Did anyone consider BMW, MB or Audi?
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Rookie
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 95
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From: ca
Did anyone consider BMW, MB or Audi?
I ask this because my wife and I did. We checked out the BMW, MB E Class and the Audi A6. I see several posts about comparing the M35/45 and Acura but I didn't see any posts about the other brands mentioned. Maybe there are some earlier in the archives.
We decided the 06 GS is best for us.
This car will mostly be for my wife. She has a BMW5 now and did not want another one. She liked the Audi A6. It was a little harsh but she liked it. Heard history of poor reliability so passed. Liked the looks and ride of the MB E500 but also concerned about poor quality and repairs.
New GS seems to have more luxury appointments and probably a better ride. We will test drive next week. Better reliability we assume based on Lexus track record. We know the arguments about the prestige of the german cars but we are not concerend with that.
As far as pricing, if the new GS goes for MSRP, the discounted price for the 2005 MB E500 and loaded GS430 will be similar. That was kind of a surprise since the LS430 is so much less than the MB S500.
Nonetheless, we are pretty excited about the new GS.
Anyway, thought I would share and was curious about your experience.
We decided the 06 GS is best for us.
This car will mostly be for my wife. She has a BMW5 now and did not want another one. She liked the Audi A6. It was a little harsh but she liked it. Heard history of poor reliability so passed. Liked the looks and ride of the MB E500 but also concerned about poor quality and repairs.
New GS seems to have more luxury appointments and probably a better ride. We will test drive next week. Better reliability we assume based on Lexus track record. We know the arguments about the prestige of the german cars but we are not concerend with that.
As far as pricing, if the new GS goes for MSRP, the discounted price for the 2005 MB E500 and loaded GS430 will be similar. That was kind of a surprise since the LS430 is so much less than the MB S500.
Nonetheless, we are pretty excited about the new GS.
Anyway, thought I would share and was curious about your experience.
Lexus Test Driver
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 1,218
Likes: 11
From: MD
Good Choice
I am somewhat biased in my opinion. I worked for Mercedes for about 6 years and was factory trained. We were very proud of the engineering and safety of the cars in those days. The production quality was second to none. I remember when the first Lexus came out and 4 of us went out and test drove the LS. Our top salesperson said: This car is going to kill Cadillac. We didn't feel threatened at all because it was very soft in the suspension and kind of floated. It was very quiet and we were flattered that it was a good copy of an "S" (Saunder) Class in shape. The amazing thing to us was that it was cheaper than a 300E (Einspritzepumper).
Fast forward to 2005.... Lexus now schools both the Germans in quality, performance and sales.
Mercedes is now 28th in reliability. Both BMW and Mercedes have computer system problems in their cars. As a matter of fact the more expensive the model the less reliable it is. An independent Co. that did service visit research found that 3 out of 4 service visits were for repairs and one for maintenance. At Lexus it was 2 for repair and 2 for maintenance. These statistics were taken before the more recent software and hardware issues surfaced. The head of the Bosch unit that supplied the computers to Mercedes was fired because he almost lost the Mercedes account on his watch. Who can figure out all of the permutations on the BMW I-Drive ****? They are back pedalling now and trying to make it easier than six steps to change your radio station and volume. They also just jettisoned the Bangle Butt look.
The 5 series and E-Class represent about 60% of the Lux Sport Sedan market but Lexus has now focused their gaze and R&D on that segment. Lexus represents the future. The Germans still have style but the substance is wearing thin....
Fast forward to 2005.... Lexus now schools both the Germans in quality, performance and sales.
Mercedes is now 28th in reliability. Both BMW and Mercedes have computer system problems in their cars. As a matter of fact the more expensive the model the less reliable it is. An independent Co. that did service visit research found that 3 out of 4 service visits were for repairs and one for maintenance. At Lexus it was 2 for repair and 2 for maintenance. These statistics were taken before the more recent software and hardware issues surfaced. The head of the Bosch unit that supplied the computers to Mercedes was fired because he almost lost the Mercedes account on his watch. Who can figure out all of the permutations on the BMW I-Drive ****? They are back pedalling now and trying to make it easier than six steps to change your radio station and volume. They also just jettisoned the Bangle Butt look.
The 5 series and E-Class represent about 60% of the Lux Sport Sedan market but Lexus has now focused their gaze and R&D on that segment. Lexus represents the future. The Germans still have style but the substance is wearing thin....
Last edited by Rockville; Feb 8, 2005 at 07:30 PM.
Thread Starter
Rookie
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 95
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From: ca
Great insight...
I appreciate you sharing your earlier MB and later Lexus experience.
I also read your earlier posts. Although I am new to this forum it is clear that you bring quite a bit to this discussion.
With Liz in the west and you out east we should all benefit a great deal!
P.S. A friend of mine, who is german and an engineer, back in 1990 I think was ready to reward himself with a brand new MB but decided he would look, just look, at the new Lexus LS400. He looked under the car and at the engine and couldn't believe it. He bought the Lexus
We were all so surprised. Since then both he and his wife only buy Lexus....
I also read your earlier posts. Although I am new to this forum it is clear that you bring quite a bit to this discussion.
With Liz in the west and you out east we should all benefit a great deal!
P.S. A friend of mine, who is german and an engineer, back in 1990 I think was ready to reward himself with a brand new MB but decided he would look, just look, at the new Lexus LS400. He looked under the car and at the engine and couldn't believe it. He bought the Lexus
We were all so surprised. Since then both he and his wife only buy Lexus....
Pole Position
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 358
Likes: 2
my search was the E class/5 series/RL/GS
my gf's bro bought an e500 and right when he drove it off the lot it smoked up and the engine shut off....so that made my decision easy
then the 5....my gf's other brother had a 5 that died on the freeway, plus i-drive my crazy, no blue tooth, crappy navy, horribly reliability made taht decision easy
then RL, i have drove acuras my entire life so i really wanted the RL, and all it's gizmos (traffic, etc) but the sucker drove like the tank ( i test drove it twice), and nobody on the RL boards could justify me spending 50k for the car, they kept on saying "if you are asking this question, u shouldn't be purchasing a 50k car blah blah" Also, there's only like 5 people on that board who owns the car, and 2 of them had tranny failures already...
i was about to make a purchase on a TL during xmas (2.9% financing) luckily i heard the GS was coming out looking into it and it had everything i wanted from a gizmo standpoint (dvd-a, bluetooth, keyless start, rearsunshade, etc..) along w/ brand name and it's made in japan really made my decision easy.
my gf's bro bought an e500 and right when he drove it off the lot it smoked up and the engine shut off....so that made my decision easy
then the 5....my gf's other brother had a 5 that died on the freeway, plus i-drive my crazy, no blue tooth, crappy navy, horribly reliability made taht decision easy
then RL, i have drove acuras my entire life so i really wanted the RL, and all it's gizmos (traffic, etc) but the sucker drove like the tank ( i test drove it twice), and nobody on the RL boards could justify me spending 50k for the car, they kept on saying "if you are asking this question, u shouldn't be purchasing a 50k car blah blah" Also, there's only like 5 people on that board who owns the car, and 2 of them had tranny failures already...
i was about to make a purchase on a TL during xmas (2.9% financing) luckily i heard the GS was coming out looking into it and it had everything i wanted from a gizmo standpoint (dvd-a, bluetooth, keyless start, rearsunshade, etc..) along w/ brand name and it's made in japan really made my decision easy.
Lexus Champion
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 1,832
Likes: 0
From: California
I went to LA auto show and saw all vehicles in this mid-luxury sports sedan class. Of course I could only give comments based on looks, both outside and inside. In my opinion this class of car is the best looking class of all sedans, even better than near-luxury ones(TL, G35 sedan, 3-series sedan, IS300 etc). Anyways, I say the Japanese finally has caught up with the German. Based on my memory I put them in the following order, one being the best looking and so on.
Exterior styling:
1. BMW 5-series
2. Infiniti M-series
3. Mercedes-Benz E-class
4. Acura RL
4. Lexus GS-series
6. Audi A6
7. Cadillac STS
8. Jaguar X-TYPE
Interior styling(with Navi screen)
1. Mercedes-Benz E-class
2. Lexus GS-series
3. Acura RL
4. Audi A6
5. Infiniti M-series
6. Cadillac STS
7. BMW 5-series
8. Jaguar X-TYPE
Although I don't know which one I like the best, they are just too good, I know which one to neglect, and they are Jaguar, Cadillac, and Audi. The other five are incredibly well-designed and well-build.
Exterior styling:
1. BMW 5-series
2. Infiniti M-series
3. Mercedes-Benz E-class
4. Acura RL
4. Lexus GS-series
6. Audi A6
7. Cadillac STS
8. Jaguar X-TYPE
Interior styling(with Navi screen)
1. Mercedes-Benz E-class
2. Lexus GS-series
3. Acura RL
4. Audi A6
5. Infiniti M-series
6. Cadillac STS
7. BMW 5-series
8. Jaguar X-TYPE
Although I don't know which one I like the best, they are just too good, I know which one to neglect, and they are Jaguar, Cadillac, and Audi. The other five are incredibly well-designed and well-build.
EV ftw!!!
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 9,045
Likes: 613
From: Lake Ontario
Originally Posted by Rockville
I am somewhat biased in my opinion. I worked for Mercedes for about 6 years and was factory trained. We were very proud of the engineering and safety of the cars in those days. The production quality was second to none. I remember when the first Lexus came out and 4 of us went out and test drove the LS. Our top salesperson said: This car is going to kill Cadillac. We didn't feel threatened at all because it was very soft in the suspension and kind of floated. It was very quiet and we were flattered that it was a good copy of an "S" (Saunder) Class in shape. The amazing thing to us was that it was cheaper than a 300E (Einspritzepumper).
Fast forward to 2005.... Lexus now schools both the Germans in quality, performance and sales.
Mercedes is now 27th in reliability. Both BMW and Mercedes have computer system problems in their cars. As a matter of fact the more expensive the model the less reliable it is. An independent Co. that did service visit research found that 3 out of 4 service visits were for repairs and one for maintenance. At Lexus it was 2 for repair and 2 for maintenance. These statistics were taken before the more recent software and hardware issues surfaced. The head of the Bosch unit that supplied the computers to Mercedes was fired because he almost lost the Mercedes account on his watch. Who can figure out all of the permutations on the BMW I-Drive ****? They are back pedalling now and trying to make it easier than six steps to change your radio station and volume. They also just jettisoned the Bangle Butt look.
The 5 series and E-Class represent about 60% of the Lux Sport Sedan market but Lexus has now focused their gaze and R&D on that segment. Lexus represents the future. The Germans still have style but the substance is wearing thin....
Fast forward to 2005.... Lexus now schools both the Germans in quality, performance and sales.
Mercedes is now 27th in reliability. Both BMW and Mercedes have computer system problems in their cars. As a matter of fact the more expensive the model the less reliable it is. An independent Co. that did service visit research found that 3 out of 4 service visits were for repairs and one for maintenance. At Lexus it was 2 for repair and 2 for maintenance. These statistics were taken before the more recent software and hardware issues surfaced. The head of the Bosch unit that supplied the computers to Mercedes was fired because he almost lost the Mercedes account on his watch. Who can figure out all of the permutations on the BMW I-Drive ****? They are back pedalling now and trying to make it easier than six steps to change your radio station and volume. They also just jettisoned the Bangle Butt look.
The 5 series and E-Class represent about 60% of the Lux Sport Sedan market but Lexus has now focused their gaze and R&D on that segment. Lexus represents the future. The Germans still have style but the substance is wearing thin....
It takes courage for a lot of people that stood behind MB to admit that MB are having issues. MB still has a stellar history and their designs are just incredible - the current E-class, the SL, the amazing CLS etc. It just goes on.
I am sure that over the next 10 years the history of MB will be very interesting. I personally believe no car maker will ignore the fact that they have reliability problems forever. I am sure MB will be back in the game and have the legendary reliability they once had!
I had a 96 E320 (I bought it in 2000) and kept it for 2 years and then traded it on a 99 GS400 (it was also just about 4 years old). I am still amazed at the quality of my 99 GS compared to the MB.
I really wanted a 01 E55 AMG but could not afford one. I would still like to get an E class AMG even if it has reliability issues. Those are great cars.For now, my 99 GS has a much better and more expensive feel to it compared to a new M5! I sat in the latest M5 at the Detriot Auto show two weekends ago and was shocked to see how cheap the interior felt for a car that will be at least $80K.
Way to go Lexus!I personally would not buy the 3rd gen GS simply because I cannot stand the exterior styling. But then that is just me. Kudos to the rest of you that like it!
The technology is amazing though and I am sure it will do well in sales!
Former Sponsor
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 13,001
Likes: 1
From: D2'sville
Originally Posted by Hameed
Nice write-up!
It takes courage for a lot of people that stood behind MB to admit that MB are having issues. MB still has a stellar history and their designs are just incredible - the current E-class, the SL, the amazing CLS etc. It just goes on.
I am sure that over the next 10 years the history of MB will be very interesting. I personally believe no car maker will ignore the fact that they have reliability problems forever. I am sure MB will be back in the game and have the legendary reliability they once had!
It takes courage for a lot of people that stood behind MB to admit that MB are having issues. MB still has a stellar history and their designs are just incredible - the current E-class, the SL, the amazing CLS etc. It just goes on.
I am sure that over the next 10 years the history of MB will be very interesting. I personally believe no car maker will ignore the fact that they have reliability problems forever. I am sure MB will be back in the game and have the legendary reliability they once had!
Flash Forward to today where the vehicles have become so burdened with complex electronics that MB is beginning to take systems OUT, (I believe the brake by wire is coming out first), and its a different story.
I have said time and time again, if the Germans would simply farm out the design + R&D of thier electronics to the Japanese, they would be unstoppable!!! Imagine the speed, looks, and cache of a S55, along with the reliability of a GS!!!
Before my GS400 purchase I went back and forth (and back and forth and back and forth) over the E430, 540i and GS400. Its obvious what I decided, the GS was just the best all around (plus Lexus has the best forum too
)
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Lexus Test Driver
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 1,423
Likes: 0
From: CA
I still can't decide between the New GS and the BMW.
Refer to the thread I started below:
https://www.clublexus.com/forums/sho...d.php?t=146996
The new 6 Cylinder BMW Enginers with additional HP are ready to order very soon with June Production, so the 530 should get the extra HP now that they need and we all know how great these 6 Cylinder BMW engines are.
I am waiting to drive the new GS of course to make my new decision, but my expectations aren't so high, since how can you compare the new GS against a 530 / 545i with Sports Package (sport tuned suspension, upgraded rims, high performance staggered size tires).
We shall see.
Also a proported 550i with the upgraded V8 is supposed to arrive later this year.
Refer to the thread I started below:
https://www.clublexus.com/forums/sho...d.php?t=146996
The new 6 Cylinder BMW Enginers with additional HP are ready to order very soon with June Production, so the 530 should get the extra HP now that they need and we all know how great these 6 Cylinder BMW engines are.
I am waiting to drive the new GS of course to make my new decision, but my expectations aren't so high, since how can you compare the new GS against a 530 / 545i with Sports Package (sport tuned suspension, upgraded rims, high performance staggered size tires).
We shall see.
Also a proported 550i with the upgraded V8 is supposed to arrive later this year.
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Lead Lap
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 477
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From: California
at about 1990 MB was unbeatable in terms of quality and reliability.. they kicked the crap out of every other maker out there, bar none!
as far as current cars go... in all honesty i would personally consider the BMW 5 series for pure driving fun, handling, and agility. the only thing that does make me hesitate is reliability and quality of the interior... BMW seems to make rather cheap interiors for their status...the GS is great, but it honestly cant match the 5 in the twisties... as far as refinement, the GS easily wins, and unless u have a ton of money to blow, the MB E class is out of the question because of quality control issues. IMO it is the best looking car in its class. the infiniti M IMO better looking than the new GS.. with more power as well.. it will be close between these two but the GS has the edge on interior refinement.
as far as current cars go... in all honesty i would personally consider the BMW 5 series for pure driving fun, handling, and agility. the only thing that does make me hesitate is reliability and quality of the interior... BMW seems to make rather cheap interiors for their status...the GS is great, but it honestly cant match the 5 in the twisties... as far as refinement, the GS easily wins, and unless u have a ton of money to blow, the MB E class is out of the question because of quality control issues. IMO it is the best looking car in its class. the infiniti M IMO better looking than the new GS.. with more power as well.. it will be close between these two but the GS has the edge on interior refinement.
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Posts: n/a
Originally Posted by azmike
I ask this because my wife and I did. We checked out the BMW, MB E Class and the Audi A6. I see several posts about comparing the M35/45 and Acura but I didn't see any posts about the other brands mentioned. Maybe there are some earlier in the archives.
We decided the 06 GS is best for us.
This car will mostly be for my wife. She has a BMW5 now and did not want another one. She liked the Audi A6. It was a little harsh but she liked it. Heard history of poor reliability so passed. Liked the looks and ride of the MB E500 but also concerned about poor quality and repairs.
New GS seems to have more luxury appointments and probably a better ride. We will test drive next week. Better reliability we assume based on Lexus track record. We know the arguments about the prestige of the german cars but we are not concerend with that.
As far as pricing, if the new GS goes for MSRP, the discounted price for the 2005 MB E500 and loaded GS430 will be similar. That was kind of a surprise since the LS430 is so much less than the MB S500.
Nonetheless, we are pretty excited about the new GS.
Anyway, thought I would share and was curious about your experience.
We decided the 06 GS is best for us.
This car will mostly be for my wife. She has a BMW5 now and did not want another one. She liked the Audi A6. It was a little harsh but she liked it. Heard history of poor reliability so passed. Liked the looks and ride of the MB E500 but also concerned about poor quality and repairs.
New GS seems to have more luxury appointments and probably a better ride. We will test drive next week. Better reliability we assume based on Lexus track record. We know the arguments about the prestige of the german cars but we are not concerend with that.
As far as pricing, if the new GS goes for MSRP, the discounted price for the 2005 MB E500 and loaded GS430 will be similar. That was kind of a surprise since the LS430 is so much less than the MB S500.
Nonetheless, we are pretty excited about the new GS.
Anyway, thought I would share and was curious about your experience.
This is a very good question and one we might have overlooked some. I guess we were eager to compare the new Japanese competition (M35/45, Acura RL) and forgot about Lexus true competiton, BMW and Benz.
I'll post a comparison post later tonight.
Lexus Test Driver
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 1,218
Likes: 11
From: MD
MBZ E500 vs. GS430
It is hard for me to compare a car I haven't driven but I can supply some comparisons.
MB E500 !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! GS430
Looks like other MB models >>>>>>>>>Unique style until little brother IS350 is born
17's std. 18's dealer installed only ******18" 5 spoke with low profile lg. diameter Z's std.
No run flats >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Run Flats in the East std.
Keyless Go optional ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ Smart Access standard
Optional trunk closer~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Std trunk closer std.
1 1/2 inch less legroom>>>>>>>>>>> at the driver position
6 disc CD Chgr. Optional~~~~~~~~~~~~ 6CD changer std indash
no cassette >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>books on tape OK
no bluetooth>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Navigation/ levinson has bluetooth and back
******************************************* up camera and 330 killer WATTS of POWER, DVD
5 liter SOHC 24 valve V8 ~~~~~~~~~~~ 4.3 liter DOHC 32 Valve with VVTi
302 HP 339 lb/ft torque~~~~~~~~~~~~``300 HP 325 lb/ft torque
5.9 seconds to 60 ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ 5.7 seconds to 60 (We win, we win, we....)
ESP<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< Proprietary VDIM
Optional HID and steerable H/L~~~~~~ STD. HID and AFS
N/A ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~` Rain repellant front window glass
N/A ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~`` Tire pressure monitoring std.
Parktronic~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~`next gen. intuitive parking assist
N/A on 500 though MB makes one ~~~~ Pre Collision System
#28 in JD Powers veh. reliability ~~~~~~ We're number one,
#10 in Initial Quality Survey~~~~~~~~~~~We're number one,
#7 APEAL Study~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ We're number one.
Pricey ~~~~~$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$~~~Ditto yet you get what you pay for.
I read a funny line on one of the threads the other day that said German horsepower was stronger than Japanese horsepower. Let's see.... the GS with the off the shelf 4.3 liter and new
6 speed auto just beats every German nameplate up to 60 so what is all this noise about horsepower wars? There are only two manufacturers that make their own Formula engines, Ferrari and Toyota. That's it, good bye..
MB E500 !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! GS430
Looks like other MB models >>>>>>>>>Unique style until little brother IS350 is born
17's std. 18's dealer installed only ******18" 5 spoke with low profile lg. diameter Z's std.
No run flats >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Run Flats in the East std.
Keyless Go optional ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ Smart Access standard
Optional trunk closer~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Std trunk closer std.
1 1/2 inch less legroom>>>>>>>>>>> at the driver position
6 disc CD Chgr. Optional~~~~~~~~~~~~ 6CD changer std indash
no cassette >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>books on tape OK
no bluetooth>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Navigation/ levinson has bluetooth and back
******************************************* up camera and 330 killer WATTS of POWER, DVD
5 liter SOHC 24 valve V8 ~~~~~~~~~~~ 4.3 liter DOHC 32 Valve with VVTi
302 HP 339 lb/ft torque~~~~~~~~~~~~``300 HP 325 lb/ft torque
5.9 seconds to 60 ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ 5.7 seconds to 60 (We win, we win, we....)
ESP<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< Proprietary VDIM
Optional HID and steerable H/L~~~~~~ STD. HID and AFS
N/A ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~` Rain repellant front window glass
N/A ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~`` Tire pressure monitoring std.
Parktronic~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~`next gen. intuitive parking assist
N/A on 500 though MB makes one ~~~~ Pre Collision System
#28 in JD Powers veh. reliability ~~~~~~ We're number one,
#10 in Initial Quality Survey~~~~~~~~~~~We're number one,
#7 APEAL Study~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ We're number one.
Pricey ~~~~~$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$~~~Ditto yet you get what you pay for.
I read a funny line on one of the threads the other day that said German horsepower was stronger than Japanese horsepower. Let's see.... the GS with the off the shelf 4.3 liter and new
6 speed auto just beats every German nameplate up to 60 so what is all this noise about horsepower wars? There are only two manufacturers that make their own Formula engines, Ferrari and Toyota. That's it, good bye..
Last edited by Rockville; Feb 9, 2005 at 04:57 AM.
Thread Starter
Rookie
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 95
Likes: 1
From: ca
Originally Posted by Rockville
There are only two manufacturers that make their own Formula engines, Ferrari and Toyota. That's it, good bye..
Lexus Test Driver
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 1,423
Likes: 0
From: CA
Rockville,
Do a comparison against the BMW 545i, which is what Lexus was shooting for in the new GS as mentioned in several reviews. The BWM 545i with a sports package is an incredible car (my brother has one).
As much as I love Lexus and continue to own them, I have to keep an open mind on what else is out there and of course it's all a preference. I am now in the market for a GS / BMW 5 Series / Audi A6, but since I own both a Lexus and BMW, I am not so hyped yet into jumping all over the new GS when they arrive very soon. Especially if I am looking at the GS300 AWD and not the awesome GS430. I have to wait to drive the new BMW 5 series with the new 6 Cylinder engine and Xdrive / AWD to make my final decision between the 2 (the Audi is now out).
Even so the new GS is a great step into revamping this car and it looks great, but the competition is so keen out there, that for a $50K+ GS300 AWD, you have no choice but to look at the other alternatives to see if they are worth spending more (the BMW will always be higher in price).
Do a comparison against the BMW 545i, which is what Lexus was shooting for in the new GS as mentioned in several reviews. The BWM 545i with a sports package is an incredible car (my brother has one).
As much as I love Lexus and continue to own them, I have to keep an open mind on what else is out there and of course it's all a preference. I am now in the market for a GS / BMW 5 Series / Audi A6, but since I own both a Lexus and BMW, I am not so hyped yet into jumping all over the new GS when they arrive very soon. Especially if I am looking at the GS300 AWD and not the awesome GS430. I have to wait to drive the new BMW 5 series with the new 6 Cylinder engine and Xdrive / AWD to make my final decision between the 2 (the Audi is now out).
Even so the new GS is a great step into revamping this car and it looks great, but the competition is so keen out there, that for a $50K+ GS300 AWD, you have no choice but to look at the other alternatives to see if they are worth spending more (the BMW will always be higher in price).
Thread Starter
Rookie
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 95
Likes: 1
From: ca
[QUOTE=lexguynj](the Audi is now out).
QUOTE]
The Audi A6 hung in there awhile for us but is also now out. Liked the idea that is wasn't as common (at least around here) as the MB's, BMW's and Lexus's. Also, liked the interior, the ride (although some say too firm), fold-down rear seat, AWD,free scheduled maintenance, choice of XM or Sirrius sat. radio and more intuitive MMI system (better than I-drive--but still would prefer NO "mouse" type system).
Did not like history of poor reliability (although many say now much improved)
Did not like the fact that the depreciation is worse than BMW, MB or Lexus.
(**due to worse residuals a $50K Audi would have lease payments of $150-200 more per month than a $57K Lexus)
Didn't like manual only (on 3.2 V6) steering wheel adjust/tilt. Really surprised not power.
Did not like no in-dash 6 CD player (in glove box)
QUOTE]
The Audi A6 hung in there awhile for us but is also now out. Liked the idea that is wasn't as common (at least around here) as the MB's, BMW's and Lexus's. Also, liked the interior, the ride (although some say too firm), fold-down rear seat, AWD,free scheduled maintenance, choice of XM or Sirrius sat. radio and more intuitive MMI system (better than I-drive--but still would prefer NO "mouse" type system).
Did not like history of poor reliability (although many say now much improved)
Did not like the fact that the depreciation is worse than BMW, MB or Lexus.
(**due to worse residuals a $50K Audi would have lease payments of $150-200 more per month than a $57K Lexus)
Didn't like manual only (on 3.2 V6) steering wheel adjust/tilt. Really surprised not power.
Did not like no in-dash 6 CD player (in glove box)
Lexus Test Driver
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 1,423
Likes: 0
From: CA
[QUOTE=azmike]
Hey AZMIKE, which vehicle are you leaning towards now? I still can't decide and mostly because I have not had the chance to test drive the new GS or the new 5 series with the upgraded engine. It's going to be a tough decision!
Originally Posted by lexguynj
(the Audi is now out).
QUOTE]
The Audi A6 hung in there awhile for us but is also now out. Liked the idea that is wasn't as common (at least around here) as the MB's, BMW's and Lexus's. Also, liked the interior, the ride (although some say too firm), fold-down rear seat, AWD,free scheduled maintenance, choice of XM or Sirrius sat. radio and more intuitive MMI system (better than I-drive--but still would prefer NO "mouse" type system).
Did not like history of poor reliability (although many say now much improved)
Did not like the fact that the depreciation is worse than BMW, MB or Lexus.
(**due to worse residuals a $50K Audi would have lease payments of $150-200 more per month than a $57K Lexus)
Didn't like manual only (on 3.2 V6) steering wheel adjust/tilt. Really surprised not power.
Did not like no in-dash 6 CD player (in glove box)
QUOTE]
The Audi A6 hung in there awhile for us but is also now out. Liked the idea that is wasn't as common (at least around here) as the MB's, BMW's and Lexus's. Also, liked the interior, the ride (although some say too firm), fold-down rear seat, AWD,free scheduled maintenance, choice of XM or Sirrius sat. radio and more intuitive MMI system (better than I-drive--but still would prefer NO "mouse" type system).
Did not like history of poor reliability (although many say now much improved)
Did not like the fact that the depreciation is worse than BMW, MB or Lexus.
(**due to worse residuals a $50K Audi would have lease payments of $150-200 more per month than a $57K Lexus)
Didn't like manual only (on 3.2 V6) steering wheel adjust/tilt. Really surprised not power.
Did not like no in-dash 6 CD player (in glove box)
Hey AZMIKE, which vehicle are you leaning towards now? I still can't decide and mostly because I have not had the chance to test drive the new GS or the new 5 series with the upgraded engine. It's going to be a tough decision!