Notices
Car Chat General discussion about Lexus, other auto manufacturers and automotive news.
Sponsored by:
Sponsored by: Innova

chip shortage

Thread Tools
 
Search this Thread
 
Old Sep 21, 2021 | 08:49 AM
  #16  
mmarshall's Avatar
mmarshall
Lexus Fanatic
Community Builder
Community Influencer
Liked
Loved
 
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 94,223
Likes: 221
From: Virginia/D.C. suburbs
Default

Originally Posted by Och
A carburetor works fine and don't need no stinkin chips.
The industry tried electronic carburetor-chokes in the 1980s, and they were even worse LOL.

However, Hameed has at least somewhat of a point. Carbs may work fine for lawn-mowers and gas tools, but the auto industry switched to EFI for good reason. Carbs just weren't cutting it on most vehicles. In fact, IMO, the switch to EFI should have been made in the 70s rather than the late 1980s.....much of the technology was available back then.
Reply
Old Sep 21, 2021 | 08:52 AM
  #17  
mmarshall's Avatar
mmarshall
Lexus Fanatic
Community Builder
Community Influencer
Liked
Loved
 
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 94,223
Likes: 221
From: Virginia/D.C. suburbs
Default

Originally Posted by bitkahuna

one thing we know is elon musk is demanding and creative... i doubt he'd blame a chip shortage for his spaceships (granted much lower production volume!) - i just have a sense he's going to outflank other traditional makers who are moribund and stuck with huge complex supply chains.
........and, if Musk is so brilliant, why can't he develop a system for Tesla to produce its own chips?
Reply
Old Sep 21, 2021 | 08:55 AM
  #18  
LeX2K's Avatar
LeX2K
Lexus Fanatic
15 Year Member
Liked
Loved
Community Favorite
 
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 25,917
Likes: 4,274
From: Alberta
Default

Originally Posted by mmarshall
........and, if Musk is so brilliant, why can't he develop a system for Tesla to produce its own chips?
System? You mean build a factory costing $150 billion? If Tesla tried that you'd be the first to say Tesla is going bankrupt wasting money on a factory.
Reply
Old Sep 21, 2021 | 08:55 AM
  #19  
Benoit's Avatar
Benoit
Advanced
 
Joined: May 2018
Posts: 605
Likes: 42
From: Switzerland
Default

We are building castles in spain there guys.
It's impossible to say. They are so many factors to consider.
But I strongly believe, and it's a belief, not necessarly a thing that will come ; that cars using less ressources, built much more simply and with less electronic, will have a great time, at least during a certain time period of our future.
Reply
Old Sep 21, 2021 | 09:44 AM
  #20  
Striker223's Avatar
Striker223
Lexus Champion
5 Year Member
Liked
Loved
Community Favorite
 
Joined: Oct 2019
Posts: 17,914
Likes: 1,702
From: Ohio
Default

Originally Posted by bitkahuna
just wondering why, if it's over a year out, why can't car companies design new or repurpose other chips to do what they need? i get that cost is an issue, but heck, apple and google can bring out new phones every year with new custom chips. why do car companies have to just say 'oh well, we'll wait over a year to get the same old chips we've been using for years'... there's got to be some degree of workarounds.

one thing we know is elon musk is demanding and creative... i doubt he'd blame a chip shortage for his spaceships (granted much lower production volume!) - i just have a sense he's going to outflank other traditional makers who are moribund and stuck with huge complex supply chains.
Its because there are only a few actual fabs in the world, Intel, TSMC (the huge one), and a few others I believe like Ti and IBM unless they also have closed and moved production to TSMC.

You cant just produce even something considered "outdated/primitive" like a 45nm chip anywhere. Even something as old as that is extremely complex to produce at all yet alone at acceptable yield rates.
Reply
Old Sep 21, 2021 | 10:19 AM
  #21  
EZZ's Avatar
EZZ
Lexus Test Driver
 
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 7,460
Likes: 232
From: CA
Default

Originally Posted by Striker223
Its because there are only a few actual fabs in the world, Intel, TSMC (the huge one), and a few others I believe like Ti and IBM unless they also have closed and moved production to TSMC.

You cant just produce even something considered "outdated/primitive" like a 45nm chip anywhere. Even something as old as that is extremely complex to produce at all yet alone at acceptable yield rates.
The issue is that other large fabs that do produce on older nodes are also in China like SMIC. Ti is mostly analog chips so they produce their own designs and aren't digital chips like TSMC makes and IBM divested their fabs which became Global Foundries which is a 2nd tier fab. The Other humongous fab besides TSMC is now Samsung but they produce mostly for the worlds consumer electronics like smartphones. Smartphone chips are way more profitable too so understandable that auto chips play second fiddle.
Reply
Old Sep 21, 2021 | 12:42 PM
  #22  
Och's Avatar
Och
Lexus Champion
20 Year Member
Photogenic
Photoriffic
Shutterbug
iTrader: (3)
 
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 16,831
Likes: 142
From: NY
Default

There are far more shortages than just chips, lol. There are crazy shortages of car and truck parts, things are going to get crazy.
Reply
Old Sep 21, 2021 | 12:51 PM
  #23  
tex2670's Avatar
tex2670
Lexus Champion
Photogenic
Photoriffic
Community Builder
Liked
 
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 11,001
Likes: 85
From: Southeastern PA
Default

Originally Posted by mmarshall
........and, if Musk is so brilliant, why can't he develop a system for Tesla to produce its own chips?
Because you can't snap your fingers and start mass production of computer chips. Even if he could do this, by the time he could implement this, the shortage will be over.
Reply
Old Sep 21, 2021 | 12:54 PM
  #24  
Toys4RJill's Avatar
Toys4RJill
Lexus Fanatic
10 Year Member
Community Builder
Active Streak: 30 Days
Liked
 
Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 35,285
Likes: 310
From: ON/NY
Default

Originally Posted by Och
There are far more shortages than just chips, lol. There are crazy shortages of car and truck parts, things are going to get crazy.
I can't remember who it was. Maybe it was you. There was talk about the over reliance on China and it was more specific to electric vehicles....but yeah, at the mercy of Asia.
Reply
Old Sep 21, 2021 | 12:57 PM
  #25  
mmarshall's Avatar
mmarshall
Lexus Fanatic
Community Builder
Community Influencer
Liked
Loved
 
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 94,223
Likes: 221
From: Virginia/D.C. suburbs
Default

Originally Posted by LeX2K
System? You mean build a factory costing $150 billion? If Tesla tried that you'd be the first to say Tesla is going bankrupt wasting money on a factory.
Well, you, not me, are the one trying to convince us that he is so brilliant. Make up your mind.
Reply
Old Sep 21, 2021 | 01:01 PM
  #26  
EZZ's Avatar
EZZ
Lexus Test Driver
 
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 7,460
Likes: 232
From: CA
Default

Originally Posted by mmarshall
Well, you, not me, are the one trying to convince us that he is so brilliant. Make up your mind.
Fine...you win. Elon is completely stupid for not predicting a chip shortage and not inventing technology that can circumvent the the modern integrated circuit. His genius credentials are now officially revoked
Reply
Old Sep 21, 2021 | 01:06 PM
  #27  
Hameed's Avatar
Hameed
EV ftw!!!
20 Year Member
Liked
Loved
Community Favorite
 
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 8,972
Likes: 563
From: Lake Ontario
Default

Originally Posted by EZZ
Fine...you win. Elon is completely stupid for not predicting a chip shortage and not inventing technology that can circumvent the the modern integrated circuit. His genius credentials are now officially revoked
You forgot his stupid SpaceX accomplishments. 🙂
Reply
Old Sep 21, 2021 | 01:37 PM
  #28  
tex2670's Avatar
tex2670
Lexus Champion
Photogenic
Photoriffic
Community Builder
Liked
 
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 11,001
Likes: 85
From: Southeastern PA
Default

Originally Posted by mmarshall
Well, you, not me, are the one trying to convince us that he is so brilliant. Make up your mind.
This has nothing to do with brilliance. Or maybe his brilliance is what keeps him from doing something unwise. There's a good reason all automakers rely on lots of different parts suppliers instead of produce all car components, and that reason isn't about being not smart.
Reply
Old Sep 21, 2021 | 01:51 PM
  #29  
LeX2K's Avatar
LeX2K
Lexus Fanatic
15 Year Member
Liked
Loved
Community Favorite
 
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 25,917
Likes: 4,274
From: Alberta
Default

Originally Posted by mmarshall
Well, you, not me, are the one trying to convince us that he is so brilliant. Make up your mind.
I would never attempt to make you change your mind about Elon Musk your views on him and his companies is crystal clear.
Reply
Old Sep 21, 2021 | 02:08 PM
  #30  
Och's Avatar
Och
Lexus Champion
20 Year Member
Photogenic
Photoriffic
Shutterbug
iTrader: (3)
 
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 16,831
Likes: 142
From: NY
Default

You can't even buy a lot of home appliances anymore. The whole manufacturing and distribution chain has been disrupted.

As much as I don't like some of Elons tactics, I won't be surprised if he pull off building a US based chip fab plant. Surely, he won't have a shortage of investors.
Reply



All times are GMT -7. The time now is 02:18 PM.