linh811

This is just another law that I choose to ignore, at my own risk, whats the big deal?

lobuxracer

iTrader: (2)

If there is no practical reason for no front plate, then it is purely a vanity issue. So far only one person here has agreed, yes, I am vain about my car's appearance, and I will choose to violate the law because of it. Everyone else seems to be in denial. My vanity ends with having the car washed often enough to not damage the paint.

Yes, I have driven a number of dented and dinged cars for years because fixing them was not important enough to me.

BTW, what happens when you have a system of laws that are not obeyed is anarchy. When the majority of people pick and choose the laws they will obey, the system of laws becomes meaningless, and the situation is indistiguishable from anarchy. We are no doubt, on a downward spiral.

This is why they repealed the 55 mph speed limit. Only a few states were even trying to enforce it. If the front plate thing is such a big deal, then get the law changed, or accept that you are willing to break the law for your vanity.

Magellan

You just made me check on my previous posts in this thread to make sure they were not erased.

Sure enough, they’re still there; that's a relief.

So if you just read them, with no obligation to agree of course, I don’t have to repeat what I wrote to answer your question.

zzjkimzz

I was at Aerotect the other day getting my 3M paint protection film installed and they had bumper plugs that fit into the drilled holes for the license plate holder. They were color matched and clear coated and although not as perfect as having a hole-free bumper, it is a great solution. Makes the car look like it has front parking sensors.

OutlawsX

I think Lobuxracer would also disagree with owning a car with Bumper plugs. The point of his posts is that ANY car without front plate is...

1) Driver is vain.
2) Breaking the law.

While totally disregarding the fact that the post from the beginning had nothing stated about "breaking laws", "Vanity", etc etc. It was merely someone saying they want to buy a car a certain way, and if it's possible to have it in the manner they wanted. By using extreme cases to justify his argument of people not having front plates is rather misleading.

Of course Laws are there to protect society, etc etc.. we all know what laws are. But to say that having no front plate is "Not practical" so it must be a law that MUST be followed more strictly... then say driving fast (since that "can" be practical sometimes) is just picking and choosing what to use for his defense on this topic.

Once again some people are not reading clearly on this matter... The original intent of this thread was the person wanted to buy a car without front plate, and does the dealer HAVE to install that front plate. People know it is not allowed in their state. That is the risk they take. I've received speeding tickets before... because I was going over the speed limit.. but I did not receive a No Front Plate ticket. If it was such a HARSH crime to not have front plate, I wonder why the police didn't cite me up for that.

GNN60GT500

I agree completely and that is my biggest problem with the arguments being made-

zzjkimzz

Right, I'm all about abiding by the law...heck...I'm in Law Enforcement, so in order to enforce the standard I gotta abide by it.

As soon as my front plates arrive, they're going on. But my previous post was just for those that didn't want to advertise dealer logo plates but also don't want two ugly holes in their bumper, the plugs worked out great for me.

lobuxracer

iTrader: (2)

This isn't correct at all. My point is there is no practical reason to violate this law, so the only reason to violate it is to satisfy an internal need for appearance. I used the words vain and vanity to describe this behaviour.

I never suggested that I believe this law should be enforced any more than any other law. I replied to OutlawX and my reply was misconstrued to mean I support this law somehow more than others, that I think vanity is wrong, and a bunch of other completely unrelated issues.

If you read the whole thread, I didn't make any comments at all about supporting or not supporting the legal issues. My first post pointed to the law and indicated there is a way around having the bumper drilled and the plate installed. My second post did exactly the same - showed what you must do to comply with the law. Either the dealer provides the necessary hardware, OR you sign an acknowledgment to indemnify the dealership should you claim ignorance if you are cited for no front plate. I made no value judgment until I said I am amazed there are people who would choose to violate the law for their vanity, which is the same thing I posted in the thread about needing help getting out of a missing front plate ticket in California. End of story.

All the rest of the arguments are attempts to justify or downplay the vanity issue or explain to me there are other ways to attach a plate and how wrong I am for assuming the plate won't be installed. I've even asked if there is any other practical reason to go plateless, and got no reply. So, after all the tangents and all the other impractical discussions, my opinion remains my opinion. I'm really sorry if your sensibilities are offended, but we'll have to agree to disagree on that.

OutlawsX

Vanity.. it always goes back to that. The argument will then go back to why own a Lexus then? Why not a more affordable Toyota? Why do you have to be flashy? Why do people want to have large homes? Why dress nice? Why must people strive to make more money?

We'll put it in terms you may want to understand. If you ordered a Blue Onyx Pearl car, and you received a Black Pearl car, would you accept it? It's not like there is any practical reason behind it. That is the topic we are discussing in this thread.

You are using the defense that it's breaking the law as a supplement to this topic.

Magellan

This thread is certainly interesting. It started off as a discussion on whether the dealers had a legal obligation or not to drill the holes or install front plate brackets on the cars they deliver. When it evolved into the prospect that the car owners were the ones breaking the law, then –hold on here, we don’t want to discuss that!

lobuxracer

iTrader: (2)

OutlawsX - Still wrong. Still trying to change the subject, still not getting it because you are so incensed by the connotations assigned to vanity. I'm done, you won't understand what I am saying in any case.

To gsrthomas, the OP - my apologies for running this thread so far off track. My intent was to provide you the text of the law so you could call Longo and tell Elise you will sign the document acknowledging you must run a front plate and have them deliver the car undrilled as you requested. More often than not, if you know the law and can provide it to the dealership they will comply with your wishes. Someone got upset by my comment about vanity and it has gone WAY out into left field with no real hope of return. I do not consider myself any better than anyone else here, and I am not making disparaging comments about your choice to have an undrilled bumper. I'm glad they figured out you have a right to receive the car without holes in the bumper, and no one has to break the law to do it.

Domo-Kun

Ah, you assume too much. No one starts off by saying "I hate this dealer" without any reason. My sales experience with Tustin Lexus was fine however the service experience left a lot to be desired. In regards to Longo, the sales and service experiences had quite a few shortcomings.

My poor experiences with Tustin are long and well documented in my warranty repair work orders. They are quite incompetent. . .And yes I did vote with my feet and pocketbook, by not doing business with them after their repeated failures to replace a simple defective radio headunit (I won't go into the full details but try 5 headunits plus 2 entire dashboards on a IS because the "idiots", yes idiots, damaged the dash surroundings while replacing the headunit, plus their "master tech" spilled his tomato sauce from his pasta on the front seat of my IS. Apparently, he needed to "road test" the radio performance via going for a lunch run in my IS).

I don't take an adversarial approach to everyone. This is you assuming somehow that anyone who rants about a poor dealer experience is somehow obviously at fault because of their "attitude." Why would you want to muzzle someone who is expressing their discontent with their experience?

You may have had a fabulous experience with your dealers, however I did not with these two dealers. This is not to say that all Lexus dealer are like this. That is the farthest thing from the truth, hence why it is worth mentioning, because it not the norm.

In regards to the FICO issue, I don't know what your dealers in Texas do, however here in California, regardless of whether you pay by cash (i.e. check, cashier's check, etc.) or finance, the dealer's F&I dept is going to run your credit. As I said in my original post, sometimes I will finance a portion of my vehicle purchase, for example the RX330 had an attractive rate of 4.1% so I put half down and financed the rest through Lexus Financial (Toyota Motor Credit).

What I am pissed off at is the fact of their practice of a total of 5 inquiries per transaction. I have financed vehicles through other dealers and at most (this is from actual data on my purchases, not some figure people pull out of their ***) 1-2 inquiries. For example, some of my transactions:

Purchased a 01 IS300 from Tustin Lexus, paid cash: 1 inquiry through experian.

Purchased a 05 350Z from Garden Grove Nissan, paid cash: 1 inquiry through Transamerica.

Purchased a 05 RX330 from Longo Lexus, financed $20K, put down $21K: 5 inquiries between them and TMC.

Purchased a 06 STI from Renick Subaru, financed $15K, put down $20K, 1 inquiry to Transamerica from Renick and one inquiry to Experian from Subaru Finance (which is essentially Chase).

Purchased a 06 Mazda 3 hatch as a "loss leader" (which means an ad car from the newspaper, where they say 'one at this price') from Long Beach Mazda, financed the entire amount at 1.9% over 24 months of $16K: 1 inquiry to Experian from Long Beach Mazda, and 1 inquiry to their financing co.

Purchased a 06 Toyota Tacoma Doublecab TRD from Power Toyota in Cerritos: Paid Cash: 1 inquiry to Experian only.

So your right it is their option to check as many credit bureaus as they want, however it is my option to not do business with them. With any dealer, the first thing I do now is speak to their F&I guy first before I talk to sales to see if how many credit bureaus they check for a purchase.

Longo simply has an attitude of "we're huge so if you don't like our practices, go F-yourselves". Which is fine, there are enough misguided folks who will drink their cool-aid or not know any better. However, I am sharing my experiences with others who may have not had such a good experience with them or gotten the runaround from them.

Your experiences my vary wildly with them and may have had a fabulous time with them, that's great. Every buying and service experience should be great, however a lot of times they are not.


Sorry for taking this sooo off topic. Good luck with the plate issue.