the top and figure out to make my rear deck look decent. This subwoofer actually belonged to Rob Hephner himself. He even shipped me two servo controllers with it. One was also modified by Roger Miller at Velodyne but it does not work. I'm going to talk to Roger and see if it can be repaired. How much is your modifications to the servo costing you? What size sub are you running and do you have pictures of the whole thing. Also, there was a thread on sounddomain and a Velodyne owner said that the sub sometimes makes a "Wham!" noise when you hit a bump. He said this was servo correcting for what it thought was distortion. Can you tell me your thoughts on this?
Anton
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Moderator - Electronics Forum
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 3,985
Likes: 12
From: Illinois
Anton,
The P1R is one LOADED piece! Basically an all in one package...unfortunately it doesn't make Steak and Eggs for you!
ads 336...sweet! Nice MELLOW and RELAXED sound.
I've never worked on an LS before so I wouldn't know the best way to mount the DF10sc. You can try mounting the sub from the top and hopefully it will just drop in. I'd try that way first. If it doesn't work, try bottom mounting the sub. Last resort is to make a baffle or otherwise to use a sealed or ported box.
Who's Rob Hephner?
What were the modifications done on the other controller box? They're fairly simple to repair if you have the right parts. Mostly off the shelf components WITH the chip numbers on them. Unlike David Navone who FILES OFF all the chip numbers for fear of modification. When someone files off chip numbers...that loses credibility.
Servo mods will probably run into 200 dollars. High speed, top grade parts with the nicely machined and milled sockets. Depending on how nuts I'll get into the project...and if I have time. I still have to revamp my modded MC4000M and MC440M as well as the ENTIRE parametric eq (McIntosh). Thank goodness I used sockets! For those that have the GS Primer book...everything has changed since the writing (or will be changed internally).
I'm using the DF12sc. Pictures used to be on the Clublexus site...but I don't know where they've ended up.
Never had the sub make a "wham" noise. The only noise they're supposed to make is a slight "thump" noise and that's for checking the coil travel during powerup. Also this is for the servo feedback circuitry to tell it where the stop and start points are. Other than that, no wierd noises.
Percy
The P1R is one LOADED piece! Basically an all in one package...unfortunately it doesn't make Steak and Eggs for you!
ads 336...sweet! Nice MELLOW and RELAXED sound.
I've never worked on an LS before so I wouldn't know the best way to mount the DF10sc. You can try mounting the sub from the top and hopefully it will just drop in. I'd try that way first. If it doesn't work, try bottom mounting the sub. Last resort is to make a baffle or otherwise to use a sealed or ported box.
Who's Rob Hephner?
What were the modifications done on the other controller box? They're fairly simple to repair if you have the right parts. Mostly off the shelf components WITH the chip numbers on them. Unlike David Navone who FILES OFF all the chip numbers for fear of modification. When someone files off chip numbers...that loses credibility.
Servo mods will probably run into 200 dollars. High speed, top grade parts with the nicely machined and milled sockets. Depending on how nuts I'll get into the project...and if I have time. I still have to revamp my modded MC4000M and MC440M as well as the ENTIRE parametric eq (McIntosh). Thank goodness I used sockets! For those that have the GS Primer book...everything has changed since the writing (or will be changed internally).
I'm using the DF12sc. Pictures used to be on the Clublexus site...but I don't know where they've ended up.
Never had the sub make a "wham" noise. The only noise they're supposed to make is a slight "thump" noise and that's for checking the coil travel during powerup. Also this is for the servo feedback circuitry to tell it where the stop and start points are. Other than that, no wierd noises.
Percy
Rookie
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 88
Likes: 0
From: Orlando Florida
Sweet sound
I recently got a Velodyne Sub as well !!! I am waiting to put mine in as well. I will be running it with dynaudio front and back.
240MKII and 220MKII. McIntosh MCC446.
Just have to find the time to put it in!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
240MKII and 220MKII. McIntosh MCC446.
Just have to find the time to put it in!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Pole Position
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 231
Likes: 0
From: California
hello,
in my opinion, Velodyne looks very poor..... parts, not very good designs and so on...
can you guys try to explain to me what is so good about velodyne subs? why is it hard to find that sub???
ps> i have found out that their subs are kidda pricey...why?
ps^2> trying to read through their web site, and learn....
www.velodyne.com
thanks.
in my opinion, Velodyne looks very poor..... parts, not very good designs and so on...
can you guys try to explain to me what is so good about velodyne subs? why is it hard to find that sub???
ps> i have found out that their subs are kidda pricey...why?
ps^2> trying to read through their web site, and learn....
www.velodyne.com
thanks.
Last edited by blitz; Feb 23, 2002 at 01:57 PM.
Moderator - Electronics Forum
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 3,985
Likes: 12
From: Illinois
[QUOTE]Originally posted by blitz
[B]hello,
in my opinion, Velodyne looks very poor..... parts, not very good designs and so on...
***It's EASILY one of the best subs both in manufacture and quality. Extreme precision just in the cone alone as it's milled and CNC'd from a solid piece of aluminum. I have YET to see a sub that is made nicer than the Vel. Don't let the pics fool you...it's one hell of a sub, both in precision manufacturing and sound QUALITY. It's not made for sound QUANTITY or SPL.
can you guys try to explain to me what is so good about velodyne subs? why is it hard to find that sub???
***The sub utilizes multiple accelermeters. One is to monitor the motion of the cone and the other is for any motion of the subwoofers frame...such as when the car is moving. Yes, it corrects for the cars movement too...like when going over any speed bumps, potholes or any other wierd surface irregularities. There's an active correction circuit (feedback loop based off of quad comparators) that monitors the cones motion. With ordinary subs (without a REAL active servo controller box) the subwoofers motion will overshoot causing a muddy or boomy sound. EVERY SUB EXCEPT VELODYNE will produce in excess of 10 to 25 percent distortion throughout the operating range - it's just a law of physics. With the Velodyne and it's active controller, it's limited to 1 percent as the controller is physically correcting the sub. Is the difference noticable? YOU BET. Actually, even to the untrained ear, it's HIGHLY noticable.
The only year for production was in 1996. They stopped producing since the sales weren't high enough and people weren't interested in the ULTIMATE SOUND QUALITY from a sub. Most, not all, were interested in a 100 dollar sub than a 1200 dollar sub/servo combo. There have been quite a few reviews on this sub. One is from a large format British magazine entitled "Car Stereo", not to be confused with "Car Stereo Review". Their measurements indicated, literally, a perfect speaker. Less than 1 percent distortion across it's working range (from 15 to 120 hz) while 2nd and 3rd harmonics are extremely low. To reinforce what I said before, NO OTHER SUB IN THE WORLD CAN DO THIS. Also, the British magazine remarked "This subwoofer is TOO GOOD for car audio."
ps> i have found out that their subs are kidda pricey...why?
***It's due to the servo controller, the accelerometers, machining and the extremely low distortion.
ps^2> trying to read through their web site, and learn....
www.velodyne.com
***They took it off the website about a year ago. However, Peter Lufrano at http://www.theautophile.com may still have info on this. They're exceeding rare to find now but if you have one, NOBODY can touch you in terms of sound QUALITY, with the exception of another Velodyne.
Percy
[B]hello,
in my opinion, Velodyne looks very poor..... parts, not very good designs and so on...
***It's EASILY one of the best subs both in manufacture and quality. Extreme precision just in the cone alone as it's milled and CNC'd from a solid piece of aluminum. I have YET to see a sub that is made nicer than the Vel. Don't let the pics fool you...it's one hell of a sub, both in precision manufacturing and sound QUALITY. It's not made for sound QUANTITY or SPL.
can you guys try to explain to me what is so good about velodyne subs? why is it hard to find that sub???
***The sub utilizes multiple accelermeters. One is to monitor the motion of the cone and the other is for any motion of the subwoofers frame...such as when the car is moving. Yes, it corrects for the cars movement too...like when going over any speed bumps, potholes or any other wierd surface irregularities. There's an active correction circuit (feedback loop based off of quad comparators) that monitors the cones motion. With ordinary subs (without a REAL active servo controller box) the subwoofers motion will overshoot causing a muddy or boomy sound. EVERY SUB EXCEPT VELODYNE will produce in excess of 10 to 25 percent distortion throughout the operating range - it's just a law of physics. With the Velodyne and it's active controller, it's limited to 1 percent as the controller is physically correcting the sub. Is the difference noticable? YOU BET. Actually, even to the untrained ear, it's HIGHLY noticable.
The only year for production was in 1996. They stopped producing since the sales weren't high enough and people weren't interested in the ULTIMATE SOUND QUALITY from a sub. Most, not all, were interested in a 100 dollar sub than a 1200 dollar sub/servo combo. There have been quite a few reviews on this sub. One is from a large format British magazine entitled "Car Stereo", not to be confused with "Car Stereo Review". Their measurements indicated, literally, a perfect speaker. Less than 1 percent distortion across it's working range (from 15 to 120 hz) while 2nd and 3rd harmonics are extremely low. To reinforce what I said before, NO OTHER SUB IN THE WORLD CAN DO THIS. Also, the British magazine remarked "This subwoofer is TOO GOOD for car audio."
ps> i have found out that their subs are kidda pricey...why?
***It's due to the servo controller, the accelerometers, machining and the extremely low distortion.
ps^2> trying to read through their web site, and learn....
www.velodyne.com
***They took it off the website about a year ago. However, Peter Lufrano at http://www.theautophile.com may still have info on this. They're exceeding rare to find now but if you have one, NOBODY can touch you in terms of sound QUALITY, with the exception of another Velodyne.
Percy
Lexus Test Driver
Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 7,894
Likes: 3
From: OHIO
Percy,
It sounds like I need to have one of these.
If I can drop this in the rear deck of my GS400 as a free air woofer, that's even better.
I do have a couple questions:
1) What would you recommend as a amp to drive this servo controlled sub?
2) WHERE WOULD I GET ONE?
Thanks Percy
It sounds like I need to have one of these.
If I can drop this in the rear deck of my GS400 as a free air woofer, that's even better.
I do have a couple questions:
1) What would you recommend as a amp to drive this servo controlled sub?
2) WHERE WOULD I GET ONE?
Thanks Percy
Moderator - Electronics Forum
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 3,985
Likes: 12
From: Illinois
GS4fun,
Velodyne recommends an amp of at least 200 watts rms. 300 works out better and leaves more power for the correction circuitry. Recommended amps are Brax, McIntosh, Phoenix Gold, PPI and anything that can put out clean power with NO SUBSONIC FILTER. The amps they tested and REJECTED were ZAPCO and Soundstream. There were a couple of others but I forgot which ones they were.
Availability of these subs are VERY hard to get. They're only found on the used market or if someone just happens to have one and is willing to part with it. You can try contacting Velodyne directly and ask for their parts department. Hopefully they'll have the sub AND controller box in the parts bin. That's all you'll basically need. If you can get both these parts, I can walk you through the installation and tuning instructions.
Percy
Velodyne recommends an amp of at least 200 watts rms. 300 works out better and leaves more power for the correction circuitry. Recommended amps are Brax, McIntosh, Phoenix Gold, PPI and anything that can put out clean power with NO SUBSONIC FILTER. The amps they tested and REJECTED were ZAPCO and Soundstream. There were a couple of others but I forgot which ones they were.
Availability of these subs are VERY hard to get. They're only found on the used market or if someone just happens to have one and is willing to part with it. You can try contacting Velodyne directly and ask for their parts department. Hopefully they'll have the sub AND controller box in the parts bin. That's all you'll basically need. If you can get both these parts, I can walk you through the installation and tuning instructions.
Percy