Would you rather atmospheric, turbo, or hybrid?
Thread Starter
Lead Lap
Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 4,725
Likes: 552
From: Ca
Would you rather atmospheric, turbo, or hybrid?
For the facelifted 3.5IS, and ultimately the next generation 4IS, would you rather:
(1) A newer and more refined atmospheric line up of V6's?
The simplist, quickest and cheapest option.
(2) A new line up of small capacity turbos eg 2.0 four cylinder turbo, 2.5L V6 turbos, and 3.0L V6 turbos?
A moderately simple/complex upgrade, with modest improvements in economy, but potentially huge gains in power, at the expense of reliability - eg in F1 Racing, an engine using 4 times atmospheric pressure can only run for 5 minutes, before it cooks itself and blows up.
Will always have some degree of turbo lag, no matter how small.
Has a "peaky" [not flat] torque curve.
(3) A new range of gasoline-electric hybrids eg 2.0L 4 cylinder hybrid, and 3.0L V6 hybrids etc.
Gasoline-electric hybrids are considerably more expensive in hardware.
There is also up to 200 lbs in weight gain.
Will lose only say 2-3 cubic feet of boot space? Someone please confirm.
Has a truly/genuinely flat torque curve.
Great for stop/start city driving.
Superior fuel economy to turbos? Someone please confirm.
So which option would you rather?
Or would you prefer if Lexus offered all three options in the 3.5IS and 4IS line up???
Even I'm stumped as to which way to go...
(1) A newer and more refined atmospheric line up of V6's?
The simplist, quickest and cheapest option.
(2) A new line up of small capacity turbos eg 2.0 four cylinder turbo, 2.5L V6 turbos, and 3.0L V6 turbos?
A moderately simple/complex upgrade, with modest improvements in economy, but potentially huge gains in power, at the expense of reliability - eg in F1 Racing, an engine using 4 times atmospheric pressure can only run for 5 minutes, before it cooks itself and blows up.
Will always have some degree of turbo lag, no matter how small.
Has a "peaky" [not flat] torque curve.
(3) A new range of gasoline-electric hybrids eg 2.0L 4 cylinder hybrid, and 3.0L V6 hybrids etc.
Gasoline-electric hybrids are considerably more expensive in hardware.
There is also up to 200 lbs in weight gain.
Will lose only say 2-3 cubic feet of boot space? Someone please confirm.
Has a truly/genuinely flat torque curve.
Great for stop/start city driving.
Superior fuel economy to turbos? Someone please confirm.
So which option would you rather?
Or would you prefer if Lexus offered all three options in the 3.5IS and 4IS line up???
Even I'm stumped as to which way to go...
Rookie
Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 96
Likes: 0
From: Switzerland
I would go for the hybrid. But only under the condition that they improve the total response of the system by adding small bank of supercapacitors. This way the electric motor can get an "oveboost" of power for 1-2 seconds until the gas engine revs up and with proper tuning the total power delivery will be instantaneous AND flat.
Also, this way they can use a turbocharged engine and compensate for its lag.
The added weight is only partially a problem since it has the advantage of better weight ballance - 50:50.
In summary, there is a lot of potential in the hybrid tech, but it is not quite there yet.
In general I would take a more responsive powertrain even if it compromises on total power and fuel economy. Hence, I am sticking to my 1st gen Is300.
Thanks for asking
Also, this way they can use a turbocharged engine and compensate for its lag.
The added weight is only partially a problem since it has the advantage of better weight ballance - 50:50.
In summary, there is a lot of potential in the hybrid tech, but it is not quite there yet.
In general I would take a more responsive powertrain even if it compromises on total power and fuel economy. Hence, I am sticking to my 1st gen Is300.
Thanks for asking
Im sure they could squeeze 46mpg out of it somehow. OH YH, they already have with the GS! 340hp wouldnt be too bad either 
Lead Lap
Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 608
Likes: 1
From: SE
Thread Starter
Lead Lap
Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 4,725
Likes: 552
From: Ca
Sounds like everyone here sees more potential in gasoline-electric hybrids than turbos?
I'm beginning to warm to hybrids myself.
I guess Lexus should be brave, and expand their range of hybrids.
Apart from a rip-snortin IS450h powered by a 3.5L V6 hybrid which would do 0-60 in 5 to 6 seconds, they should have an IS350h powered by a 3.0L V6 hybrid which should aim to do the 0-60 in 6 to 7 seconds.
The hybrids have no lag, a genuinely flat torque curve, great city economy, good overall economy, and only a few cubic feet loss in trunk space, and additional pounds.
I guess the only thing holding Lexus back is the "fear" of greater costs from the additional hardware implemented in the hybrids...
I'm beginning to warm to hybrids myself.
I guess Lexus should be brave, and expand their range of hybrids.
Apart from a rip-snortin IS450h powered by a 3.5L V6 hybrid which would do 0-60 in 5 to 6 seconds, they should have an IS350h powered by a 3.0L V6 hybrid which should aim to do the 0-60 in 6 to 7 seconds.
The hybrids have no lag, a genuinely flat torque curve, great city economy, good overall economy, and only a few cubic feet loss in trunk space, and additional pounds.
I guess the only thing holding Lexus back is the "fear" of greater costs from the additional hardware implemented in the hybrids...
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Pole Position
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 2,602
Likes: 89
From: Singapore
I would go for the hybrid. But only under the condition that they improve the total response of the system by adding small bank of supercapacitors. This way the electric motor can get an "oveboost" of power for 1-2 seconds until the gas engine revs up and with proper tuning the total power delivery will be instantaneous AND flat.
Also, this way they can use a turbocharged engine and compensate for its lag.
The added weight is only partially a problem since it has the advantage of better weight ballance - 50:50.
In summary, there is a lot of potential in the hybrid tech, but it is not quite there yet.
In general I would take a more responsive powertrain even if it compromises on total power and fuel economy. Hence, I am sticking to my 1st gen Is300.
Thanks for asking
Also, this way they can use a turbocharged engine and compensate for its lag.
The added weight is only partially a problem since it has the advantage of better weight ballance - 50:50.
In summary, there is a lot of potential in the hybrid tech, but it is not quite there yet.
In general I would take a more responsive powertrain even if it compromises on total power and fuel economy. Hence, I am sticking to my 1st gen Is300.
Thanks for asking
Thread Starter
Lead Lap
Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 4,725
Likes: 552
From: Ca
http://news.drive.com.au/drive/new-c...809-2rlh9.html
I was Googling when I came across this BMW i8 review in an overseas website.
Looks like turbocharged small capacity with hybrid electric is the way to the future, especially if BMW is into it as well.
The BMW i8 is powered by a 1.5L three cylinder turbo hybrid.
Here are the details.
Makes me wanna buy a hybrid now...
BMW i8
Price: $300,000-plus (estimated)
Body: 2 door, 4 seat sports car, carbon fibre body, plug-in hybrid car
Powertrain: 1.5-litre three-cylinder turbo (170kW/320Nm) and electric motor (96kW/250Nm)
Driven wheels: Petrol engine powers the rear wheels, electric motor powers the front wheels
Total power: 266kW
Total torque: 570Nm
Transmission: 6-speed automatic (petrol engine), 2-speed transmission (electric motor)
Weight: 1490kg
0-100km/h: 4.5 seconds (claimed)
Top speed: 250km/h
Fuel use: Less than 2.5L/100km
Electric-only driving range: Less than 35km
Combined range: 500km
I was Googling when I came across this BMW i8 review in an overseas website.
Looks like turbocharged small capacity with hybrid electric is the way to the future, especially if BMW is into it as well.
The BMW i8 is powered by a 1.5L three cylinder turbo hybrid.
Here are the details.
Makes me wanna buy a hybrid now...
BMW i8
Price: $300,000-plus (estimated)
Body: 2 door, 4 seat sports car, carbon fibre body, plug-in hybrid car
Powertrain: 1.5-litre three-cylinder turbo (170kW/320Nm) and electric motor (96kW/250Nm)
Driven wheels: Petrol engine powers the rear wheels, electric motor powers the front wheels
Total power: 266kW
Total torque: 570Nm
Transmission: 6-speed automatic (petrol engine), 2-speed transmission (electric motor)
Weight: 1490kg
0-100km/h: 4.5 seconds (claimed)
Top speed: 250km/h
Fuel use: Less than 2.5L/100km
Electric-only driving range: Less than 35km
Combined range: 500km
Lexus Fanatic
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 20,238
Likes: 274
it doesnt have anything to do with being brave, but people buying them... they are expanding them as it is.
Not many people in US are buying GS450h so probably even less would buy IS450h.
Eventually when they move to lion, we will get extra 10hp-15hp of maximum output.... but to get something like 100hp out of batteries, they would need to be double the size, so it would have to be phev like that Porsche.