I have a 2013 lexus es, what is this sealed transmission bull**** that the fluid is forever ,anybody to tell me if I should change and when ,how many miles before I do it ,the lexus dealer told me that I don't need and I can void my warranty if I do it. ??????????????????

 

I would go with your dealer's advice - it takes a while to get used to this but I believe it is almost 10 years now with this advice. Some owners still can't accept it and have changed fluid themselves but I understand it is not an easy task.

Dave Mac

 

>what is this sealed transmission bull****

Most every manufacture has adopted this policy and it's true that modern transmissions and tranny fluids are much longer lived now than in the past, but...

Nothing is forever, however manufactures don't want customers mucking with things while the cars are under warranty. After that all bets are off.

Do what you feel comfortable with. Realize that changing fluid yourself is a complex job now and best left in experienced hands (typically, after the fluid is drained, the engine temperature must be carefully measured while replacing the fluid to ensure that the correct amount it added, that's not easy to do in your garage..., point of fact - the tranny drain on my V8 Jaguar is 3" from an exhaust down pipe, fluid must be added after the engine reaches operating temperature, reaching around a 500 degree pipe to get to the hole can be "challenging"...).

Depending on the light/heavy duty use of your car I would suggest replacing the fluid between 60-90k miles.
=================================
My karma just ran over your dogma
Current Hers: '13 Lexus ES350
Current Mine: '08 Jaguar S-Type 4.2 "Satin Edition" (250.06 whp / 259.67 torque)

 

I'm one of those people that has been hard for me to accept a sealed transmission. I have asked my Lexus dealership numerous times to change the transmission fluid and they refused. They said it's not needed.

So basically, I'm not worrying about it and will just change it when they first recommend it - which is around 100k miles. That will hopefully keep me going to 200k miles. If you look at the previous generation of ES (2007-2012) - their transmission have been super reliable and high mileage with no tranny fluid changes.

 

personally, I would do it every 150k miles, or 10 years.
before that, no, -unless you're tracking the car/pulling a trailer.

Heat is still the enemy, even with synthetic fluids and micro filters it will allow wear over time...

 

I changed the oil in the pan and only at 27k it was very black and had some crud in it. I changed it because of other problems.

I would not go over 80k with it.

 

FWIW, I have a 2004 LS that was the first year for the sealed transmission with the synthetic fluid. I tried to get like 3 dealers to change the transmission fluid when I bought the car used. I checked the meticulous records and it had never been done. Basically the dealers all refused to do it.

Now it has close to 180k miles and no problems so far.

When you go to the LS430 forum, about the only time anyone ever has a problem was right after someone changed the fluid. It seemed it was difficult to do the procedure properly.

I really do think you can make a transmission with a lifetime fluid. If you get 200k miles on any transmission without issue, that's lifetime in my book. Also remember, when other brands of cars had transmissions with easily changed fluid, that didn't mean they never had problems. Honda/Acura had a HUGE problem with transmissions in the 2000s and it was simply a design defect.

I'm still not fully comfortable with the idea, but I'm in the camp where I plan to just go by what the manufacturer says and not change it. I would prefer if it was BOTH lifetime and easy to change if you want to change it, but for whatever reason, it seems to be one or the other.

 

I think by "Lifetime" it means one hundred and something thousand miles or something like that.

If you think there is something unique about this transmission or the oil used, I wouldn't believe it.

As a matter of fact, I believe Toyota WS ATF to be an inferior oil. I suspect it is not even synthetic. It has been nothing but problems from day one. Now that I switched to full synthetic - Amsoil signature ATF, all of these anomalous problems I have been having are gone. What problems - a loud whining sound from the transmission, hard shifts, premature downshifts, a 'clunk' feeling when going into drive/reverse/neutral from park. All those problems are gone. This is for a car with less that 27k miles. I believe the problems were due to a combination of the oil level and the quality of the oil itself.

 

My local Lexus service manager told me that it does not need changing and can do more harm than good. Respected the fact that he turned down my $$$$.

 

I would agree that speaks volumes. Convinced me not to touch it.

If a large amount of dealerships are willing to turn down easy money for something like a fluid change, they clearly have had issues that lead them to believe its going to cost them more money than they make.

 

I tow a trailer. I had the dealer flush my trans at 35k. It runs a pinch smoother. I changed the trans fluid on a highway driven Accord (6mt) and it showed signs of degraded fluid at 35k so I chose to do the ES as well at 35k. I negotiated with the service manager and we agreed on $300OTD for the complete flush, clean, and refill. Car is under warranty for 2 more years so I will let the dealer do what they need including using their own fluids.

It's a simple peace of mind and they gave me a loaner car while they did it sweetening the deal.

Of the last 10k miles on the car, ~4k are towing a trailer weighing about 700#. It has no problem towing a couple dirt bikes.

I listen to Cadillac Cowboy when I pull into the staging area to ride.

The life time fluid was a logistical move on Toyota...1) they don't have to pay environmental fees on the fluid as they did previously on non-lifetime fluid 2) they don't have to include it as a detailed service on those free maintenance packages 3) it reduces their overall cost of ownership helping them score points on the consumer reports. Lifetime according to lexus is 150k miles and after that is borrowed time for the vehicle.

IMHO I'd rather flush the fluid early on, and do drain and fills every 30K to keep mixing in some fresher fluid. Over 300,000 miles it will still be less than the cost of a new transmission. Towing a trailer adds to the heat and work on the trans along with summer time stop and go Bay Area traffic.

 

For me, it has always worked out well following the Lexus service recommendations, as long as the car is used in the 'typical' fashion it was intended for.

However, if you are towing a pop-up camper through the mountains in 120 degree heat, or taking your ES 350 to the local drag strip every Sunday, then it would make sense to relay that information to your service advisor. It's possible there are circumstances in which they may recommend/agree in decreasing the service interval. ( they may also recommend a different vehicle. lol )

I don't think it is unreasonable at all to be slightly flexible on service intervals, based on how the vehicle is used.

 

I personally think drain and fill every 30k miles is overkill.

In 40 years of driving I have never had a transmission issue and most of my cars end up high mileage vehicles (well, not so much the domestics, but that's a different story). I once had a 2000 lb trailer I towed with a Dodge 6 cylinder sedan...that car took a beating, but still the tranny was fine. A 700 lb trailer on a Lexus ES? Cakewalk.

I do maybe one fluid flush per car at around the 80,000 to 120,000 mile mark.

 

Not having a transmission problem, while pulling a 2000lb trailer with a 6 cylinder sedan, is a more a tribute to your driving skills ... than it is a reality for most people. Many hills in your area? Theoretically, someone could ease onto a flat highway, and gently cruise to a relatively benign destination, without causing damage.

In the scenario I mentioned, pulling through the mountains in 120 degrees, trust me, will shorten the life of the transmission for most people, and require shorter service intervals.

 

I should just take that complement and run with it.

Thinking back, I now remember I did have an aftermarket transmission cooler added to the car. Also had one of those trailer camper brakes installed. I drove that Dodge Spitrit and that camper straight across Canada from Southern Ontario to the Pacific Ocean..we were moving to the west coast at the time. I must have been crazy, but money was tight in those years. I had to constantly guard against overheating because some of the drive was in 90F and above. It was a lot of fun putting the heater on full blast to drain heat from the engine. The camper was bigger than the car, so I got a lot of stares on the highway.

Later on I had a Crown Vic, so it could handle the trailer but the suspension was terrible. Had to put in special shocks.

In my neck of the woods we don't have 120F temps, so I can see your concerns.