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X3 may look small but inside it's actually a bit more spacious than X5. The quality is a step below though.
Yeah I've driven both an xDrive 30i and an M40i. The amount of space is fantastic inside. And the M40i model I was in was properly fancy inside - not top-tier, but every bit as nice as a Macan, including some carbon fiber!
Originally Posted by 1111GS
I'm having a hard time trying to make sense of this. You had M Performance, GTS, Turbos... but you praise the rx350's V6? 7.7, isn't it? But I get it. You value other things more, like inexpensive tires and regular gas. That pick up/drop off thing is common among these brands. But why would one want to let someone else drive his car? I don't even let them valet my car letting alone having some kids having fun in my car. But I get it. Your time is very valuable. Keep posting.
Honestly, the Lexus models I would consider owning do not include the NX and RX. The V-6 seems a bit better-suited to cars like my IS, the ES, etc. but from the RXes I've driven, seems just okay. It is smooth and responsive. However, it doesn't feel as eager and effortless as the B46 in the X3 30i models, and certainly not as strong as the B58 in the X5. The trans tuning also leaves a bit to be desired when compared with the ZF unit in the X5/X3 as well. It's not bad, but it's just not as sharp as the ZF, and gear hunts a lot more.
To be honest, an RX would be all right as a pure commuter or road trip car, but for that purpose I'd much rather have an ES, as it seems a little quieter and more refined, while feeling more powerful due to the lighter weight of the vehicle. Especially if we factor in the new RX, where SG's latest video on the RX 350 seems to bemoan the migration to the new T24A-FTS.
We've owned both BMW and Lexus SUV's, and while yes it is arguable that the BMW X5 is superior to our RX in alot of ways, in an everyday usage perspective, those superiorities don't matter to us. Nothing that the BMW does better makes that big of a difference when I'm dropping off my kids at school or am trudging around town doing errands. We prefer to spend less on the RX (it still uses regular gas vs premium) and it had a lower purchase price too. In the end, the RX and X5 are both really nice cars, and for our purposes, spending less money makes more sense. With that said, we decided on a Tesla Model Y for our next car (which will finally arrive in 2 weeks!) so what do I know lol.
LOL Every German Car topic brings out the exact same responses on every single car non German car forum. "My Husbands, Cousins, Best Friend had a BMW and out of warranty it was junk etc. I've never met one person with a Modern German car that had anymore issues than any other brand. Maintenance is slightly more expensive but that has nothing to do with reliability. Two of the most unreliable cars I've ever had were Japanese. One a 1995 Accord (Lemon Lawed) and the other a 2017 Infiniti Q50 Red Sport. Absolute Pieces of *****, like with anything it's the luck of the draw with cars. Some are bad others aren't.
I owned a maxima; I replaced everything other than the engine on it and still was a money pit. briefly owned a s4 also a headache.. but end of the day your Japanese cars are more dependable than the germans. (backed by data) its not just some luck of draw. you will have more probability (again backed by data) of running into issues with BMW than lets say Lexus.
Originally Posted by Kense
LOL Every German Car topic brings out the exact same responses on every single car non German car forum. "My Husbands, Cousins, Best Friend had a BMW and out of warranty it was junk etc. I've never met one person with a Modern German car that had anymore issues than any other brand. Maintenance is slightly more expensive but that has nothing to do with reliability. Two of the most unreliable cars I've ever had were Japanese. One a 1995 Accord (Lemon Lawed) and the other a 2017 Infiniti Q50 Red Sport. Absolute Pieces of *****, like with anything it's the luck of the draw with cars. Some are bad others aren't.
The idea that Japanese car brands are all reliable has been dead for years if not a decade, it's really only Toyota/Lexus. Nissan can't even be considered a Japanese brand when they're half-owned by Renault.
The idea that Japanese car brands are all reliable has been dead for years if not a decade, it's really only Toyota/Lexus. Nissan can't even be considered a Japanese brand when they're half-owned by Renault.
I'm actually very surprised Porsche is so high up on the list, just below Lexus. Who would have known....
Wow just away a few days and this thread went to this many pages. Great start, Bit! So many great responses. I'm sure by now you're sold for one way or the other!
X3 may look small but inside it's actually a bit more spacious than X5. The quality is a step below though.
I can certainly see how some could see that way until s/he tries something else and the below answer is dead on.
All one needs to do is drive them themselves. But many don't and just stick to their opinions. Even with the new rx500h, from the numbers and reviews, there is still no contest. The below post is dead on.
Let's turn the question around. How many Lexus have you owned? I think Steve (and others) had gone through more Lexus than you have over Germans. I'm curious what exact years and models you had. IMO unreliability is getting old, unless someone wants to buy a car and keeps it to 100k. I'm quite active on X5's forums, 2019+, and have never heard about leaking oil on an X5. My wife had three RX's and I, not an enthusiast, found all the excuses to not drive hers. I only drove when the cars were due for service. I'm glad it worked out for you but I think the below post is dead on.
I'm having a hard time trying to make sense of this. You had M Performance, GTS, Turbos... but you praise the rx350's V6? 7.7, isn't it? But I get it. You value other things more, like inexpensive tires and regular gas. That pick up/drop off thing is common among these brands. But why would one want to let someone else drive his car? I don't even let them valet my car letting alone having some kids having fun in my car. But I get it. Your time is very valuable. Keep posting.
2002 IS 300, 2002 RX 350, 2011 GX, 2014 ES 350, 2015 RC F, 2015 NX, 2018 LX, 2019 RX 450hl, 2020 GSF, 2020 LC 500, 2022 RX probably forgetting one. Technically Steve doesn't own any cars currently. Pretty sure I just didn't imagine the issues I just had. Let's be serious, we are buying our last ice vehicles. That V6 in the RX will outlast most everything else. Many many Lexus V6's have 200,000-300,000 miles with little maintenance. That RX will still be going no problem in 10 years. That's why I bought it. Purchased, not leased for a short period. We haven't been keeping vehicles very long, but this RX was purchased with the intent to keep it. I wanted long term reliability after the issues I just had. I wanted a Lexus naturally aspirated v6. I see first gen RX's regularly still on the road. If there is something more reliable and will last longer point me to it.
Last edited by Sodbuster1; Nov 14, 2022 at 12:07 PM.
I'm actually very surprised Porsche is so high up on the list, just below Lexus. Who would have known....
Indeed , as the attention to detail that Porsche has is similar to Toyota and how they built the Supra vs BMW approach for the Z4 . The minor details such as the strength of bolts and other components etc …
We've owned both BMW and Lexus SUV's, and while yes it is arguable that the BMW X5 is superior to our RX in alot of ways, in an everyday usage perspective, those superiorities don't matter to us. Nothing that the BMW does better makes that big of a difference when I'm dropping off my kids at school or am trudging around town doing errands. We prefer to spend less on the RX (it still uses regular gas vs premium) and it had a lower purchase price too. In the end, the RX and X5 are both really nice cars, and for our purposes, spending less money makes more sense. With that said, we decided on a Tesla Model Y for our next car (which will finally arrive in 2 weeks!) so what do I know lol.
Nice! Yeah I agree, as a daily, it is perfectly great. It's super comfortable and usable, and quiet. The regular gas is actually a big deal when premium typically runs over 50 cents more per gallon. That'll add up quickly.
Indeed , as the attention to detail that Porsche has is similar to Toyota and how they built the Supra vs BMW approach for the Z4 . The minor details such as the strength of bolts and other components etc …
I knew they were reliable, but I didn't know they were that high up on the chain. My friend bought an 88 930 Turbo in 1997 and had it until 2020, so I know they are built really well
Porsche is indeed very solid. Even 10-15 years old provided of the model in question has a major flaw that has been fixed (like the IMS bearing or cam gear screw or coolant crossover) they generally never have any issues.
The only "issue" is parts are exclusively Porsche on high end ones with no ability to reach into the reduced price VW parts bins.
Yeah I've driven both an xDrive 30i and an M40i. The amount of space is fantastic inside. And the M40i model I was in was properly fancy inside - not top-tier, but every bit as nice as a Macan, including some carbon fiber!
Honestly, the Lexus models I would consider owning do not include the NX and RX. The V-6 seems a bit better-suited to cars like my IS, the ES, etc. but from the RXes I've driven, seems just okay. It is smooth and responsive. However, it doesn't feel as eager and effortless as the B46 in the X3 30i models, and certainly not as strong as the B58 in the X5. The trans tuning also leaves a bit to be desired when compared with the ZF unit in the X5/X3 as well. It's not bad, but it's just not as sharp as the ZF, and gear hunts a lot more.
To be honest, an RX would be all right as a pure commuter or road trip car, but for that purpose I'd much rather have an ES, as it seems a little quieter and more refined, while feeling more powerful due to the lighter weight of the vehicle. Especially if we factor in the new RX, where SG's latest video on the RX 350 seems to bemoan the migration to the new T24A-FTS.
RX itself is a fine vehicle. But comparing it to a wrong choice of SUV is lame. As you mentioned, the smaller I4 engine on the 30i moves the X3 to 60mph in 6.4s. The X3 I had was an individual model. It was nice but I guess just too much plastic.
Originally Posted by jwong77
We've owned both BMW and Lexus SUV's, and while yes it is arguable that the BMW X5 is superior to our RX in alot of ways, in an everyday usage perspective, those superiorities don't matter to us. Nothing that the BMW does better makes that big of a difference when I'm dropping off my kids at school or am trudging around town doing errands. We prefer to spend less on the RX (it still uses regular gas vs premium) and it had a lower purchase price too. In the end, the RX and X5 are both really nice cars, and for our purposes, spending less money makes more sense. With that said, we decided on a Tesla Model Y for our next car (which will finally arrive in 2 weeks!) so what do I know lol.
May I ask which year/model your BMW was? I see you have a 2020 RX. Maybe your thoughts about the X5 are dated? Not trying to back the X5 but we need to look at apple to apple to compare.
Originally Posted by Kense
LOL Every German Car topic brings out the exact same responses on every single car non German car forum. "My Husbands, Cousins, Best Friend had a BMW and out of warranty it was junk etc. I've never met one person with a Modern German car that had anymore issues than any other brand. Maintenance is slightly more expensive but that has nothing to do with reliability. Two of the most unreliable cars I've ever had were Japanese. One a 1995 Accord (Lemon Lawed) and the other a 2017 Infiniti Q50 Red Sport. Absolute Pieces of *****, like with anything it's the luck of the draw with cars. Some are bad others aren't.
Lol. I was one of those because someone in my family got stranded on freeway with her brand new BMW. It was around 2000 I think but it seemed to stick in my mind for decades. Maintenance can be expensive but in the past both Lexus and BMW included free maintenance. So it became irrelevant. Lexus long term reliability certainly has an advantage for some but the number of owners keeping their cars long has become significantly less.
Originally Posted by Sodbuster1
2002 IS 300, 2002 RX 350, 2011 GX, 2014 ES 350, 2015 RC F, 2015 NX, 2018 LX, 2019 RX 450hl, 2020 GSF, 2020 LC 500, 2022 RX probably forgetting one. Technically Steve doesn't own any cars currently. Pretty sure I just didn't imagine the issues I just had. Let's be serious, we are buying our last ice vehicles. That V6 in the RX will outlast most everything else. Many many Lexus V6's have 200,000-300,000 miles with little maintenance. That RX will still be going no problem in 10 years. That's why I bought it. Purchased, not leased for a short period. We haven't been keeping vehicles very long, but this RX was purchased with the intent to keep it.
Wow with your post count and join date I totally didn't expect to see this many Lexus vehicles. You sounded like you had been a long time German guy and got disappointed and then switched back to Lexus. With all these cars, you came down to rx350's V6. And now we're talking about 200,000-300,000 miles. If that's the case, rx is a winner by a large margin. Lol.
RX itself is a fine vehicle. But comparing it to a wrong choice of SUV is lame. As you mentioned, the smaller I4 engine on the 30i moves the X3 to 60mph in 6.4s. The X3 I had was an individual model. It was nice but I guess just too much plastic.
May I ask which year/model your BMW was? I see you have a 2020 RX. Maybe your thoughts about the X5 are dated? Not trying to back the X5 but we need to look at apple to apple to compare.
Lol. I was one of those because someone in my family got stranded on freeway with her brand new BMW. It was around 2000 I think but it seemed to stick in my mind for decades. Maintenance can be expensive but in the past both Lexus and BMW included free maintenance. So it became irrelevant. Lexus long term reliability certainly has an advantage for some but the number of owners keeping their cars long has become significantly less.
Wow with your post count and join date I totally didn't expect to see this many Lexus vehicles. You sounded like you had been a long time German guy and got disappointed and then switched back to Lexus. With all these cars, you came down to rx350's V6. And now we're talking about 200,000-300,000 miles. If that's the case, rx is a winner by a large margin. Lol.
Well, the RX may not be alone long. But I kind of am enjoying having only one vehicle at the moment. I work from home and the only driving I do is for pleasure or to take family to Doctor's appointments. My heart wants a IS 500, but my head knows I really don't need it. I do regret trading the 20 GS F for the 992. I wish I still had it, though I wish it had 360 camera...Carplay. That 5.0 V8 is another engine that will really last for a "performance" car. So it's tempting to get another vehicle with it. I've also enjoyed being incognito in the RX. No one is trying to challenge me to races or wanting me to pull over to look at the car...LOL. I find am more relaxed and drive better.
Last edited by Sodbuster1; Nov 14, 2022 at 12:59 PM.
RX itself is a fine vehicle. But comparing it to a wrong choice of SUV is lame.
Key word in my post was "I". I personally understand the RX and its appeal, but it wouldn't be at the top of my list. Again, "I", as others are free to disagree with me. I have driven the RX more than the X3 or X5, to be fair. It's just funny, the same kind of refinement I've experienced in cars like the IS and RC models I've driven is present in the BMW X3, but not in the RX, NX, or ES.
You sounded like you had been a long time German guy and got disappointed and then switched back to Lexus.